EVO Green/20gLT information and new dyno charts.
Jan 9, 2007, 07:45 AM
#106
The FPEVOGreen Model turbocharger:
Externally this turbo appears to be a stock EVO9 turbo. It uses factory castings so that all external features remain OEM in appearance and function. All bolt holes and thread sizes are exactly the same as the stock turbocharger. This is done to avoid the common problems associated with having aftermarket turbochargers on street cars.
There are only 2 options with this turbocharger. The options are to add a gasket matching port job to the turbine housing or add a HP wastegate actuator.
There is 1mm of housing overhang in some areas of the turbine housing (TH) inlet, this very slight mismatch can be corrected by selecting the optional turbine housing port job.
The other option for this turbocharger is to add the 18psi HP actuator. The actuator features a heavier spring and does not crack open until boost reaches 18psi. Applications running high boost such as race gas or methanol injection will benefit from the extra spring pressure. Using the HP actuator will result in retaining more boost higher into the RPM range compared to the stock actuator (11psi). The HP actuator isn't going to make much difference on pump gas cars running 18-20psi, but it isn't going to hurt anything either. The HP actuator does not retain a 100% stock appearance. It is identifiable by the 2 studs and small weld bead on the actuator bracket as shown in the product picture. So if you are going for 100% stealth, be aware that educated eyes can identify the actuator. Be also advised that boost cannot be set BELOW 18psi when using the HP actuator, a concern for those who are not prepared to run their car at the intended power level for some reason.
The compressor and turbine housings are the largest OEM pieces available from the entire production life of Evolution footprint. The turbine housing is a 10.5cm2 nozzle housing and the compressor housing is the larger diffuser EVO9 casting.
The 69mm 5blade CNC machined compressor wheel has a flow rating of 47lb/min and pressure ratio capability beyond 3.7:1 which allows for over 30psi boost pressure and RPM range beyond 8krpm.
The turbine wheel is larger in diameter than the stock TD05H. The larger diameter significantly increase the turbine flow and reduce turbine blockage in the housing compared to a stock TD05H turbine wheel.
The combination of improved compressor and turbine flow characteristics results in a very wide RPM range performance increase. Spool up is very stock like, with part throttle boost being easily achieved at low engine RPM for city driving. Absent from this turbo is any hint of compressor surge. Even 5th gear WOT pulls starting at 2krpm do not result in compressor surge. Mid range and top end performance are dramatically improved as a result of the increased airflow capacity of the compressor and turbine sections.
A basic test car was prepared to demonstrate the characteristics of the turbocharger. Turbocharger boost response was carefully measured. The test car was a 2006 EVO9 RS with about 2500miles on it at the time of the tests. The car was only very mildly modified from it’s stock configuration at this point with only a Comp 280plus exhaust camshaft and 3" catback for mods.
The car was modified with the EVOGreen Model turbocharger and a larger 3” DP cat test pipe and O2 housing. An ECUTek reflash was used for tuning and a Greddy Emanage was used for data acquisition. No other modifications or changes were made to the car. Everything else remained as supplied by Mitsubishi. No porting of the manifold or turbine housing was performed, these pieces were used as cast.
The datalogs of the test car showed the excellent spool up of this turbocharger on even a very mildly prepared car. The EVOGreen Model will attain 1 bar boost before 3200rpm in 4th gear and at 2700rpm in 5th gear. Datalogs for each test show the Boost pressure, RPM, and AirFlow Meter Hz for reference. Notice that the Boost pressure trace is flat and has ablolutely no trace of compressor surge. Max Hz observed on the test car was between 2000-2100Hz with pump gas.
Even lugging along in 5th gear at 3100rpm and 20psi for several seconds will not induce compressor surge. Part throttle boost in 5th gear is very productive and very useful for mundane tasks such as passing minvans and UPS trucks on the interstate.
Spool up with the stock turbo and stock DP was virtually the same as the EVOGreen model and aftermarket DP. We considered running the EVOGreen with the stock DP, but it seemed out of character. Nobody is going to run the upgraded turbo with a stock DP so the test was declared irrelevant.
