Meth Failsafe and Patches
Jan 25, 2008, 07:15 PM
#406
There are a few of flaws to your concept which I already have taken care of. I will be posting an entire thread on how to use this patch for failsafe triggers in the very near future. Teph is hoping to create a "future state" patch which would interpolate between a 'no meth' setting and a 'maximum amount of meth' setting so as the flow sensor input changes, so does the tune.
Last edited by Jack_of_Trades; Jan 25, 2008 at 07:24 PM.
Jan 25, 2008, 07:22 PM
#407
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thats what I was basically saying 
, in another way. but you guys pretty much have this locked down
, in another way. but you guys pretty much have this locked down
Last edited by bnice01; Jan 25, 2008 at 07:27 PM.
Jan 26, 2008, 10:57 AM
#408
set the prepatch for something like:
>4v alternate failsafe map (clogged nozzle, etc)
>2.5v alky map (normal flowing)
<2.5v alternate failesafe map (pressure drop)
this will all depend on how your flow sensor is calibrated, but user should have the option to change those values. use a mulitimeter to measure the voltage during "normal" flow.
you can get the pressure switch from www.mcmaster.com for
3460K61
(Same as 3460K15)
Pressure Switch 20 to 120 PSI Actuation Range
In stock at $19.80 Each
I know you guys got this pretty wrapped up
>4v alternate failsafe map (clogged nozzle, etc)
>2.5v alky map (normal flowing)
<2.5v alternate failesafe map (pressure drop)
this will all depend on how your flow sensor is calibrated, but user should have the option to change those values. use a mulitimeter to measure the voltage during "normal" flow.
you can get the pressure switch from www.mcmaster.com for
3460K61
(Same as 3460K15)
Pressure Switch 20 to 120 PSI Actuation Range
In stock at $19.80 Each
I know you guys got this pretty wrapped up
Using a Pressure switch is one option and all you need to do is use +12V input with the 220K ohm resistor ( or a true +5v source) and you're good.
My new alky kit design I made will actually be able to monitor the alky-to-gas mixture in the ECU (with a little help from Tephra in the near future) and can trigger the failsafe if the % of alky drops below a set point. My design bacially is controlled by the IDC's and the fuel pressure uses the exact same rising rate as the stock system so it doesn't really vary much anyway.
Conventional alky kits basically spray a set amount of alky from start to finish, some increase the pump pressure proportionally to help this. I have created a way to log a flow sensor so you can SEE how funky your alky kit changes your mixture % and its generally pretty ugly. Most alky kits will flow wayy too much when you first engage it and then it tapers off as the rpm's go up. Example, 20%@3000RPM - 8%@7500RPM
Think of the alky kit as an injector with a set IDC at 100%. Now think of the stock injectors where they're IDC's will be in the 30% range at the beginning and rise to say, 85-90%. A flow sensor is the best way to keep an eye on what your mixture truely is.
I skipped over a few points but it will be all explained in my full thread soon.
Last edited by Jack_of_Trades; Jan 26, 2008 at 11:01 AM.
Jan 26, 2008, 11:38 AM
#409
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Now that I have some time, I can explain this a little bit more. The first statement you made mentioned having TWO set points in the ADC input setup. Right now you're only able to have one (the same way a pressure switch has a switching point). Also, flow sensors increase voltage as the flow increases so if there was a clog, it'd read verrry low voltage, if not 0 volts.
Using a Pressure switch is one option and all you need to do is use +12V input with the 220K ohm resistor ( or a true +5v source) and you're good.
My new alky kit design I made will actually be able to monitor the alky-to-gas mixture in the ECU (with a little help from Tephra in the near future) and can trigger the failsafe if the % of alky drops below a set point. My design bacially is controlled by the IDC's and the fuel pressure uses the exact same rising rate as the stock system so it doesn't really vary much anyway.
Conventional alky kits basically spray a set amount of alky from start to finish, some increase the pump pressure proportionally to help this. I have created a way to log a flow sensor so you can SEE how funky your alky kit changes your mixture % and its generally pretty ugly. Most alky kits will flow wayy too much when you first engage it and then it tapers off as the rpm's go up. Example, 20%@3000RPM - 8%@7500RPM
Think of the alky kit as an injector with a set IDC at 100%. Now think of the stock injectors where they're IDC's will be in the 30% range at the beginning and rise to say, 85-90%. A flow sensor is the best way to keep an eye on what your mixture truely is.
I skipped over a few points but it will be all explained in my full thread soon.
Using a Pressure switch is one option and all you need to do is use +12V input with the 220K ohm resistor ( or a true +5v source) and you're good.
My new alky kit design I made will actually be able to monitor the alky-to-gas mixture in the ECU (with a little help from Tephra in the near future) and can trigger the failsafe if the % of alky drops below a set point. My design bacially is controlled by the IDC's and the fuel pressure uses the exact same rising rate as the stock system so it doesn't really vary much anyway.
