lean out = massive knock
Aug 28, 2008 | 05:23 AM
#1
Thread Starter
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (6)
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,486
Likes: 66
From: Melbourne, Australia
lean out = massive knock
right well this is going to show my noobness 
Ok my car is tuned for 11.2 AFR (new injectors) and no knock. More importantly before the new injectors I was tuned for 11.5ish and no knock.
Now I want to run about 11.7 AFR, so I lean out my fuel map a tad and go for a run. No adjustments to boots or timing.
Anyways, put my foot down in 3rd and as soon as the car boosts I get fast CEL Flashing + loss of power, I back off straight away to get the following log:
Obviously not good!!!
So initially I thought it was leaning it out 0.5AFR that did it, but then I looked at my pre-injector upgrade and found I was running fairly lean and no-knock.
This is all assuming the LC1 is accurate..
Thoughts?
Cheers
D.
Ok my car is tuned for 11.2 AFR (new injectors) and no knock. More importantly before the new injectors I was tuned for 11.5ish and no knock.
Now I want to run about 11.7 AFR, so I lean out my fuel map a tad and go for a run. No adjustments to boots or timing.
Anyways, put my foot down in 3rd and as soon as the car boosts I get fast CEL Flashing + loss of power, I back off straight away to get the following log:
Code:
Time RPM WB02 GMMAP WGDC AirFlow Load1B TPS Timing Speed IPW IDC KnockSum 6.075 2563 13.3 6.2 73.5 416 140 100 13 44 4.864 10.4 0 6.173 2594 13.1 6.8 73.5 436 145 100 13 44 5.12 11.1 0 6.260 2625 12.9 7.3 73.0 431 149 100 12 44 5.376 11.8 0 6.340 2656 13.0 7.8 72.5 475 154 100 10 44 5.632 12.5 2 6.427 2719 12.7 8.5 72.5 495 158 100 10 46 5.888 13.3 2 6.513 2750 12.5 9.4 72.0 528 164 100 10 46 6.144 14.1 2 6.592 2813 12.0 9.8 71.5 554 170 100 9 46 6.656 15.6 2 6.679 2813 11.7 10.8 71.5 557 176 100 8 46 6.912 16.2 2 6.759 2875 11.5 11.3 71.0 619 184 100 7 46 7.424 17.8 2 6.846 2938 11.5 12.6 70.5 655 192 100 7 46 7.68 18.8 1 6.931 2969 11.2 14.1 70.0 704 203 100 5 46 7.936 19.6 1 7.011 3000 11.4 15.2 70.0 751 212 100 4 46 8.448 21.1 1 7.126 3094 11.4 15.9 70.0 813 227 100 2 54 9.216 23.8 1 7.206 3156 11.2 18.9 70.0 891 240 100 2 54 9.728 25.6 1 7.293 3250 11.1 19.4 70.0 951 252 100 2 54 10.24 27.7 1 7.373 3281 11.6 21.9 70.0 989 256 100 2 54 10.24 28.0 1 7.458 3375 11.7 22.9 71.5 985 250 100 2 54 10.24 28.8 1 7.545 3406 11.6 23.1 72.0 992 247 100 2 54 9.728 27.6 8 7.626 3500 11.9 22.2 72.5 967 239 100 -1 54 9.728 28.4 14 7.711 3563 11.6 22.9 73.5 961 236 100 -4 54 10.24 30.4 28 7.799 3625 11.7 22.2 74.5 1025 244 100 -10 62 10.752 32.5 35 7.882 3656 11.7 22.1 74.5 1071 251 100 -10 62 11.52 35.1 36 7.972 3781 11.3 22.9 75.5 1154 265 100 -10 62 11.776 37.1 36 8.052 3781 10.9 24.0 75.5 1144 260 100 -10 62 11.776 37.1 36 8.151 3813 10.7 24.3 75.5 1189 265 100 -10 62 11.776 37.4 36
So initially I thought it was leaning it out 0.5AFR that did it, but then I looked at my pre-injector upgrade and found I was running fairly lean and no-knock.
