High volume fuel rail needed for E85?
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Apr 2, 2008, 06:08 PM
#17
Hard be believe that at least a larger diameter fuel rail is not needed. I went down to my lab about an hour ago, and watched what 4 liter / min (four 1000 cc/min injectors operating at 100% IDC) of water flow looks like coming out of a 0.128" ID hose. Its a crapload of water. There has to be some pressure drop across the stock rail under those conditions.
May 12, 2008, 09:36 PM
#21
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mrfred - Buschur posted a thread a while back, i think it was titled "everything you need for your evo fuel system" or something like that.
Basically he said that he has run cars up to 600HP or more on stock rails, and lines. Only pump and injectors were changed. For example he has cars that are running 1600cc injectors and his double pumper fuel pumps that are still on stock rails, lines, and regulator.
I can't say for sure that there is no pressure drop but I can say that there are many people who use a lot more fuel than 1000cc injectors maxxed out who are still doing fine with stock rail, lines, regulator.
Found the thread --
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...highlight=fuel
Basically he said that he has run cars up to 600HP or more on stock rails, and lines. Only pump and injectors were changed. For example he has cars that are running 1600cc injectors and his double pumper fuel pumps that are still on stock rails, lines, and regulator.
I can't say for sure that there is no pressure drop but I can say that there are many people who use a lot more fuel than 1000cc injectors maxxed out who are still doing fine with stock rail, lines, regulator.
Found the thread --
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...highlight=fuel
Last edited by dudical26; May 12, 2008 at 09:40 PM.
May 13, 2008, 08:44 AM
#22
Yeah, I ran across that thread a week-ish ago when I was looking for something else. Amazing that the stock fue lines and rail are good for 600 whp. One of the most relevant comments to E85 was:
That injector size and duty cycle percentage are about what I'm expecting for my E85 setup. So it seems that E85 does get pretty close to the limit. Anyhow, I've already got a Perrin fuel rail, so I might as well use it. :-) And it will make it a bit easier to install a fuel pressure sensor.
The duty cycles of course went up a little, no problem. Then I decided to put the stock regulator on and see if I could still get by. No problem. The car was now making 590 whp (up from 542 when it ran 9.97) on 1,000 cc injectors, stock fuel rail, stock fuel lines, stock fuel pressure regulator!! The duty cycles were 84%. That's freaking great!
May 19, 2008, 06:26 PM
#27
I have a GT35R spiking to 31psi falling to 29psi and I see around 90% duty cycle on 1150cc injectors with a 255 walbro in tank pump and an inline 392 walbro pump. This is with an aeromotive FPR running a base of 45psi and stock fuel rail. The only places I used steel braided lines for was to go from where the stock line hits the engine bay to the inline pump and from the inline pump to the stock fuel rail as well as from the other side of the fuel rail to the FPR. I used -6 line. The return lines are just plain rubber fuel lines, since they don't see much pressure anyways.
Couldn't tell you if there is a pressure drop in the fuel rail. I run 11.50ish A/F ratio WOT.
Couldn't tell you if there is a pressure drop in the fuel rail. I run 11.50ish A/F ratio WOT.
May 19, 2008, 07:06 PM
#28
I have a GT35R spiking to 31psi falling to 29psi and I see around 90% duty cycle on 1150cc injectors with a 255 walbro in tank pump and an inline 392 walbro pump. This is with an aeromotive FPR running a base of 45psi and stock fuel rail. The only places I used steel braided lines for was to go from where the stock line hits the engine bay to the inline pump and from the inline pump to the stock fuel rail as well as from the other side of the fuel rail to the FPR. I used -6 line. The return lines are just plain rubber fuel lines, since they don't see much pressure anyways.
Couldn't tell you if there is a pressure drop in the fuel rail. I run 11.50ish A/F ratio WOT.
Couldn't tell you if there is a pressure drop in the fuel rail. I run 11.50ish A/F ratio WOT.
May 19, 2008, 08:24 PM
#30
E85 of course, I am in the alternate fuel forum 
I use gasoline AF ratios not ethanol, else I would be in the 9s I believe. AEM does either.
I am starting to crank the timing up. Started at 10 now at 15 degrees. We will see how much this E85 can take. I have heard it likes timing.
Update: They might have switched from E70 to E85 because my A/Fs went from 11.5-11.7 to around 12.3-12.6 now @ 94% duty cycle with 15.7 degrees of timing and 30psi. I might crank my base fuel pressure from 45 to 50psi to give me a little more head room.
I use gasoline AF ratios not ethanol, else I would be in the 9s I believe. AEM does either.I am starting to crank the timing up. Started at 10 now at 15 degrees. We will see how much this E85 can take. I have heard it likes timing.
Update: They might have switched from E70 to E85 because my A/Fs went from 11.5-11.7 to around 12.3-12.6 now @ 94% duty cycle with 15.7 degrees of timing and 30psi. I might crank my base fuel pressure from 45 to 50psi to give me a little more head room.
Last edited by fre; May 21, 2008 at 08:44 PM.