If I understand correctly, a pill with a smaller hole is needed to increase boost control with the ECU along with modifying the boost tables in the ECU.

My question is this: Is it better to place this pill on the solenoid side or the wastegate side of the boost control hose? What difference would it make putting it one way or the other?

I know that Works places their pill on the wastegate side and not on the solenoid side. What diffrence does it make?

Thanks guys.

 

I have no idea regarding that. I do know that I use to have 100 for wastegate duty values and got a max of 21-22 psi on my boost gauge, I removed the pill before the solenoid and I get the same effect at 80 duty cycle. Have not logged it, but so far the gauge looks the same.

 

Another method is to remove the pill at the BCS and put in its place a bleeder with a ~0.057-0.059" hole. This is what I'm using to achieve a very flat boost profile at approx 22.5-23 psi.

 

Wastegate side of the T. You may also need to adjust the restrictor at the boost soleniod. On my JDM 7 this was 1.2 mm ID and no mater what I did to the other pill I could not raise boost. I have drill the one near the boost silenoid out to 2 mm ID and run 22 psi.

MB

 

Just in case you need a diagram to help think about it

 

...

 

OK i have tried multiple pills on the stock system. Here's what i have found

If you go smaller on the wastegate pill, you will boost higher no question. Going from .042" ID ( #58 drill size ) to a .039 ID ( #60 drill size ) will result in ~30 psi. This in combination with #58 BCS pill. You will not be able to regulate it with the BCS, it will just overboost. If you use a #58 turbo pill in combination with a #56 ( .045" ) ID BCS pill you will be able to get 21 tapering to 18.....All this assumes a DV and stock WGA ( 11 psi from factory ).

Removing the turbo pill will only allow wastegate pressure boost ( 8-12 psi )

Removing both requires re doing the system to restrict air to the wastegate. If you place a bleeder in the line to the wastegate you can control the signal to it.
The remaining air signal can be regulated by the BCS going to waste. Not as easy to do .

If you replace the WGA with one from Forge ( i have seen this done ..no other mods..a new piston style WGA ) rated at 17-18 psi and set the preload as per the stock WGA ( 1/2 hole preload ~ 3-4 turns ) using a #58 pill by turbo and #56 by BCS you will see ~25-28 psi but will not be able to regulate it much lower.

The way i see it....the pill by the turbo sets the base boost, while using a bigger BCS pill or none at all allows a bit more. The way i think of it is a boost leak ( turbo pill...smaller= more boost larger turbo pill bigger leak less boost ) . A smaller turbo pill also reduces the amount of air going to the wastegate, allowing it to stay closed longer. OK so why does a larger BCS pill work to add 1-2 psi??? Because it allows for removing the air signal to the wastegate faster. If you stick in a smaller BCS pill you will lose 1-2 psi because the pill restricts the amount of air bled off to ATM letting the signal start to move the WG open slightly.

So If you are running 93 and are using the stock BCS, stock turbo and want 22 tapering to about 19 use a #58 turbo pill and #55 bcs pill. Adjust your table 2 WGDC, error correction, load offset, boost desired load, and Max boost

Set the WGDC initially at 20% at 2500 up to 7500 then log and adjust upwards until you are hitting 22 peak. You can tweak the load offset down to move down in load ( load offset + desired load ) ie 80 +120 = 200 load cell on timing and fuel maps or move it up a bit . You can also tweak the desired load up or down to hit the appropriate load cells. Some tuners set the max boost to 319 max desired load to 159 and zero the error correction table.

<disclaimer>

Do not boost above 23 psi on stock head bolts as this may lead to bad things in time. Use of a good tuner is thoroughly recommended as is a wideband, EGT, accurate boost gauge , and plenty of tuning time changing one thing at a time only.

 

Bingo !


These are thread I had book marked.

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...ede+boost+pill

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...8&postcount=19

 

That is exactly what Works does. They use a pill with a smaller orifice that stock on the turbo side and then they lower the duty cycle from the stock 100 level. They leave the Boost limit table unchanged and boost control offset unchanged. They almost max out the BDEL tables.

 

That's interesting. Thanks for sharing that information.

 

Sounds like they didn't put too much effort into tuning the boost IMO.

 

From what I read and from what I was told by a Works P2 flash user, the boost spikes to 21 psi and holds to 19 by redline. That is just right for 91 octane gas IMO.

Since I have their flash and the pill, I will test the boost tables and log the results and report back what I find.

 

From what you described as their settings, it sounds like a sort of 'brute force' tuning, for the lack of a better term.

If their BDELs are almost maxxed out, a relatively stock/minor bolt-on car is not going to be anywhere near those levels in the upper rpm range. So the ECU will just try to crank up the WGDCs to try to hit those loads. Sure, it'll do the job, but not very much 'finese' to it I THINK it'll lead to somewhat erractic boost as the ecu is trying to adjust the wastegate duty cycle based on the values in the correction table.

 

...

 

Check this post out from Works. I know it is from the vendor and vendors are suspect, but if their testing results is correct, then they have pretty good boost control.

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...63&postcount=6

Here is the full thread.

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...ht=Works+boost

I will test their system and see for myself.