The car was dyno’d at Alamo Autosports on their AWD Dynojet Chassis Dyno.
We were short on time, so instead of tuning the car we decided to just make three pulls and call it a day. The pulls were made on straight 93 octane fuel without any supplemental methanol or water injection. Boost pressure was fluctuating a bit due to the “raw” nature of the boost control maps within ECU but stayed in the 20-24psi range. The boost spike/overshoot is almost visible on the dyno graph. A word of caution, using the stock ECU for boost control is a *****. Expect to spend a few hours recalibrating the control maps.
For comparison, bone stock EVO9 are putting 245whp to the wheels on this same dynojet. The test car did 357whp and 337ftlb TQ on the second pull, the third pull was a little lower due to the car getting heat soaked. Not bad for a car with a turbo, exhaust system and exhaust cam upgrade running on straight pump gas.
Is there more in it? Yeah, there always is, but that is what you can expect if you slap some parts on a stock car and hit the dyno.
Dyno and quarter mile performance was shown to be excellent at the opposite end of the spectrum in the well prepared test vehicles of David Buschur and Curt Brown. These two cars showed ¼ mile ET in the 10.50-10.90 second range with speed in the 127-129mph range. Dyno results from these test vehicles showed power to be in the 420-450whp range. Dyno graphs for these cars are also shown to demonstrate the full potential of the EVOGreen Model turbocharger.
UPDATE: 11/14/06 these units are in stock and ready to ship.
Externally this turbo appears to be a stock EVO9 turbo. It uses factory castings so that all external features remain OEM in appearance and function. All bolt holes and thread sizes are exactly the same as the stock turbocharger. This is done to avoid the common problems associated with having aftermarket turbochargers on street cars.
There are only 2 options with this turbocharger. The options are to add a gasket matching port job to the turbine housing or add a HP wastegate actuator.
There is 1mm of housing overhang in some areas of the turbine housing (TH) inlet, this very slight mismatch can be corrected by selecting the optional turbine housing port job.
The other option for this turbocharger is to add the 18psi HP actuator. The actuator features a heavier spring and does not crack open until boost reaches 18psi. Applications running high boost such as race gas or methanol injection will benefit from the extra spring pressure. Using the HP actuator will result in retaining more boost higher into the RPM range compared to the stock actuator (11psi). The HP actuator isn't going to make much difference on pump gas cars running 18-20psi, but it isn't going to hurt anything either. The HP actuator does not retain a 100% stock appearance. It is identifiable by the 2 studs and small weld bead on the actuator bracket as shown in the product picture. So if you are going for 100% stealth, be aware that educated eyes can identify the actuator. Be also advised that boost cannot be set BELOW 18psi when using the HP actuator, a concern for those who are not prepared to run their car at the intended power level for some reason.
The compressor and turbine housings are the largest OEM pieces available from the entire production life of Evolution footprint. The turbine housing is a 10.5cm2 nozzle housing and the compressor housing is the larger diffuser EVO9 casting.
The 69mm 5blade CNC machined compressor wheel has a flow rating of 47lb/min and pressure ratio capability beyond 3.7:1 which allows for over 30psi boost pressure and RPM range beyond 8krpm.
The turbine wheel is larger in diameter than the stock TD05H. The larger diameter significantly increase the turbine flow and reduce turbine blockage in the housing compared to a stock TD05H turbine wheel.
The combination of improved compressor and turbine flow characteristics results in a very wide RPM range performance increase. Spool up is very stock like, with part throttle boost being easily achieved at low engine RPM for city driving. Absent from this turbo is any hint of compressor surge. Even 5th gear WOT pulls starting at 2krpm do not result in compressor surge. Mid range and top end performance are dramatically improved as a result of the increased airflow capacity of the compressor and turbine sections.
A basic test car was prepared to demonstrate the characteristics of the turbocharger. Turbocharger boost response was carefully measured. The test car was a 2006 EVO9 RS with about 2500miles on it at the time of the tests. The car was only very mildly modified from it’s stock configuration at this point with only a Comp 280plus exhaust camshaft and 3" catback for mods.
