Tuners "Scrambling" their maps.
Feb 12, 2007, 10:50 PM
#46
They typically get srambled by putting the incorrect ECU ID into the flash. When you attempt to read it with ECUFlash, it picks up the incorrect ID and loads the wrong definition for the car. When you load the wrong definition file, the maps will appear scrambled.
A better solution for the vendors would be to find a clear block of ROM where they can write a copyright signature. That's what we do at my new job.
A better solution for the vendors would be to find a clear block of ROM where they can write a copyright signature. That's what we do at my new job.
The only way to stop these things from being copied is to completely prevent the flash from ever being able to be pulled out of the ROM. This would need a hard change to the code in the ECU itself I would guess...and even then the tuners would need someway to bypass that. Figuring out how they do it would put the pirates back in business.
you are now my new favorite evom member
Feb 13, 2007, 07:05 AM
#50
the ECU Identifier is always in the same place on the Rom, someone could add a small table to fix it in the Evo7base or Evo9base so you can "make it right" all you'd need to do is load your original rom, and put the right info back in... next time you open it, it'll be fixed.
I'm really tired of this "method" of obfuscation as there is a possibility that the information for the rom version could be used by diagnostic tools, and/or elsewhere in the rom that can have other unforseen effects.
Now tuners have an easy way to obfuscate, and users have an easy way to fix it..
Makes the whole topic MOOT..
I'm really tired of this "method" of obfuscation as there is a possibility that the information for the rom version could be used by diagnostic tools, and/or elsewhere in the rom that can have other unforseen effects.
Now tuners have an easy way to obfuscate, and users have an easy way to fix it..
Makes the whole topic MOOT..
Last edited by MalibuJack; Feb 13, 2007 at 07:45 AM.
Feb 13, 2007, 09:35 AM
#51
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the ECU Identifier is always in the same place on the Rom, someone could add a small table to fix it in the Evo7base or Evo9base so you can "make it right" all you'd need to do is load your original rom, and put the right info back in... next time you open it, it'll be fixed.
I'm really tired of this "method" of obfuscation as there is a possibility that the information for the rom version could be used by diagnostic tools, and/or elsewhere in the rom that can have other unforseen effects.
Now tuners have an easy way to obfuscate, and users have an easy way to fix it..
Makes the whole topic MOOT..
I'm really tired of this "method" of obfuscation as there is a possibility that the information for the rom version could be used by diagnostic tools, and/or elsewhere in the rom that can have other unforseen effects.
Now tuners have an easy way to obfuscate, and users have an easy way to fix it..
Makes the whole topic MOOT..
Feb 13, 2007, 12:50 PM
#52
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How am i defrauding a public community al? Your scare tactics are great. Good thing to fall back on. Because you clearly know you cant defend yourself with honest replys about how you tried to help my case.
I have the e-mails I sent you. After 3 e-mails you did reply to one. I replied to it and never got a relpy back front that one. It turned into such a hassle it was just eaiser for me to go with another tuner that cared about his work and peoples cars.
Theres 10 people who witnessed map swiching in my car here to see your map was a big gain of knock.
I didn't even get my ****ing map from you untill I asked for my damn money back then I got your flash and was like well ok w/e and tried it. I tried calling you then. You didn't answer.. You didn't reply to e-mails. People didn't get their e-flashes for months. You were too "busy". I have no sympathy for you. You didn't do what you were suppose to. If I call your number were just going to get into a pissing fight. It doesn't matter now. I don't run your garbage on my car. Once again you can paypal me 52 dollars and I'll delete my posts.
Also I'm going to go ahead and say I am speaking from my experinces. Maybe your maps work better on other peoples cars. Maybe you provide better service to everyone else out there but me. However you didn't to me. And thats that. I am in no way shape or form defrauding a public community. Now I do look for my posts to get deted by the moderation staff just because I'm sure your going to cry about them.
-Cass
In responce to MJ next post. I'm done with it. Al, if you would like to resove this problem 7 months later you can contact me.
I have the e-mails I sent you. After 3 e-mails you did reply to one. I replied to it and never got a relpy back front that one. It turned into such a hassle it was just eaiser for me to go with another tuner that cared about his work and peoples cars.
Theres 10 people who witnessed map swiching in my car here to see your map was a big gain of knock.
