91 VS 100 Octane Tune
Dec 28, 2006, 09:20 AM
#4
91 octane map:
AFR set @ 11-10.8:1
Timing pulled in the mid to top range to reduce knock
Boost upped from 20.3 stock to 22
100 octane map
AFR set @ 11.3-11.5:1
Timing set to stock which is pretty aggressive to begin with
Boost upped to 24 psi
Dec 28, 2006, 09:46 AM
#6
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I will tell you the differences on my car between the 91 octane map and the 100 octane map:
91 octane map:
AFR set @ 11-10.8:1
Timing pulled in the mid to top range to reduce knock
Boost upped from 20.3 stock to 22
100 octane map
AFR set @ 11.3-11.5:1
Timing set to stock which is pretty aggressive to begin with
Boost upped to 24 psi
91 octane map:
AFR set @ 11-10.8:1
Timing pulled in the mid to top range to reduce knock
Boost upped from 20.3 stock to 22
100 octane map
AFR set @ 11.3-11.5:1
Timing set to stock which is pretty aggressive to begin with
Boost upped to 24 psi
93 octane map:
AFR set @11.5:1
Timing set to 8 degrees of advance after peak torque and increasing
Boost set to 22psi and tapering down to 20.
I get 1-3 counts of knock sometimes.
If I had 100 Octane, I'd probably try upping the boost to 28 psi...and seeing how timing feels. I think I'd be able to get another 40-50 whp out of it.
Dec 28, 2006, 10:55 AM
#7
Interesting.
93 octane map:
AFR set @11.5:1
Timing set to 8 degrees of advance after peak torque and increasing
Boost set to 22psi and tapering down to 20.
I get 1-3 counts of knock sometimes.
If I had 100 Octane, I'd probably try upping the boost to 28 psi...and seeing how timing feels. I think I'd be able to get another 40-50 whp out of it.
93 octane map:
AFR set @11.5:1
Timing set to 8 degrees of advance after peak torque and increasing
Boost set to 22psi and tapering down to 20.
I get 1-3 counts of knock sometimes.
If I had 100 Octane, I'd probably try upping the boost to 28 psi...and seeing how timing feels. I think I'd be able to get another 40-50 whp out of it.
1. Your Evo 9 is more knock resistant than my Evo 8. The cylinder head design has better cooling on the 9 and this helps knock suppression.
2. Your Evo 9 runs less aggressive timing stock than my Evo 8. My Evo 8 has a max stock timing @ 7k to cutoof of 21-23 degrees. Your Evo 9 has stock timing of 15-17 in the same rpm range.
3. My 100 octane map is designed for hotlapping the Evo on a road course. It is designed to allow the Evo to run 20-30 min sustained high rpm sessions. It is a conservative map and I know that. It is NOT a drag racing map.
4. The stock 9 I logged runs 6* avg timing in the 4k rpm range; 9* avg timing in the 5k rpm range; 14* avg timing in the 6k rpm range; 16-17* avg in the 7-7.5K rpm range. So how far did you advance timing above these in the above rpm ranges?
5. I still have to boost cut on my Evo and I intend to keep it. Boost cut on the 05 Evo 8 hits above 24 psi.
6. Your dyno numbers are 300 whp which is no different than any other 9 that has ONLY a tune. My Evo also puts down about 300 whp on 91 octane no less on a dynojet with a TBE (hfc cat). Your car with a TBE would probably put down 330 whp on a dynojet. I do not know how the dyno you used compares to a dynojet, though.
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Dec 28, 2006, 01:26 PM
#8
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A few things to note:
1. Your Evo 9 is more knock resistant than my Evo 8. The cylinder head design has better cooling on the 9 and this helps knock suppression.
2. Your Evo 9 runs less aggressive timing stock than my Evo 8. My Evo 8 has a max stock timing @ 7k to cutoof of 21-23 degrees. Your Evo 9 has stock timing of 15-17 in the same rpm range.
3. My 100 octane map is designed for hotlapping the Evo on a road course. It is designed to allow the Evo to run 20-30 min sustained high rpm sessions. It is a conservative map and I know that. It is NOT a drag racing map.
4. The stock 9 I logged runs 6* avg timing in the 4k rpm range; 9* avg timing in the 5k rpm range; 14* avg timing in the 6k rpm range; 16-17* avg in the 7-7.5K rpm range. So how far did you advance timing above these in the above rpm ranges?
5. I still have to boost cut on my Evo and I intend to keep it. Boost cut on the 05 Evo 8 hits above 24 psi.
6. Your dyno numbers are 300 whp which is no different than any other 9 that has ONLY a tune. My Evo also puts down about 300 whp on 91 octane no less on a dynojet with a TBE (hfc cat). Your car with a TBE would probably put down 330 whp on a dynojet. I do not know how the dyno you used compares to a dynojet, though.
1. Your Evo 9 is more knock resistant than my Evo 8. The cylinder head design has better cooling on the 9 and this helps knock suppression.