The car was modified with the EVOGreen Model turbocharger and a larger 3” DP cat test pipe and O2 housing. An ECUTek reflash was used for tuning and a Greddy Emanage was used for data acquisition. No other modifications or changes were made to the car. Everything else remained as supplied by Mitsubishi. No porting of the manifold or turbine housing was performed, these pieces were used as cast.
The datalogs of the test car showed the excellent spool up of this turbocharger on even a very mildly prepared car. The EVOGreen Model will attain 1 bar boost before 3200rpm in 4th gear and at 2700rpm in 5th gear. Datalogs for each test show the Boost pressure, RPM, and AirFlow Meter Hz for reference. Notice that the Boost pressure trace is flat and has ablolutely no trace of compressor surge. Max Hz observed on the test car was between 2000-2100Hz with pump gas.
Even lugging along in 5th gear at 3100rpm and 20psi for several seconds will not induce compressor surge. Part throttle boost in 5th gear is very productive and very useful for mundane tasks such as passing minvans and UPS trucks on the interstate.
Spool up with the stock turbo and stock DP was virtually the same as the EVOGreen model and aftermarket DP. We considered running the EVOGreen with the stock DP, but it seemed out of character. Nobody is going to run the upgraded turbo with a stock DP so the test was declared irrelevant.
The car was dyno’d at Alamo Autosports on their AWD Dynojet Chassis Dyno.
We were short on time, so instead of tuning the car we decided to just make three pulls and call it a day. The pulls were made on straight 93 octane fuel without any supplemental methanol or water injection. Boost pressure was fluctuating a bit due to the “raw” nature of the boost control maps within ECU but stayed in the 20-24psi range. The boost spike/overshoot is almost visible on the dyno graph. A word of caution, using the stock ECU for boost control is a *****. Expect to spend a few hours recalibrating the control maps.
For comparison, bone stock EVO9 are putting 245whp to the wheels on this same dynojet. The test car did 357whp and 337ftlb TQ on the second pull, the third pull was a little lower due to the car getting heat soaked. Not bad for a car with a turbo, exhaust system and exhaust cam upgrade running on straight pump gas.
Is there more in it? Yeah, there always is, but that is what you can expect if you slap some parts on a stock car and hit the dyno.
Dyno and quarter mile performance was shown to be excellent at the opposite end of the spectrum in the well prepared test vehicles of David Buschur and Curt Brown. These two cars showed ¼ mile ET in the 10.50-10.90 second range with speed in the 127-129mph range. Dyno results from these test vehicles showed power to be in the 420-450whp range. Dyno graphs for these cars are also shown to demonstrate the full potential of the EVOGreen Model turbocharger.
Jan 9, 2007, 10:32 AM
#108
So you all know. I didn't know about this new rebuilt/core option. After seeing this same link I visited it. Talked to Robert this morning and we can offer this too. You can send them in here if you like. I may even try to keep a few here to exchange quickly.
Jan 9, 2007, 05:40 PM
#113
Called today and briefly talked with Brain about the upgrade option when you are trading in the evo9-20g-5. The price to upgrade is 895. I thought that price was really unfair. Hear is why.
green new . you buy a new 9 turbo for 700, costs 1000 to upgrade it. Total 1700
send them your current good used 9. costs 1000 to upgrade to green. used 9 turbo is about 500 so you save 200. total 1500.
buy new white rabbit 9. 1350. send in for green upgrade. add another 900. total 2250. yikes!!!!.
buy used white rabbit 9. about 900-1000. send in for green upgrade. add another 900. still yikes, Total 1800-1900. buy new white rabbit (no longer available) for 1350. new 9 turbo 700. costs 650 to upgrade the compressor side to white rabbit spec.
send used 9 turbo to be upgraded to white rabbit. (no longer available) but cost 750.
so the upgrade on the compressor side is half the costs of upgrading a 9 turbo to a green. if someone was to actually pay the 900 to have their white rabbit upgraded to a green, they would be paying for the upgraded compressor twice.
