Need advice jester or custom dyno tune
Feb 8, 2007, 05:54 AM
#32
Hi
Well you can say what you want about timing etc. But one thing that I really can't understand is the "pro" tuners who run maps with no boost cut.
Why set it at 319 with a delay of several seconds. Load scale of 290 is roughly 28 psi of boost, why not set it to that? With 1 sec delay this is more than enough headroom for the bigest of spikes. Why not tell the buyer that the max boost they can go to is 25 psi and set the cut at 275, that way they might not blow thier car up.
So anyone care to explain the 319 setting as a good bit of tuning work?
MB
Well you can say what you want about timing etc. But one thing that I really can't understand is the "pro" tuners who run maps with no boost cut.
Why set it at 319 with a delay of several seconds. Load scale of 290 is roughly 28 psi of boost, why not set it to that? With 1 sec delay this is more than enough headroom for the bigest of spikes. Why not tell the buyer that the max boost they can go to is 25 psi and set the cut at 275, that way they might not blow thier car up.
So anyone care to explain the 319 setting as a good bit of tuning work?
MB
Feb 8, 2007, 09:02 AM
#34
I've hit boost cut once when trying out a 3 port solenoid which was on the wrong channel so it had 100% duty rather than the 60% intended.
If your boost control is half decent and you set your fuel cut sensibly it will only happen if there is a fault, unless a fuel cut up to 32 PSI isn't enough for your setup.
If your boost control is half decent and you set your fuel cut sensibly it will only happen if there is a fault, unless a fuel cut up to 32 PSI isn't enough for your setup.
Feb 8, 2007, 09:37 AM
#36
Evolved Member
MB
Feb 8, 2007, 10:12 AM
#37
I think it all depends on who you get to tune your car. I don't rush any tune, I take my time and do my best and will go back a 2nd time if it is not to the customers liking.
Some of you guys are so fixated on saving a few dollars you don't realize that a professional who does this type of car day in and day out will be able to get you from A to B alot easier than doing it yourself, and with a higher level of safety than someone who is just trying to learn.
Also, I am noticing that alot of these so called DIY tuners are just taking a tuners ROM and spicing it up, that really isn't DIY is it. DIY is starting from scratch and doing it.
Another consideration is that in the $475 cost of the custom tune there is a dyno fee involved. Often the custom tunes last longer than you would be able to pay for on the dyno if you are doing it on the cheap.
I am all for DIY car mods, but some of this is penny wise pound foolish.
A mail tune for $50 will be just that, you are paying a low price for something that will hopefully be close, but alot of the cars differ, and it really isn't an optimal solution. It will depend alot on the feedback provided by the end user (logging wideband observation etc).
Alot of people seem to be happy with the E flashes and seem to be getting good results, but don't expect the world for $50.
Sean
Some of you guys are so fixated on saving a few dollars you don't realize that a professional who does this type of car day in and day out will be able to get you from A to B alot easier than doing it yourself, and with a higher level of safety than someone who is just trying to learn.
Also, I am noticing that alot of these so called DIY tuners are just taking a tuners ROM and spicing it up, that really isn't DIY is it. DIY is starting from scratch and doing it.
Another consideration is that in the $475 cost of the custom tune there is a dyno fee involved. Often the custom tunes last longer than you would be able to pay for on the dyno if you are doing it on the cheap.
I am all for DIY car mods, but some of this is penny wise pound foolish.
A mail tune for $50 will be just that, you are paying a low price for something that will hopefully be close, but alot of the cars differ, and it really isn't an optimal solution. It will depend alot on the feedback provided by the end user (logging wideband observation etc).
Alot of people seem to be happy with the E flashes and seem to be getting good results, but don't expect the world for $50.
Sean
Last edited by Sean@Iveytune; Feb 8, 2007 at 10:22 AM.
Feb 8, 2007, 11:11 AM
#38
I think it all depends on who you get to tune your car. I don't rush any tune, I take my time and do my best and will go back a 2nd time if it is not to the customers liking.
Some of you guys are so fixated on saving a few dollars you don't realize that a professional who does this type of car day in and day out will be able to get you from A to B alot easier than doing it yourself, and with a higher level of safety than someone who is just trying to learn.
Also, I am noticing that alot of these so called DIY tuners are just taking a tuners ROM and spicing it up, that really isn't DIY is it. DIY is starting from scratch and doing it.
Another consideration is that in the $475 cost of the custom tune there is a dyno fee involved. Often the custom tunes last longer than you would be able to pay for on the dyno if you are doing it on the cheap.
I am all for DIY car mods, but some of this is penny wise pound foolish.
A mail tune for $50 will be just that, you are paying a low price for something that will hopefully be close, but alot of the cars differ, and it really isn't an optimal solution. It will depend alot on the feedback provided by the end user (logging wideband observation etc).
Alot of people seem to be happy with the E flashes and seem to be getting good results, but don't expect the world for $50.
Sean
Some of you guys are so fixated on saving a few dollars you don't realize that a professional who does this type of car day in and day out will be able to get you from A to B alot easier than doing it yourself, and with a higher level of safety than someone who is just trying to learn.
Also, I am noticing that alot of these so called DIY tuners are just taking a tuners ROM and spicing it up, that really isn't DIY is it. DIY is starting from scratch and doing it.
Another consideration is that in the $475 cost of the custom tune there is a dyno fee involved. Often the custom tunes last longer than you would be able to pay for on the dyno if you are doing it on the cheap.
I am all for DIY car mods, but some of this is penny wise pound foolish.
