Once again..Buschur Racing Dyno Thread.
#31
Originally Posted by davidbuschur
The difference very well could be the custom flash we were able to do here on the dyno. Nice thing is all of the future flashes should be much more powerful than anything in the past now that we are re-tuning on the new dyno.
What we are doing now will be the BR flash for our parts from now on.
What dyno did you dyno 270/280 on?
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
What we are doing now will be the BR flash for our parts from now on.
What dyno did you dyno 270/280 on?
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
#33
Most Dynojets have no load features. I guess they have recently released one. A Dynojet is just a set of rolls, some small, some large and some AWD's large and small on the same dyno. Nothing there but the mass (weight) of the rollers. When the car initially starts to move it has to overcome this large amount of weight, which typically outweighs any car loaded on it) and then once they are spinning there is basically no resistance at all.
A Mustang Dyno works opposite. Our particular dyno has small rollers. It is built for "imports". The roll weight is very close to that of a Subaru or EVO and I can make a change to the dyno to drop the roll weight another 700 pounds if the need arises for a very light car. We have done some testing like this already on our black EVO but found it made no difference. Anyway, the MD has a PAU (Power Absorption Unit) which looks like a very large electric motor with no outer cover. The car starts out and as the speed increases the PAU puts more and more load on the car. The Power @ 50 mph number is used as a base number to vary the load the car needs. So (this is not right as it is not linear but...) at 25 mph the PAU is putting a 7.5 hp load on the car, at 50 mph it is putting a 15.1 HP load on the car at 100 it is putting a 30.2 hp load on the car, etc. Actually I believe to double your speed it is 4x's the HP, but you get the idea.
Tuning on our old Dynojet we would spend hours dialing in the AFR's. Take the car off the dyno, go to the track and run like ***. We'd end up adding a ton of fuel to the car. Now that we have wide bands and such we found what was wrong. The load is not enough and the AFR's on the Dynojet would come out at 11.5:1 (for example) but once on the street would be 12.7:1. Looking back when we were tuning at 12.5:1 I am surprised we didn't loose more engines with the extremely lean conditions we must have had.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
A Mustang Dyno works opposite. Our particular dyno has small rollers. It is built for "imports". The roll weight is very close to that of a Subaru or EVO and I can make a change to the dyno to drop the roll weight another 700 pounds if the need arises for a very light car. We have done some testing like this already on our black EVO but found it made no difference. Anyway, the MD has a PAU (Power Absorption Unit) which looks like a very large electric motor with no outer cover. The car starts out and as the speed increases the PAU puts more and more load on the car. The Power @ 50 mph number is used as a base number to vary the load the car needs. So (this is not right as it is not linear but...) at 25 mph the PAU is putting a 7.5 hp load on the car, at 50 mph it is putting a 15.1 HP load on the car at 100 it is putting a 30.2 hp load on the car, etc. Actually I believe to double your speed it is 4x's the HP, but you get the idea.
Tuning on our old Dynojet we would spend hours dialing in the AFR's. Take the car off the dyno, go to the track and run like ***. We'd end up adding a ton of fuel to the car. Now that we have wide bands and such we found what was wrong. The load is not enough and the AFR's on the Dynojet would come out at 11.5:1 (for example) but once on the street would be 12.7:1. Looking back when we were tuning at 12.5:1 I am surprised we didn't loose more engines with the extremely lean conditions we must have had.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
#35
Originally Posted by davidbuschur
Most Dynojets have no load features. I guess they have recently released one. A Dynojet is just a set of rolls, some small, some large and some AWD's large and small on the same dyno. Nothing there but the mass (weight) of the rollers. When the car initially starts to move it has to overcome this large amount of weight, which typically outweighs any car loaded on it) and then once they are spinning there is basically no resistance at all.
A Mustang Dyno works opposite. Our particular dyno has small rollers. It is built for "imports". The roll weight is very close to that of a Subaru or EVO and I can make a change to the dyno to drop the roll weight another 700 pounds if the need arises for a very light car. We have done some testing like this already on our black EVO but found it made no difference. Anyway, the MD has a PAU (Power Absorption Unit) which looks like a very large electric motor with no outer cover. The car starts out and as the speed increases the PAU puts more and more load on the car. The Power @ 50 mph number is used as a base number to vary the load the car needs. So (this is not right as it is not linear but...) at 25 mph the PAU is putting a 7.5 hp load on the car, at 50 mph it is putting a 15.1 HP load on the car at 100 it is putting a 30.2 hp load on the car, etc. Actually I believe to double your speed it is 4x's the HP, but you get the idea.
Tuning on our old Dynojet we would spend hours dialing in the AFR's. Take the car off the dyno, go to the track and run like ***. We'd end up adding a ton of fuel to the car. Now that we have wide bands and such we found what was wrong. The load is not enough and the AFR's on the Dynojet would come out at 11.5:1 (for example) but once on the street would be 12.7:1. Looking back when we were tuning at 12.5:1 I am surprised we didn't loose more engines with the extremely lean conditions we must have had.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
A Mustang Dyno works opposite. Our particular dyno has small rollers. It is built for "imports". The roll weight is very close to that of a Subaru or EVO and I can make a change to the dyno to drop the roll weight another 700 pounds if the need arises for a very light car. We have done some testing like this already on our black EVO but found it made no difference. Anyway, the MD has a PAU (Power Absorption Unit) which looks like a very large electric motor with no outer cover. The car starts out and as the speed increases the PAU puts more and more load on the car. The Power @ 50 mph number is used as a base number to vary the load the car needs. So (this is not right as it is not linear but...) at 25 mph the PAU is putting a 7.5 hp load on the car, at 50 mph it is putting a 15.1 HP load on the car at 100 it is putting a 30.2 hp load on the car, etc. Actually I believe to double your speed it is 4x's the HP, but you get the idea.