if you break down the costs of build in the green it cost 1000 to do. How much of that is the compressor upgrade? and how much of that is the turbine upgrade? the price to upgrade the white rabbit to a green should be in the 500 range. since the upgraded compressor side is already done and payed for. Anyone else see the logic????????
hopefully FP will see the logic and correct this.
green new . you buy a new 9 turbo for 700, costs 1000 to upgrade it. Total 1700
send them your current good used 9. costs 1000 to upgrade to green. used 9 turbo is about 500 so you save 200. total 1500.
buy new white rabbit 9. 1350. send in for green upgrade. add another 900. total 2250. yikes!!!!.
buy used white rabbit 9. about 900-1000. send in for green upgrade. add another 900. still yikes, Total 1800-1900. buy new white rabbit (no longer available) for 1350. new 9 turbo 700. costs 650 to upgrade the compressor side to white rabbit spec.
send used 9 turbo to be upgraded to white rabbit. (no longer available) but cost 750.
so the upgrade on the compressor side is half the costs of upgrading a 9 turbo to a green. if someone was to actually pay the 900 to have their white rabbit upgraded to a green, they would be paying for the upgraded compressor twice.
if you break down the costs of build in the green it cost 1000 to do. How much of that is the compressor upgrade? and how much of that is the turbine upgrade? the price to upgrade the white rabbit to a green should be in the 500 range. since the upgraded compressor side is already done and payed for. Anyone else see the logic????????
hopefully FP will see the logic and correct this.
Last edited by 94AWDcoupe; Jan 9, 2007 at 05:50 PM.
Jan 9, 2007, 07:33 PM
#115
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Can someone explain to me why we should have to pay extra for the port job when you would think that would of already been done since we are paying for a "NEW" turbo upgrade???
Jan 9, 2007, 07:37 PM
#117
Porting is always an additional cost, not sure why anyone would think otherwise. If you want to save the 65 bucks, get a 20 dollar grinder and a 10 dollar carbide bit and do it yourself. I prefer to do my own porting anyway so I can tailer it to my specific needs. But to be perfectly honest, it's worth every penny to pay someone else to do it. It's ****ty work.
Jan 9, 2007, 08:02 PM
#118
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HAHAHA, Dave you just don't get it. Logic doesn't work on evolutionm.net. First they ***** about $1,700 so I show them how to get it for $1,000 and then they ***** about that.
You can't win man, but damn I sure do appreciate how hard you keep trying for those of us that "get it".
You can't win man, but damn I sure do appreciate how hard you keep trying for those of us that "get it".
Jan 9, 2007, 08:48 PM
#119
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Im not *****ing about the price of the turbo David. Im just asking why is it an "option" to pay more to fix this:
"there is 1mm of housing overhang in some areas of the turbine housing (TH) inlet, this very slight mismatch can be corrected
I just thought that since this New turbo upgrade has this little mismatch problem you would address it and future turbos would come ported and good to go. Im not trying to offend anyone, just my opinion.
"there is 1mm of housing overhang in some areas of the turbine housing (TH) inlet, this very slight mismatch can be corrected
I just thought that since this New turbo upgrade has this little mismatch problem you would address it and future turbos would come ported and good to go. Im not trying to offend anyone, just my opinion.
Jan 9, 2007, 09:20 PM
#120
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DB posted a while back on why the green costs what it does, quick search i am sure you ll find it.
Its well worth the cost for alot of people that want the extra top end with out losing anything down low, ideal for someone who spends alot of time on the road coarse.
Its too bad everyone has to ***** about something, but he i think he said it best...
"Don't like the price? Easy, don't buy it."
Either way i am really looking forward to seeing what his 50 trim and the green will do at mid boost levels (24-25psi) on 100oct. Which ever is goning to give me better power is the direction i am going to go.
Its well worth the cost for alot of people that want the extra top end with out losing anything down low, ideal for someone who spends alot of time on the road coarse.
Its too bad everyone has to ***** about something, but he i think he said it best...
"Don't like the price? Easy, don't buy it."
Either way i am really looking forward to seeing what his 50 trim and the green will do at mid boost levels (24-25psi) on 100oct. Which ever is goning to give me better power is the direction i am going to go.