Conventional alky kits basically spray a set amount of alky from start to finish, some increase the pump pressure proportionally to help this. I have created a way to log a flow sensor so you can SEE how funky your alky kit changes your mixture % and its generally pretty ugly. Most alky kits will flow wayy too much when you first engage it and then it tapers off as the rpm's go up. Example, 20%@3000RPM - 8%@7500RPM
Think of the alky kit as an injector with a set IDC at 100%. Now think of the stock injectors where they're IDC's will be in the 30% range at the beginning and rise to say, 85-90%. A flow sensor is the best way to keep an eye on what your mixture truely is.
I skipped over a few points but it will be all explained in my full thread soon.
to be honest with you I have been doing meth injection for almost 3yrs made a few failsafes but never seen a clogged nozzle. That doesnt mean it wont happen though
Yeah most alky kits now a days are using IDC over manifold pressure with a progressive setup to match flow @ the nozzle with IDC. Oh I understand what your doing. So I take it your increasing voltage to the pump as IDC increase's?
Last edited by bnice01; Jan 26, 2008 at 12:10 PM.
Jan 26, 2008, 12:27 PM
#410
Gotcha on the ADC input now it makes sense. But a clogged nozzle the voltage will increase not decrease, because there is a resistriction there. You have a pump putting out anywhere to 110-140 of pressure, 1/4 hard plastic hose, with a nozzle putting out half the amount of fluid will cause the pressure to raise quite a bit. Now my statements only holds true if I used a what I posted up in my previous statement to montior flow (the more pressure the more voltage), I use this for my failsafe @ the moment. If I was using a peddle wheel design flow sensor (like found in the aquamist kit) then yes I can see how the voltage would drop if there was a restriction, it would cause the wheel to spin @ a lower rate. So I can see the miscommunication that we had earlier
to be honest with you I have been doing meth injection for almost 3yrs made a few failsafes but never seen a clogged nozzle. That doesnt mean it wont happen though
Yeah most alky kits now a days are using IDC over manifold pressure with a progressive setup to match flow @ the nozzle with IDC. Oh I understand what your doing. So I take it your increasing voltage to the pump as IDC increase's?
to be honest with you I have been doing meth injection for almost 3yrs made a few failsafes but never seen a clogged nozzle. That doesnt mean it wont happen though
Yeah most alky kits now a days are using IDC over manifold pressure with a progressive setup to match flow @ the nozzle with IDC. Oh I understand what your doing. So I take it your increasing voltage to the pump as IDC increase's?
I dont increase voltage to the pump ever. I use an ACTUAL fuel injector in my setup which is designed solely for alky, not water. It uses an adjustable FPR with a 1:1 rising rate so as the boost pressure increases, so does the alky kits fuel pressure....at an equal percentage to the stock injectors. I scrapped the basic concept of alky kits because, well...they suck and results aren't reliable. Only a select few out there are even worth buying at all. They know who they are
Jan 26, 2008, 01:02 PM
#411
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yeah I know I have bad wording sometimes but you get what I'm saying. you said the same thing I said but used the proper wording LOL
but acutally the item from mcmaster people do use that to monitor pressure.
not a bad setup, you need to post your DIY alky kit
LOLbut acutally the item from mcmaster people do use that to monitor pressure.
not a bad setup, you need to post your DIY alky kit
Last edited by bnice01; Jan 26, 2008 at 01:08 PM.
Jan 26, 2008, 01:14 PM
#413
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I kinda have already but its an older thread now. Things have been updates since then.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=306944
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=306944
WOW i'm impressed man
, were is the alky injector tap into or is it direct port?
Jan 28, 2008, 08:22 PM
#418
I am updating my tutorial on the EVO 8's REALLY soon and I now offer a fully made harness with switch, LED, power wires and installed ECU pin for $23.99 USD shipped anywhere in the US (australia shipping may vary,lol). I will also offer the same harness for the IX's once I get my hands on the pins. The tutorial shows you how to make it yourself but some people don't have the patience or time, plus buying the parts costs over $16 anyways.
Also, you have gmail Tephra
Did you get your evo yet?????
Also, you have gmail Tephra
Did you get your evo yet?????
Last edited by Jack_of_Trades; Jan 28, 2008 at 08:29 PM.
Jan 28, 2008, 09:06 PM
#419
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LOl yeah my pins cost me 0.91 shipped for 10 but still waiting to hear back from my friend @ the deal about the IX pins
jamie you rock man, I know your girl is probably a bit upset with always being on the cpu I hear it alot from my wife :P
jamie you rock man, I know your girl is probably a bit upset with always being on the cpu I hear it alot from my wife :P