This is all assuming the LC1 is accurate..
Thoughts?
Cheers
D.
Aug 28, 2008 | 05:41 AM
#3
Thread Starter
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (6)
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,486
Likes: 66
From: Melbourne, Australia
mmm precisely...
I don't think its bad fuel either, because its a fresh tank and I did a 2500-7000 rpm pull earlier today (same tank of gas)...
edit - I am going to flash back to the ROM from this morning and go another pull.
Admittedly its colder out now - but that shouldn't matter too much...
I don't think its bad fuel either, because its a fresh tank and I did a 2500-7000 rpm pull earlier today (same tank of gas)...
edit - I am going to flash back to the ROM from this morning and go another pull.
Admittedly its colder out now - but that shouldn't matter too much...
Last edited by tephra; Aug 28, 2008 at 05:45 AM.
Aug 28, 2008 | 06:35 AM
#5
right well this is going to show my noobness
Ok my car is tuned for 11.2 AFR (new injectors) and no knock. More importantly before the new injectors I was tuned for 11.5ish and no knock.
Now I want to run about 11.7 AFR, so I lean out my fuel map a tad and go for a run. No adjustments to boots or timing.
Anyways, put my foot down in 3rd and as soon as the car boosts I get fast CEL Flashing + loss of power, I back off straight away to get the following log:
Obviously not good!!!
So initially I thought it was leaning it out 0.5AFR that did it, but then I looked at my pre-injector upgrade and found I was running fairly lean and no-knock.
This is all assuming the LC1 is accurate..
Thoughts?
Cheers
D.
Ok my car is tuned for 11.2 AFR (new injectors) and no knock. More importantly before the new injectors I was tuned for 11.5ish and no knock.
Now I want to run about 11.7 AFR, so I lean out my fuel map a tad and go for a run. No adjustments to boots or timing.
Anyways, put my foot down in 3rd and as soon as the car boosts I get fast CEL Flashing + loss of power, I back off straight away to get the following log:
Code:
Time RPM WB02 GMMAP WGDC AirFlow Load1B TPS Timing Speed IPW IDC KnockSum 6.075 2563 13.3 6.2 73.5 416 140 100 13 44 4.864 10.4 0 6.173 2594 13.1 6.8 73.5 436 145 100 13 44 5.12 11.1 0 6.260 2625 12.9 7.3 73.0 431 149 100 12 44 5.376 11.8 0 6.340 2656 13.0 7.8 72.5 475 154 100 10 44 5.632 12.5 2 6.427 2719 12.7 8.5 72.5 495 158 100 10 46 5.888 13.3 2 6.513 2750 12.5 9.4 72.0 528 164 100 10 46 6.144 14.1 2 6.592 2813 12.0 9.8 71.5 554 170 100 9 46 6.656 15.6 2 6.679 2813 11.7 10.8 71.5 557 176 100 8 46 6.912 16.2 2 6.759 2875 11.5 11.3 71.0 619 184 100 7 46 7.424 17.8 2 6.846 2938 11.5 12.6 70.5 655 192 100 7 46 7.68 18.8 1 6.931 2969 11.2 14.1 70.0 704 203 100 5 46 7.936 19.6 1 7.011 3000 11.4 15.2 70.0 751 212 100 4 46 8.448 21.1 1 7.126 3094 11.4 15.9 70.0 813 227 100 2 54 9.216 23.8 1 7.206 3156 11.2 18.9 70.0 891 240 100 2 54 9.728 25.6 1 7.293 3250 11.1 19.4 70.0 951 252 100 2 54 10.24 27.7 1 7.373 3281 11.6 21.9 70.0 989 256 100 2 54 10.24 28.0 1 7.458 3375 11.7 22.9 71.5 985 250 100 2 54 10.24 28.8 1 7.545 3406 11.6 23.1 72.0 992 247 100 2 54 9.728 27.6 8 7.626 3500 11.9 22.2 72.5 967 239 100 -1 54 9.728 28.4 14 7.711 3563 11.6 22.9 73.5 961 236 100 -4 54 10.24 30.4 28 7.799 3625 11.7 22.2 74.5 1025 244 100 -10 62 10.752 32.5 35 7.882 3656 11.7 22.1 74.5 1071 251 100 -10 62 11.52 35.1 36 7.972 3781 11.3 22.9 75.5 1154 265 100 -10 62 11.776 37.1 36 8.052 3781 10.9 24.0 75.5 1144 260 100 -10 62 11.776 37.1 36 8.151 3813 10.7 24.3 75.5 1189 265 100 -10 62 11.776 37.4 36
So initially I thought it was leaning it out 0.5AFR that did it, but then I looked at my pre-injector upgrade and found I was running fairly lean and no-knock.