I didn't even get my ****ing map from you untill I asked for my damn money back then I got your flash and was like well ok w/e and tried it. I tried calling you then. You didn't answer.. You didn't reply to e-mails. People didn't get their e-flashes for months. You were too "busy". I have no sympathy for you. You didn't do what you were suppose to. If I call your number were just going to get into a pissing fight. It doesn't matter now. I don't run your garbage on my car. Once again you can paypal me 52 dollars and I'll delete my posts.
Also I'm going to go ahead and say I am speaking from my experinces. Maybe your maps work better on other peoples cars. Maybe you provide better service to everyone else out there but me. However you didn't to me. And thats that. I am in no way shape or form defrauding a public community. Now I do look for my posts to get deted by the moderation staff just because I'm sure your going to cry about them.
-Cass
In responce to MJ next post. I'm done with it. Al, if you would like to resove this problem 7 months later you can contact me.
Last edited by ONRAILS; Feb 13, 2007 at 01:29 PM. Reason: reponce to mj's next post out of respect for him
Feb 13, 2007, 01:58 PM
#54
All I know is that with EcuFlash 28 my ROM is recognized as 94620008 - actual # on lable (or close - memory) and idle stepper look up was wacked, but now with EcuFlash 29a the ROM is recognized as 94170008 and ROM is perfectly viewed.
I later tried to load the correct ID from a stock 04rs ROM (incorrectly) thinking my fuel map was corrupt (AFRMAP was off the map) but that didn't work, not to mention I forgot to raise the "high boost fuel cut" back to 319% - oops
Would any want to view a datalog with fuel cut? IPW 21 ms to 1.28 ms - ouch
Bottom line is I can live with using the incorrect 94170008 ID for my ROM because it works fine
I later tried to load the correct ID from a stock 04rs ROM (incorrectly) thinking my fuel map was corrupt (AFRMAP was off the map) but that didn't work, not to mention I forgot to raise the "high boost fuel cut" back to 319% - oops
Would any want to view a datalog with fuel cut? IPW 21 ms to 1.28 ms - ouch
Bottom line is I can live with using the incorrect 94170008 ID for my ROM because it works fine
Feb 13, 2007, 02:24 PM
#55
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so I have a dynoflash, and fit into malibujack's customer profile #2 I believe. I am going to portland to get tuned by another tuner and to really understand the tuning process hopefully by watching another work. question is I am able to see and access my rom, but how do I know that it's accessing the real deal? my dynoflash was done last may, and I would assume it's before all this locking ecu crap came around, but still don't want to end up 500miles from home and stuck dinking around on a dyno with a stuck ecu.
thoughts?
thoughts?
Feb 13, 2007, 03:17 PM
#56
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With regard to this thread and the subject of it
Anyone whom is my customer whom has any issues / problems or questions concerning my product and access to the ecu or map is free to contact me directly by email, PM or telephone and I will be happy to guide the customer in the proper direction
There is nothing that is done by myself to any ecu which locks it or prevents anyone from flashing their ecu or retuning it in any manner - I am NOT aware of any technology which can do that
I am here to support my product and I respond to CUSTOMERS who have questions on a daily basis so feel free to contact me if you have any problems I am only too happy to help
I can not speak for other tuners - only myself
If you are my customer - contact me directly I do not regularly follow this forum
Anyone whom is my customer whom has any issues / problems or questions concerning my product and access to the ecu or map is free to contact me directly by email, PM or telephone and I will be happy to guide the customer in the proper direction
There is nothing that is done by myself to any ecu which locks it or prevents anyone from flashing their ecu or retuning it in any manner - I am NOT aware of any technology which can do that
I am here to support my product and I respond to CUSTOMERS who have questions on a daily basis so feel free to contact me if you have any problems I am only too happy to help
I can not speak for other tuners - only myself
If you are my customer - contact me directly I do not regularly follow this forum
Feb 13, 2007, 03:27 PM
#57
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How am i defrauding a public community al? Your scare tactics are great. Good thing to fall back on. Because you clearly know you cant defend yourself with honest replys about how you tried to help my case.
I have the e-mails I sent you. After 3 e-mails you did reply to one. I replied to it and never got a relpy back front that one. It turned into such a hassle it was just eaiser for me to go with another tuner that cared about his work and peoples cars.
