English Racing SD Evo 9 HKS7460 E85 - Results are in.
Nov 1, 2010, 03:27 PM
#136
With the HKS housing being stainless, it would probably be better to modify the HKS housing.
The HKS housing looks like it might even be slightly larger on the scroll area from the pictures above. Opening up the nozzle a bit might help some. The fact that it makes good power though leads me to beleive it isn't hurting it much.
The HKS housing looks like it might even be slightly larger on the scroll area from the pictures above. Opening up the nozzle a bit might help some. The fact that it makes good power though leads me to beleive it isn't hurting it much.
Nov 1, 2010, 05:03 PM
#137
FWIW (probably not much since this oriented to single scroll), BUT
http://www.stealth316.com/2-turboguide.htm
9.8cm would be just under 0.72 and a 10.5cm would be 0.77
aaron
http://www.stealth316.com/2-turboguide.htm
9.8cm would be just under 0.72 and a 10.5cm would be 0.77
aaron
Nov 1, 2010, 06:51 PM
#139
porting a hotside never includes work to the nozzle area. its focus would be the inlet and wastegate flow. you can port the nozzle area but you have to be careful. you can ruin the housing very easily by taking too much off. it would be a much better idea to cut a mitsu 10.5 housing to work with this wheel. my guess is it would spool 250rpm slower and free up 20hp from 6k up.
Nov 1, 2010, 08:07 PM
#140
This is an unmolested 9.8 housing.
Sectioned at 35*,90*,180*,270*
35* is roughly the angle where the inlet ceternline meets up at a tangent with the radial scroll.
35* cut
35* face up close
Cylinder 1&4 scroll measurement
Cylinder 2&3 scroll measurement
Sectioned at 35*,90*,180*,270*
35* is roughly the angle where the inlet ceternline meets up at a tangent with the radial scroll.
35* cut
35* face up close
Cylinder 1&4 scroll measurement
Cylinder 2&3 scroll measurement
Nov 1, 2010, 08:10 PM
#141
Something worth mentioning, although it is only based on a guess.
If you look at the manifold, cylinders 2&3 runners are much shorter. Because of this, they will have a lower pressure drop. I think the scroll may have been shrunk in size to balance pressure drops between cylinders.
Also, I took measurements all over the place and built up a solid model and a numerical model of the scroll profiles. Here are some facts from the measurements I took.
(Side 1 is cylinders 1&4, side 2 cylinders 2&3)
Scroll area [mm^2]
Side 1: 529
Side 2: 431
Total: 960
Or if you want it in cm^2, 9.6 total at 35*...
If you look at the manifold, cylinders 2&3 runners are much shorter. Because of this, they will have a lower pressure drop. I think the scroll may have been shrunk in size to balance pressure drops between cylinders.
Also, I took measurements all over the place and built up a solid model and a numerical model of the scroll profiles. Here are some facts from the measurements I took.
(Side 1 is cylinders 1&4, side 2 cylinders 2&3)
Scroll area [mm^2]
Side 1: 529
Side 2: 431
Total: 960
Or if you want it in cm^2, 9.6 total at 35*...
Last edited by 03whitegsr; Nov 1, 2010 at 08:19 PM.
. This thread is heading down some really interesting paths.
Nov 1, 2010, 08:59 PM
#143
porting a hotside never includes work to the nozzle area. its focus would be the inlet and wastegate flow. you can port the nozzle area but you have to be careful. you can ruin the housing very easily by taking too much off. it would be a much better idea to cut a mitsu 10.5 housing to work with this wheel. my guess is it would spool 250rpm slower and free up 20hp from 6k up.
Nov 1, 2010, 11:51 PM
#147
Eric, by porting the hotside will this even help the turbo and the problem with the a/r or not? I am about to send it out to MAP...but want to make sure that its something that will help...don't want to spend on things that won't produce power on this setup...what is your view? i know you ported yours...so I already think I know the answer...do you think it helped you any?
Nov 2, 2010, 07:07 AM
#149
There just seems to be people jumping to conclusions that it has a smaller nozzle then stock. I doubt it does and until somebody measures it, it is just guessing.
Either way, if somebody is determined to port the scroll/nozzle, it is my opinion that you would be better off getting it extrude honed. After that, hand finish the nozzle splitter tip as it will likely be sharp which is very undesireable at high temps.
Either way, if somebody is determined to port the scroll/nozzle, it is my opinion that you would be better off getting it extrude honed. After that, hand finish the nozzle splitter tip as it will likely be sharp which is very undesireable at high temps.
Nov 2, 2010, 09:00 AM
#150
I absolutely am guessing about how restrictive this HKS housing is. So far we have seen 480whp from it. An we have seen 670whp made through the evo 10.5 housing. My guessing comes from tweaking the housings in this area on some past setups. Removing a tiny amount of material in this area has a HUGE affect on effective A/R. The amount of difference of restriction in this area between the HKS and stock is not tiny. its HUGE. I'd bet a million dollars right now that a machined 10.5 mitsu housing will make more power. Its not even a question in my mind. Take it for what its worth.
I would never send a housing for extrude honing again. that process takes large amounts of material off that cant be reversed. they ruined a compressor housing I sent them years back.
The problem with extrude honing is when the material is forced through the housing it takes the path of least restance. What I ended up with was huge gap on one section of the scroll. it didnt remove material evenly throughout the housing at all. On a twin scroll housing it would be certain suicide. the wall thickness separating the two scrolls cant afford to loose material.
Here are some pics looking into the scrolls. the first two are the HKS, the second two are mitsu 10.5. not only is the shape of HKS appear smaller there is far more light getting into the mitsu 10.5. the light would represent how much heat can get out. more light = more heat out.
And I am pretty sure the diffusur area is not part of A/R calculation. The a/r is calculated by the area inside housing . when a/r is increased the area is increased without enlarging the diffusor width. the diffuser width matches the width of turbine wheel blades and is kept constant. larger a/r housings work in two ways. they diffuse more heat before it reaches turbine. and it slows the air down before it reaches turbine. ultimately lowing backpressure before turbine.
I would never send a housing for extrude honing again. that process takes large amounts of material off that cant be reversed. they ruined a compressor housing I sent them years back.
The problem with extrude honing is when the material is forced through the housing it takes the path of least restance. What I ended up with was huge gap on one section of the scroll. it didnt remove material evenly throughout the housing at all. On a twin scroll housing it would be certain suicide. the wall thickness separating the two scrolls cant afford to loose material.
Here are some pics looking into the scrolls. the first two are the HKS, the second two are mitsu 10.5. not only is the shape of HKS appear smaller there is far more light getting into the mitsu 10.5. the light would represent how much heat can get out. more light = more heat out.
And I am pretty sure the diffusur area is not part of A/R calculation. The a/r is calculated by the area inside housing . when a/r is increased the area is increased without enlarging the diffusor width. the diffuser width matches the width of turbine wheel blades and is kept constant. larger a/r housings work in two ways. they diffuse more heat before it reaches turbine. and it slows the air down before it reaches turbine. ultimately lowing backpressure before turbine.
Last edited by 94AWDcoupe; Nov 2, 2010 at 09:32 AM.