nrcooled

iTrader: (4)

I couldn't agree more! There are a lot of people (including me) that look at a thread and go "wow, you made XXhp from one mod!" Then they run out and buy said mod and can't figure out what went wrong when the CEL comes on.

I have learned my lesson and plan to do more to build my Evo properly and have more fun then ever. The car will continue to be tracked but it will also be monitored and maintained right. I am not talking about fluid changes and tire rotations, instead I will be monitoring temps, AFR, internals, timing tables, fueling tables and making the appropriate changes with advise from my tuner, the knowledgeable folks here, and the FSM.

jj_008

iTrader: (8)

I have been road tuning my setup and I think I have been doing a pretty good job. This Saturday, I will be letting Shiv custom tune it on the dyno. It should be interesting. Hopefully, i'll get to learn a few things from Shiv in the process.

Az3ar

iTrader: (18)

This is a very good post.

I don’t know much about tuning myself but I am chiming in because I do a lot of track days (over 15 last year and will be over 30 this year).

I have seen how my car reacted on the track under extreme conditions and learned that if you want to race on the road course you should keep the car stock engine wise. I had the chance to try 2 different tunes from 2 different tuners and they were both good but as said above there is no tuner out there that is going to spend countless hours on my car or your car to watch and read each cell. What about if I had more weight that day on the track or less (like the guys said above) what if I had bad gas, good gas, down hill up hill…. Many variables comes to mind and that’s when I saw BMWs and Porsches on the track with over 150K on the odometer flying with out one single issue. These cars had one thing in common, they were STOCK. They had the software that was designed by the car manufacture for years and years if not decades for best reliability and maximum safe performance.

Yes road racing is stressful to the car but not as much as everyone thinks. Again it depends on the driver and the car. If its stock ECU I almost can guarantee that it WON’T brake….

Yes a flash or piggy back is nice in QM track or on the streets but for guys like me and Norcoold this does not work…(noorcoold, I will send you a pm because even your 2.3 could not be the road reliable racing you are looking for) We need to go in and mash the pedal to the ground and come out. I agree engine failure might occur but chances are a 100 times slimmer with stock tune and hey Mitsu or who ever might cover it under warranty.

What I am trying to get to here is that if you want some small bursts of power runs then hey go and get a tune 99% your engine won’t fail because you are still not putting all the stress on the engine. However if you are racing (real race) then call it a day and call it 271HP rated from Mitsu and backed by there red wall of human flesh.

Tuners can say I am better no I am not your tune is #$@#$ or no no you F##@$#@ but in the end you have to know that stock tune is superior and no one can match it.

ARP studs, I find it so ironic why most tuners say ARP ARP is the way to go… Well correct me if I am wrong but using ARP on the top or the bottom would have created extra stress on other parts since not all the parts are taking the job equally anymore. The head on 4G63 actually lifts under high boost so what happens with ARP? Does it lift? Maybe it lifts less right? So if that’s the case then pistons have greater pressure on them and bearing and so on.

This engine been out since mid 80s please take it for what’s its worth and respect what it can do to a limit.

Az3ar

iTrader: (18)

It seems that you do some track days often and I just would hate to see you in the same spot a year from now. I just want you to be sure that who ever tunes your 2.3 or builds it knows what they are putting themselves into. They have to know that your car is not some dyno queen or QM one run queen and that you are looking for ultimate reliability followed by performance.

Am I speaking your mind here or am I wrong? I am a track guy all summer long and with 168 HP on 325is BMW spec E30 I was able to spank many STIs and EVOs. The driver is the ultimate solution not HP and I am sure you know that.

I am just trying to push the fact the tuner must know that this is a road race car NOT one run pass.

Good luck and let me know if I can help.

Technical XTC

Yeah but a 325IS is a VERY balanced car with a very balanced chassis. And those cars are under rated with theit power. I had a 1995 and I think they stated was 180hp or so, it was much faster then suggested.

gsujeff55

iTrader: (4)

obviously those were some very under par drivers. in my first 3 track days EVER with the evo i was walking liscensed drivers in their e36 3 series(even Ms) cars.

Az3ar

iTrader: (18)

Are you in the green group or the yellow?

Well balanced E36 are very fast on the track. No disrespect bud but by the end of this year I will be an instructor would you like some lessons?


Dont even bring the M in because sure you will see his tail lights with an exprianced driver. you just had a GREEN groupeeee

Technical XTC

I think an MR handles better then a much heavier M3, atleast the latest M3's.

Ludikraut

iTrader: (17)

Before you make a buying decision, or hopefully at least before you start the build ... read up on ShaunSG's post on stroker motors, and other stuff. He has posted some very good general engine build info (not necessarily Evo specific).