Theres 10 people who witnessed map swiching in my car here to see your map was a big gain of knock.
I didn't even get my ****ing map from you untill I asked for my damn money back then I got your flash and was like well ok w/e and tried it. I tried calling you then. You didn't answer.. You didn't reply to e-mails. People didn't get their e-flashes for months. You were too "busy". I have no sympathy for you. You didn't do what you were suppose to. If I call your number were just going to get into a pissing fight. It doesn't matter now. I don't run your garbage on my car. Once again you can paypal me 52 dollars and I'll delete my posts.
Also I'm going to go ahead and say I am speaking from my experinces. Maybe your maps work better on other peoples cars. Maybe you provide better service to everyone else out there but me. However you didn't to me. And thats that. I am in no way shape or form defrauding a public community. Now I do look for my posts to get deted by the moderation staff just because I'm sure your going to cry about them.
-Cass
In responce to MJ next post. I'm done with it. Al, if you would like to resove this problem 7 months later you can contact me.
I have the e-mails I sent you. After 3 e-mails you did reply to one. I replied to it and never got a relpy back front that one. It turned into such a hassle it was just eaiser for me to go with another tuner that cared about his work and peoples cars.
Theres 10 people who witnessed map swiching in my car here to see your map was a big gain of knock.
I didn't even get my ****ing map from you untill I asked for my damn money back then I got your flash and was like well ok w/e and tried it. I tried calling you then. You didn't answer.. You didn't reply to e-mails. People didn't get their e-flashes for months. You were too "busy". I have no sympathy for you. You didn't do what you were suppose to. If I call your number were just going to get into a pissing fight. It doesn't matter now. I don't run your garbage on my car. Once again you can paypal me 52 dollars and I'll delete my posts.
Also I'm going to go ahead and say I am speaking from my experinces. Maybe your maps work better on other peoples cars. Maybe you provide better service to everyone else out there but me. However you didn't to me. And thats that. I am in no way shape or form defrauding a public community. Now I do look for my posts to get deted by the moderation staff just because I'm sure your going to cry about them.
-Cass
In responce to MJ next post. I'm done with it. Al, if you would like to resove this problem 7 months later you can contact me.
I said you are attempting to extort money from me which, as I have pointed out to you above is a felony in my state.
You are demanding that I pay you $52 (the amount you paid to some 3rd party tuner) so that you will refrain from posting negative remarks about me on the internet.
In my book your demand and threat are plain criminal extortion.
I think your demands and complaints really have nothing to do with the subject matter of this thread and are really completely off topic.
I work hard to cover my work load and I am sorry of your E FLASH ! service was not fast enough to satisfy your needs - which is one of the reasons why I elected to not promote and continue that service.
I would suggest that you consider phsychiatric assistance as your behavior seems a bit unreasonable over $52.
As I have said before you are welcome to call me to discuss this extortive demand further.
Feb 13, 2007, 04:44 PM
#59
Originally Posted by MJ
Heck, there are guys trying to make money on selling "unscrambling service" of a scrambled map, what is funny is I probably was the one who showed them how to do it back when it was first discovered.
Anyhow, for the record TTP-Engineering has and still does offer Eflashes and we have never and have no intentions of obfuscating ECUs. The only obfuscation situations we are a part of is un-fubarring other vendors maps to be reflashed over by us.
Obfuscation is a big waste of time in our book and only forms distrust by a vendor's own customers.
Feb 13, 2007, 04:57 PM
#60
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I also found this funny when I saw this. Not going to mention names, but I believe the vendor is a part of this thread.
Anyhow, for the record TTP-Engineering has and still does offer Eflashes and we have never and have no intentions of obfuscating ECUs. The only obfuscation situations we are a part of is un-fubarring other vendors maps to be reflashed over by us.
Obfuscation is a big waste of time in our book and only forms distrust by a vendor's own customers.
Anyhow, for the record TTP-Engineering has and still does offer Eflashes and we have never and have no intentions of obfuscating ECUs. The only obfuscation situations we are a part of is un-fubarring other vendors maps to be reflashed over by us.
Obfuscation is a big waste of time in our book and only forms distrust by a vendor's own customers.