A mail tune for $50 will be just that, you are paying a low price for something that will hopefully be close, but alot of the cars differ, and it really isn't an optimal solution. It will depend alot on the feedback provided by the end user (logging wideband observation etc).
Alot of people seem to be happy with the E flashes and seem to be getting good results, but don't expect the world for $50.
Sean
Feb 8, 2007, 11:45 AM
#40
Hi
Well you can say what you want about timing etc. But one thing that I really can't understand is the "pro" tuners who run maps with no boost cut.
Why set it at 319 with a delay of several seconds. Load scale of 290 is roughly 28 psi of boost, why not set it to that? With 1 sec delay this is more than enough headroom for the bigest of spikes. Why not tell the buyer that the max boost they can go to is 25 psi and set the cut at 275, that way they might not blow thier car up.
So anyone care to explain the 319 setting as a good bit of tuning work?
MB
Well you can say what you want about timing etc. But one thing that I really can't understand is the "pro" tuners who run maps with no boost cut.
Why set it at 319 with a delay of several seconds. Load scale of 290 is roughly 28 psi of boost, why not set it to that? With 1 sec delay this is more than enough headroom for the bigest of spikes. Why not tell the buyer that the max boost they can go to is 25 psi and set the cut at 275, that way they might not blow thier car up.
So anyone care to explain the 319 setting as a good bit of tuning work?
MB
One cannot claim that 290 load scale = xx psi. The ecu does not interpret boost in USDM model and in other variances there is a cheap map sensor. More importantly the type of intake and filter system dictates the load cell more than boost alone. If tuners tuned using your logic that 290=28psi, then there would be much larger problems in the pro reflash market.
Feb 8, 2007, 12:18 PM
#41
The USDM uses the same code as the JDM to determine load, and on the standard airbox I logged the following using the scaling from the factory service manual for the JDM MAP sensor:
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/at...9&d=1162839935
The logged load is the actual one used to trigger overboost fuel cut. I do not see on my logs that the load is higher than the MAP in kPa for long enough to trigger fuel cut. So we have a maximum overboost fuel cut at about 318 kPa (31.4 PSI at 14.7 PSI atmospheric pressure). This should be sufficient for a pump gas tune, and many methanol tunes unless you are as crazy as TTP (that is a compliment BTW
). Therefore you could argue that a flash designed for the vast majority of cars could have an operational fuel cut without false triggers. If you need an induction kit you can get one that flows well that under-reads which will give you a higher fuel cut range still.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/at...9&d=1162839935
The logged load is the actual one used to trigger overboost fuel cut. I do not see on my logs that the load is higher than the MAP in kPa for long enough to trigger fuel cut. So we have a maximum overboost fuel cut at about 318 kPa (31.4 PSI at 14.7 PSI atmospheric pressure). This should be sufficient for a pump gas tune, and many methanol tunes unless you are as crazy as TTP (that is a compliment BTW
). Therefore you could argue that a flash designed for the vast majority of cars could have an operational fuel cut without false triggers. If you need an induction kit you can get one that flows well that under-reads which will give you a higher fuel cut range still.
Feb 8, 2007, 02:02 PM
#42
Evolved Member
One cannot claim that 290 load scale = xx psi. The ecu does not interpret boost in USDM model and in other variances there is a cheap map sensor. More importantly the type of intake and filter system dictates the load cell more than boost alone. If tuners tuned using your logic that 290=28psi, then there would be much larger problems in the pro reflash market.
If the intake has been modified the the effects on the MAF are fairly well know, that still dosen't excuse setting boost cut to 319 and the timer to 6000ms. I'm not saying all pro tuners do this, but there is plenty of them that do, if you can shead some light on why they do this I'm sure we'd all be interested.
MB
Feb 8, 2007, 02:39 PM
#43
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if you guys that are so much better at tuning cars than jestr why do you seek the need to point out issues you have with his maps? If his maps are trash as you are all implying then i'm sure it would come back to bite him in the ***. As for telling us that your boyfriend has also looked at jestr's maps and concur that they are trash really doesn't impress me in any way because i haven't heard any good things about you and your boy. Who the hell are you guys anyways? As far as I can tell you guys are swinging on each others nuts and have come here to talk shet about another tuner. I'll take a flash from anyone who has as much positive reviews as jester any day over a couple of pompous guys who think they're the authority on tuning. Your slandering of jester simply shows us that you are not the professionals you think you are and implying the majority of us who get eflashes are clueless is really telling of your professionalism or lack there of. I'd never take my business to a tuner who slanders another.
Last edited by savaho; Feb 8, 2007 at 03:17 PM.
Feb 8, 2007, 04:53 PM
#45
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if you guys that are so much better at tuning cars than jestr why do you seek the need to point out issues you have with his maps? If his maps are trash as you are all implying then i'm sure it would come back to bite him in the ***. As for telling us that your boyfriend has also looked at jestr's maps and concur that they are trash really doesn't impress me in any way because i haven't heard any good things about you and your boy. Who the hell are you guys anyways? As far as I can tell you guys are swinging on each others nuts and have come here to talk shet about another tuner. I'll take a flash from anyone who has as much positive reviews as jester any day over a couple of pompous guys who think they're the authority on tuning. Your slandering of jester simply shows us that you are not the professionals you think you are and implying the majority of us who get eflashes are clueless is really telling of your professionalism or lack there of. I'd never take my business to a tuner who slanders another.
Both of you are missing the point completely.
The point is that it doesn't matter what tuner you go to. If it is a generic pre-flashed map then you don't know what it's gonna do.
saying..."I have this mod, and that mod" only gets you in a ballpark. It doesn't give you a great mapping of fuel and timing.