2. Your Evo 9 runs less aggressive timing stock than my Evo 8. My Evo 8 has a max stock timing @ 7k to cutoof of 21-23 degrees. Your Evo 9 has stock timing of 15-17 in the same rpm range.
3. My 100 octane map is designed for hotlapping the Evo on a road course. It is designed to allow the Evo to run 20-30 min sustained high rpm sessions. It is a conservative map and I know that. It is NOT a drag racing map.
4. The stock 9 I logged runs 6* avg timing in the 4k rpm range; 9* avg timing in the 5k rpm range; 14* avg timing in the 6k rpm range; 16-17* avg in the 7-7.5K rpm range. So how far did you advance timing above these in the above rpm ranges?
5. I still have to boost cut on my Evo and I intend to keep it. Boost cut on the 05 Evo 8 hits above 24 psi.
6. Your dyno numbers are 300 whp which is no different than any other 9 that has ONLY a tune. My Evo also puts down about 300 whp on 91 octane no less on a dynojet with a TBE (hfc cat). Your car with a TBE would probably put down 330 whp on a dynojet. I do not know how the dyno you used compares to a dynojet, though.
Interesting.
I'm just starting out on this car.
I really have never researched the 8 and didn't realize there was much of a difference other than Mivec.
As far as your point #4. To be honest, I'm not sure whether the ecuflash map is actual timing or simply advance/retard of the factory base timing map. Sounds stupid but it really doesn't matter to me so long as I don't knock. When I speak of advance, I'm simply talking about the values I'd be entering into the map. The ignition map that I am running is significantly different than the factory map.
Here is my stock timing map
Here is my modified map
As far as my dyno goes...I didn't post it to brag about my tuning. I'm definitely still learning. I posted because I was quite impressed the the car and the lack of expensive mods. I made 300awhp with $110 in mods...a $90 cable and a $140 wideband. That's insanely cheap to me.
The dyno I was on typically runs 10% below what other dyno's put down. But that really doesn't matter much to me.
My goal for this car is not really to modify it much at all...but simply to tune it as much as possible. My other car is the one that I modify. This is my daily driver. I don't think I'm going to get a turboback exhaust. I need to drive this thing quietly. Perhaps a downpipe, but I doubt I'd get a catback.
I appreciate your response. Well worded and organized.
I didn't know any of the difference you pointed out between the 8 and 9.
Dec 28, 2006, 05:49 PM
#11
I thought you didn't like block tuning? 
Also, IMHO, having map 1 set like map 2 is asking for trouble.
FYI, on 91 octane, most evo 9's do not like over 12 degrees or so up top.These are 9's with tuned mivec , timing and fuel maps and making 285-295whp on a Mustang dyno that reads like Buschurs.
Also, IMHO, having map 1 set like map 2 is asking for trouble. FYI, on 91 octane, most evo 9's do not like over 12 degrees or so up top.These are 9's with tuned mivec , timing and fuel maps and making 285-295whp on a Mustang dyno that reads like Buschurs.
Last edited by razorlab; Dec 28, 2006 at 05:52 PM.
Dec 28, 2006, 05:53 PM
#12
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I thought you didn't like block tuning? Also, IMHO, having map 1 set like map 2 is asking for trouble.
FYI, on 91 octane, most evo 9's do not like over 12 degrees or so up top.These are 9's with tuned mivec , timing and fuel maps and making 285-295whp on a Mustang dyno that reads like Buschurs.
Also, IMHO, having map 1 set like map 2 is asking for trouble. FYI, on 91 octane, most evo 9's do not like over 12 degrees or so up top.These are 9's with tuned mivec , timing and fuel maps and making 285-295whp on a Mustang dyno that reads like Buschurs.
Hehe. I consider timing different than fuel.
I've had issues with this car and its knock sensors and it makes sense to me that drastic changes in timing can be picked up as knock.
I don't do that with fuel.
I'll post my fuel map. I'm always up for some criticism and some larnin'
Dec 28, 2006, 05:58 PM
#13
308 Hp and 327 TQ MD Pump
372 AWHP 389 AWTQ pure 100 octane mustang dyno
That was on a mail- in from Dynoflash base on 91oct. I seen the dyno numbers and I also seen him running at the local track.
I am not discrediting you but I am showing you guys real facts from real people from this forum.
here is the link:
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=236458
Carlos
Last edited by fromWRXtoEVO; Dec 28, 2006 at 06:05 PM.
Dec 28, 2006, 06:01 PM
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Stupid question.
When I look at my timing map...is that actual timing? Absolute timing the car is running?
Or is that map an adjustment map of sorts....so if I have a value of '5' in a cell, I am advance 5 degrees over the car's base timing? Or is it literally 5 degrees?
When I look at my timing map...is that actual timing? Absolute timing the car is running?
Or is that map an adjustment map of sorts....so if I have a value of '5' in a cell, I am advance 5 degrees over the car's base timing? Or is it literally 5 degrees?