Tuning on our old Dynojet we would spend hours dialing in the AFR's. Take the car off the dyno, go to the track and run like ***. We'd end up adding a ton of fuel to the car. Now that we have wide bands and such we found what was wrong. The load is not enough and the AFR's on the Dynojet would come out at 11.5:1 (for example) but once on the street would be 12.7:1. Looking back when we were tuning at 12.5:1 I am surprised we didn't loose more engines with the extremely lean conditions we must have had.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
The Buschur Sponsored Evo 8 T2 SCCA race car which was tuned on the Mustang Dyno at Buschur then went to Mid Ohio track where it was data logged with the new Dyno Flash data logging program which recorded a full 20 minute practice session which everaged 1.39 per lap (a brisk pace to say the least). The amazing thing was that the data logged showed that the a/f targets under actual road racing conditions were virtually IDENTICAL to the trace on the dyno
I made a slight correction in the low rpm area and the car went back to the dyno where it put down exactly the same number it made before
The new corrected a/f curve was again duplicted on the dyno
I am 100% confident taking a car off a Mustang dyno and letting it go without evan a road test - its that accurate.
#37
Originally Posted by DynoFlash
Just to elaborate on this concept a bit further . . . .
The Buschur Sponsored Evo 8 T2 SCCA race car which was tuned on the Mustang Dyno at Buschur then went to Mid Ohio track where it was data logged with the new Dyno Flash data logging program which recorded a full 20 minute practice session which everaged 1.39 per lap (a brisk pace to say the least). The amazing thing was that the data logged showed that the a/f targets under actual road racing conditions were virtually IDENTICAL to the trace on the dyno
I made a slight correction in the low rpm area and the car went back to the dyno where it put down exactly the same number it made before
The new corrected a/f curve was again duplicted on the dyno
I am 100% confident taking a car off a Mustang dyno and letting it go without evan a road test - its that accurate.
The Buschur Sponsored Evo 8 T2 SCCA race car which was tuned on the Mustang Dyno at Buschur then went to Mid Ohio track where it was data logged with the new Dyno Flash data logging program which recorded a full 20 minute practice session which everaged 1.39 per lap (a brisk pace to say the least). The amazing thing was that the data logged showed that the a/f targets under actual road racing conditions were virtually IDENTICAL to the trace on the dyno
I made a slight correction in the low rpm area and the car went back to the dyno where it put down exactly the same number it made before
The new corrected a/f curve was again duplicted on the dyno
I am 100% confident taking a car off a Mustang dyno and letting it go without evan a road test - its that accurate.
acutally dyno design is a pretty interesting place to apply ingenuity and i wonder how far they've gotten. you can apply more simulated inertia in several ways. one is to somehow modify the moment of inertia of the rollers, if there were expanding weights inside. another is to attatch other rollers with no gearing, something like a chain driven auxillary roller or multiple ones. if dyno companies made such elaborate devices then you could have the exact simulation of the road EVERY time.
the actual number of hte power in hp is totally subjective. cuz what are they really measuring anyway? it's certainly not the amount of gas that is burning... they're tryinna say how much you're moving the mass right... :\ eh. i think if it were all about strict science... there'd only be one dyno commpany, or... rather... all dynos would be the same.
#39
Originally Posted by 3000ways
Very interesting thread, I finally may be getting an EVO in Feb., so I'm very interested in the results of this thread.
#41
Originally Posted by DynoFlash
The Buschur Sponsored Evo 8 T2 SCCA race car which was tuned on the Mustang Dyno at Buschur then went to Mid Ohio track where it was data logged with the new Dyno Flash data logging program which recorded a full 20 minute practice session which everaged 1.39 per lap (a brisk pace to say the least).
Just a quick note on this to midwest roadracers. The 1:39 lap time obviously caught my eye as I have alot of time on Midohio now with my EVO. One important note to point out is that the front chicane(turns 2 and 3) were blocked off for this race giving racers a direct path to the keyhole after turn 1. This is usually only done for the professional Cart race and apparently was a first for the Runoffs. This will make the lap times a lot faster than what you would normally compare the lap time to at Midohio. I'm trying to find out how much time turns 2 and 3 would normally add to an EVOish type car as the 1:39 time still seems very impressive nonetheless.
If you've never been to Midohio, I apologize for rambling about something that you would have no clue as to what I'm talking about
#43
After getting tuned at Buschur last week. I compared my A/F from the dyno to my A/F at home on the street with my wideband. I will have to agree with Al and Dave that it is almost identical.
#44
Here are the dyno sheets from BONE stock to Stage 1, and then the 2nd is Stage 1 to Stage 2. David asked me to post these as he is dyno tuning a car right now. Sorry for the delay guys!
Jarrod
Buschur Racing Inc.
Jarrod
Buschur Racing Inc.
#45
Keep in mind that on these two dyno sheets the Stage 1 comparison compared to the Stage 2 was on the EXACT same boost levels, EXACT same flash, the gains were from the parts only. Nice.
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com
David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com