Last I checked, NHRA requires 0.024" thick steel or 0.032" thick aluminum plate if using a trunk mounted fuel cell. (Interestingly enough, if you've relocated the battery to the trunk, you need to enclose it in a metal box or install a firewall behind the rear seats, as well as provide an external master disconnect) Cost of materials for sheet aluminum or steel are what they are, but I don't see this skyrocketing the price of the kit.

What is also interesting when you look at the NHRA rulebook is that there may be no more than 12" of rubber line in your entire fuel system. Either the stock hard line must be used or braided-steel must be used. Doesn't say if they define denatured alcohol as a fuel, though. Also, something to consider if you are going to be racing at an NHRA event.

Another one is that the fuel cell must be, at its highest point, below the height of the rear tires. Don't ask me to explain the logic of that one.

Perhaps a reservoir can be made to use the stock windshield washer bottle location? But then you have to solve both the height issue and the rubber line issue.

 

IMHO - anyone who wants to get a 2nd fuel cell would be better off going with an aqua mist kit and a custom fabrication. I don't see a mass produced kit being offered at a price to make a kit worth while.

Once you start working on a firewall and also brackets strong enough to hold down the alcohol fuel cell, properly routing teflon hoses in a SAFE manner (Note - routing hoses where they will be cut or damaged is more dangerous than anything else) - and making brackets for pump mounting, wiring and other related details - you are getting into a huge financial and time cost.

You are tunring a 2 - 3 hour install into a 10 hour install.

Also - when you add more things - there are more things to break. Our system is simple and effective.

IMHO - the cost benefit ratio becomes nill. In my car on C-16 I could not find any extra power with water or alcohol injection. The real benefit is to allow you to run pump gas and make race gas numbers - clearly a cost savings factor and convienience item.

Once you get into spending over $1,000 in parts - plus a lot more in instlation it becomes silly to even consider a kit of this nature - just my two cents.

 

I believe that. There's a lot to be said for keeping things simple. I don't know that Aquamist is the answer, though. They tend to make things a little too complicated just for the sake of being complicated, which I'm finding out isn't the best way to do things sometimes.

The NHRA regulations surprised me, too, when I looked them up. Just putting it out there as a datapoint so people can be ready when a track official kicks them off the track for something as simple as a 14" long nonbraided alky line.

As far as return on investment, the kit that you sell is pretty damn good (cheaper than my aquamist stuff) for the price. Can you run Methanol through that pump, as well? It's a whole heck of a lot cheaper than the denatured alky.

 

I definitely agree that this kit is the most cost-effective out there. Maybe it's not as simple as I thought to get a legal alcohol kit into the trunk.

Where will the reservoir for the '05 kit be located? Any ideas?

 

JUst an FYI the IC resevoir has an overflow hose that comes out of the side of the tank. I think the majority of the vapors are going to come out underneath the car anyway. So in closing I think if you got in a wreck there is a small chance your car may catch on fire.

 

its plugged off with the alky kit

 

It does run methanol - paul's car will be the test bed for the road racing - we will see how he makes out with it.

 

ahem... the IC spay bottle is to be filled with windshield washer fluid... I use 80% rubbing alcohol in a 50 50 mix with water for a 40% concentration. So far I have not blown or burned anything up... should I be worried?

 

Im a supporter of your kits, but I think that the $1000 figure is quite high. I had a basic, but great home made WI system installed in my galant, and it cost me $300 total including a couple runs to a hardware store. The trunk had the holding tank (a RV reservoir), pump and filter. I had an aquamist line running up front. Granted this was not alchohol, but I have a hard time imagining that even braided hose and a metal tank (DO NOT USE A FUEL CELL WITH FOAM IN IT) is going to cost an additional $700.
As I stated many times before though, some people need to separate Al/Bushur kits from what their own needs are going to be. If their kits don't work for you, just make your own. If you are smart enough to know all of what you need, you are smart enough to put one of these systems together yourself, and you will even save some money in the process. Thats the way it works.
If you want the easy plug/play system buy the pre-canned ones. Its not a hard concept to understand.
What pisses me off is there is so much good info that goes to waste, because it sits in the middle of such BS posts, and people arguing for arguing sake.

 

I think that I just do things on a very extreme level so my projects cost too much money.

For example - here is the cost of my fuel system on my car

Fuel cell - $1000 (custom made with two internal walbro pumps and a surge tank)

Bracket for fuel cell to mount in spare titre well - custom made to NHRA and SCCA specs - $450

Braided line and fittings $185

Perrin Fuel rail $175

Aeromotive FPR - $200

Relays, fuses and wires $50

This does not include about 20 hourfs of my time to research the system, install and configure it - OR - the firewall I still need to fabricate

While it may have cost me a significant sum - the fuel system has functioned without fail since day one and has not had any problems.

When you set up something properly its not cheap and not easy.

$1,000 for a alcohol injection kit is not exceesive as the aquamist unit I would use is like $700 just for the bare parts. Then you need to fab up all the brackets and tank and firewall and make it all work.

 

sounds like to me if you want to buy it then buy it . if not don buy it. we are all adults here. we all know what we want and what we want to buy...

 

There are going to be doubters, haters and just PITA's with every product that is on the market. That is the bottom line. I find myself doing it myself with new products that I have never seen or even given a chance, most of them with engine management. I bad mouth them and I have never even tried them. Why? Hell I don't know. Same as most guys with this alcohol kit.

Al and I have worked together on this quite a bit. Al is the guy that has worked hardest to try to change this detail or that detail with these kits to make everyone happy. I have told him don't waste his time as the guys that are bad mouthing them will never buy them anyway.....you can't make everyone happy. He has continued to bust his *** though and try. This has brought some killer improvements to the kits. The wiring has been simplified, the pressure gauge has been changed for ease of viewing and the latest is the pump have been improved to not only not need an additional oil additive for lubricant but can also be used with water, water/alky mix, methanal, denatured alky or windshield washer fluid.

This last change should have gotten everyone fixed up and on board with one of these kits. THEY WORK!

With the cars mostly coming with ACD's now we are working on yet another design so that the same kit can fit on every EVO. Between Al and myself we have put approximately 65 of these kits out there on EVO's so far.

Funny thing is if you go through and look at all the posts made about them you won't find a negative thing being said about the kit except by the guys that don't have them. Sure you'll find a few suggestions but bottom line is they are making some big SAFE power.

Enjoy guys. Every modification out there isn't for everyone.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

 

I have it on my car and it is amazing, I get race gas power everyday! How can you complain about that! You keep coming up with the fast stuff Dave I will keep on buying it

PS the dragstrip opens on 4-9 so I will get some "pump" gas times for everyone.

 

Thanks Bret, I'll keep trying to come up with new things. I am very anxious to see what your car does.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com