Some advice, if I may, on getting your engine built:
- Have the shop break in the new engine (i.e. have them put 500+ miles on it to seat the piston rings)
- Get an acceptable level of oil consumption that the new engine will have (preferably in writing)
- run a conservative street tune on the track with unleaded racegas in the tank
- upgrade your brakes, or get a set of track-only brakes, you'll need them with the extra punch of a 2.3

Some questions/comments:
- what are you doing in regards to cooling? (radiator, oil, etc.)
- are you ever planning on running slicks? if so, look into steering pump cooling/upgrades

l8r)

ShaunSG

iTrader: (1)

Thanks Ludikraut, a friend brought my attention to your post.


Good points. One thing though...

A high performance / race engine built and honed right will have its rings seat within minutes of first fire up because of good bore geometry and the right finish. No 500 mile run in needed.


Regards

TrinaBabe

iTrader: (3)

Thats what I have been doing on mine yes. Not sure if you mean thats too much or too little but thats what works for me. Obviously you dont take the whole tune and back it down 6 degrees but in the spots that the car likes to knock more (Usually in the 5k range) I will back it down about 2-3 degrees from where I consider on the edge. I have beat the hell out of my car for 10k miles at relatively high boost with a 35R without any problems. Its fast enough for me to kill things like Vipers so it must be working ok. It is also the stock motor and never had an engine problem of any kind and Im revving it to around 8k whenever I drive it spiritidly.

And whats with this other guy trying to be a bigshot to me? For one thing, this is Tim not Trina. She doesnt post nearly as much as I do. Secondly, no offense but your the little guy that said you dont tune your own car so dont try to pretend you know anything about it. I never said I was the greatest but I seem to be doing ok all by my loneself. Have you read any threads I made about blowing an engine? Nope.... Im sure Im just lucky though right?

4G63>OOOO

iTrader: (1)

While I can appreciate your enthusiasm (Been there, bought the track time), a properly set up Evo will lap a properly set up E36 M3. You can fit a lot more tire under an Evo, have a ton more grip than an M3 and given the same budget, the Evo will be faster.

I was driving around E36's when my car was stock at Summit Point my first event.

As for being an instructor by the end of the year, you may very well be, but don't think that's because you're a great driver. These clubs need instructors and as soon as they see that you can get your *** out of trouble without freezing up, you usually make instructor.

"Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach"

Joe

EVO8LTW

iTrader: (41)

It is pretty surprising how fast you can advance through the ranks with some organizations. With NASA particularly, my first track day I was HPDE1. My second I was HPDE2 and about my 4th I was HPDE3. Similarly, at Summit Point, I did FATT group 1 for one day and then from then on I was in FATT Group 2 and Seat Time events with no instructor (eventually, I figured out that it was dumb to do track days with no instructor and insisted on an instructor for every school after that). The funny thing also was that I was actually one of the faster cars on the track driving a bolt-on Camaro of all things. The perfect of example of how big rubber and HP > balance and finesse.

shiv@vishnu

iTrader: (20)

I've been instructing in the ranks of SCCA for 6 or 7 years now. That should tell you what kind of qualifications are necessary to become an amateur instructor.. lol. I stopped a couple of years ago simple because I realized that I shouldn't be teaching other people my bad habits. Bad habits which, hopefully, I'll learn to correct in the next 10 years or so. No offense Az3ar but its real important to stay humble. Especially when you are just now at the early portion of your learning curve. Big heads make big mistakes!

shiv

SuperHatch

iTrader: (23)

I think what Shiv was getting at is that 1 degree of timing can mean 10lbs of torque... so if you're coming down 2-3 degrees, you're leaving a lot of power on the table... this very recent thread proves that -

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=185643

I think you're actually talking about me since I was the guy talking in the other thread. I never claimed to be a big shot. All I said is I'd rather leave the tuning up to the professionals. If that makes me less of a man, then....

I also never said that you claimed to be the greatest...

Just food for thought, do you think maybe your engine has never blown up because you're tuning it SOOOO safely? Very far from the edge of destruction? Yeah, it works, yeah, it's fast, but it COULD be better, right? That's all I'm getting at here....

And I still stand by the fact that not all turbo kits are the same, and you'll find the overwhelming majority agree on this point. I understand your desire to defend your g/f, I do the same thing. But we all have learning curves, myself included. And I don't think just because she's a girl and it's cool that she has a fast car that she should allowed to get away with posting false information. So many guys are leg humpers and will yes her to death just to fulfill some sick online fantasy of theirs that will never happen.