This is all assuming the LC1 is accurate..
Thoughts?
Cheers
D.
Also,
7.545 3406 11.6 23.1 72.0 992 247 100 2 54 9.728 27.6 8
7.626 3500 11.9 22.2 72.5 967 239 100 -1 54 9.728 28.4 14
7.711 3563 11.6 22.9 73.5 961 236 100 -4 54 10.24 30.4 28
your showing 11.9:1 at the onset of knock, could have been a lean dip or a missfire (would show as a lean spike). If your running stock turbo with aggressive mivec you were certainly at full boost by 3500.
Aug 28, 2008 | 06:44 AM
#6
Thread Starter
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (6)
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,486
Likes: 66
From: Melbourne, Australia
just the GMMAP column is boost 
Well I flashed back to my previous ROM and its all fine..
Might do a diff of the ROM's to see what else changed...
edit - having a quick look at these logs, my previous map was already quite lean.
I suspect the LC1 is being a bit funny, will check the settings tommorow and recalibrate it "AGAIN" (did it today once already)
Well I flashed back to my previous ROM and its all fine..
Might do a diff of the ROM's to see what else changed...
edit - having a quick look at these logs, my previous map was already quite lean.
I suspect the LC1 is being a bit funny, will check the settings tommorow and recalibrate it "AGAIN" (did it today once already)
Last edited by tephra; Aug 28, 2008 at 06:47 AM.
Trending Topics
Aug 28, 2008 | 08:43 AM
#8
seems like the LC-1 may very well be off. In my experince small changes in fuel like that do not account for such a large variation in knock count. Also I dont think that ~11.7 is super lean anyway.
Sure it is pretty lean, but when I was running out of injector up top my AFR was going as lean as 12.1 on pump and I was not having any knock problems.
Is this the LC-1 that you have already sent it to get fixed or is this the same one you were having trouble with a while back?
Sure it is pretty lean, but when I was running out of injector up top my AFR was going as lean as 12.1 on pump and I was not having any knock problems.
Is this the LC-1 that you have already sent it to get fixed or is this the same one you were having trouble with a while back?
Aug 28, 2008 | 11:31 AM
#11
Congrats tephra, you pegged the ECU knock count.
Where you logging narrowband at the time?
Aug 28, 2008 | 04:33 PM
#15
Evolved Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 569
Likes: 1
From: UK
Why is the timing dropping to -10 ? Is that purely because of how much / how sustained the knock was ?
Interesting if it is, that the ecu has seen the knock, dropped the timing / octane to sort it out, but the knock hasn't got any better.
Oh and my car was tuned to run 11.7ish afr (always been told to aim for 0.8 lambda which is 11.76 afr) so it isn't that lean.
Over here, cars tuned on the dyno's, the mappers aim for 12 afr.
Interesting if it is, that the ecu has seen the knock, dropped the timing / octane to sort it out, but the knock hasn't got any better.
Oh and my car was tuned to run 11.7ish afr (always been told to aim for 0.8 lambda which is 11.76 afr) so it isn't that lean.
Over here, cars tuned on the dyno's, the mappers aim for 12 afr.