BLE Solid Timing Belt Tensioner
Jan 11, 2007, 03:13 PM
#16
Evolved Member
iTrader: (41)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Toms River, NJ
Posts: 4,653
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I wasn't going to say this earlier, but it seems like the members that have posted here that "want to know" about this product have already made up their minds that it's the greatest thing since sliced bread. It seem that no matter what opinions or evidence are presented otherwise they will not be swayed in their thinking.
Which then begs the question... why ask?
Which then begs the question... why ask?
Jan 11, 2007, 03:16 PM
#17
There were only two people being subjective in this thread, myself and the OP. Your previous reply states, "Members that have posted here that "want to know"" how can that not be directed towards me.
Anyways, these forums are here to share info. and here both sides of the coin.
Chillen baby, chillen
Anyways, these forums are here to share info. and here both sides of the coin.
Chillen baby, chillen
Jan 12, 2007, 06:37 AM
#18
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Wood Dale, IL
Posts: 1,652
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Superhatch and Soon2BEVO have basicly responded for me!
If you've ever watched a 4g63 run without a timing cover on and watch the action of the hydraulic tensioner, you will see why it is there.
If you've ever watched a 4g63 run without a timing cover on and watch the action of the hydraulic tensioner, you will see why it is there.
Jan 16, 2007, 03:52 AM
#20
Evolved Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 1,228
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'll be honest with you, for this being in the "advanced forum" your rebuttals to this topic are weak.
There is a significant difference from an engineering standpoint when it comes to the valve timing system on a car versus the turbo, IC pipe, etc. Honestly, For a street car, I don't think Mitsu could have done any better on the turbo they've equipped the car with, yes others could make more power, but as far as power delivery and driveability it's hard to improve upon.
Anyway, back on topic...
Belts stretch, period. I don't care what they're made of. If they never stretched and the rubber never degraded, they'd never need to be replaced. That simply isn't the case. A kevlar lined belt may stretch less or more slowly, but it will stretch.
The beauty of the factory hydraulic tensioner, besides the fact that it constantly readjusts for a stretching belt, is also the fact that is applies the correct tension from the get-go. There is no section in the factory manual to deflect the cam timing belt x distance with y force to determine if tension is correct. You simply pull the pin out of the tensioner and it applies the correct force. Who is to determine the correct preload with this manual tensioner?
The ONLY upside I see to this piece is what was already mentioned. It can't fail... however, I have never seen a stock tensioner fail so this point holds little weight to me.
The potential to overtension/undertension at installation...
The potential to not readjust soon enough after installation for belt stretch...
The labor intensity of doing a readjust...
...are all big enough points IMO that this simply shouldn't be used in any application with the exception of a dedicated race car running such an aggressive cam/valvespring setup that would simply stress the belt so much as to compress the factory tensioner. Those cases are FEW and FAR between.
- Steve
P.S. - It was once believed that the hydraulic lifters were no good for use over 8000RPM... they're now being taken to 10k+. Just because a part was designed with self-adjustment in mind doesn't mean it's a bad thing. I mean, your parking brake self adjusts, should that feature be deleted to adjust it manually? I hardly think so...
There is a significant difference from an engineering standpoint when it comes to the valve timing system on a car versus the turbo, IC pipe, etc. Honestly, For a street car, I don't think Mitsu could have done any better on the turbo they've equipped the car with, yes others could make more power, but as far as power delivery and driveability it's hard to improve upon.
Anyway, back on topic...
Belts stretch, period. I don't care what they're made of. If they never stretched and the rubber never degraded, they'd never need to be replaced. That simply isn't the case. A kevlar lined belt may stretch less or more slowly, but it will stretch.
The beauty of the factory hydraulic tensioner, besides the fact that it constantly readjusts for a stretching belt, is also the fact that is applies the correct tension from the get-go. There is no section in the factory manual to deflect the cam timing belt x distance with y force to determine if tension is correct. You simply pull the pin out of the tensioner and it applies the correct force. Who is to determine the correct preload with this manual tensioner?
The ONLY upside I see to this piece is what was already mentioned. It can't fail... however, I have never seen a stock tensioner fail so this point holds little weight to me.
The potential to overtension/undertension at installation...
The potential to not readjust soon enough after installation for belt stretch...
The labor intensity of doing a readjust...
...are all big enough points IMO that this simply shouldn't be used in any application with the exception of a dedicated race car running such an aggressive cam/valvespring setup that would simply stress the belt so much as to compress the factory tensioner. Those cases are FEW and FAR between.
- Steve
P.S. - It was once believed that the hydraulic lifters were no good for use over 8000RPM... they're now being taken to 10k+. Just because a part was designed with self-adjustment in mind doesn't mean it's a bad thing. I mean, your parking brake self adjusts, should that feature be deleted to adjust it manually? I hardly think so...
I understand the differences between the valvetrain system and the external aperatures of the car (ie. turbo, I/C & piping etc..) You said that the belts stretch, and that is exactly what I tried to portray in my first post, saying that theoretically, the kevlar belts keep it to a minumum. I didn't say that I didn't think they would stretch, only keep it to a minimum. And these are the reasons that I am contemplating the piece. I did not already make up my mind with this piece as I posted if you were refering to me, as I always do as much research as I can before I purchase a new piece. Simply put, I wanted some other thoughts/ideas on this as I am going to do a complete overhaul on the head of my car, and am looking to get as much done as I can while I am in there, Preventive Maintenance or not.
Your point of the manual not listing the correct tension, I am going to take a look at my manual because I think that is a very valid point. If that information is not in the manual, then how would someone even know to set the belt to the correct tension? Point very well taken.
Your point about never seeing a stock tensioner fail, very well taken too. In all the searching I did, I couldn't find an instance of the tensioner failing either, but I also know that I have searched for seemingly easy to find things on here, and have had no such luck due to the many names for the same thing, and sphelleng mistakes that people make routinely. So, now I know...
I appreciate your input, as I think it swayed me to want to stick more with the stock piece than the solid piece. I think I am going to take one last good look at the system, and the piece as well, and come to a conclusion as to if I am going to try it out or not. Maybe I can try it for about 3-6,000 miles, and monitor the belt stretch to see if it ever loosens up.
Once again, I appreciated your input as you made a few ideas pop up in my mind...
Last edited by tkklemann; Jan 16, 2007 at 03:55 AM. Reason: Spelling and stuff...
Jan 16, 2007, 03:10 PM
#21
Evolved Member
I agree with Superhatch and GSNT. This part seems like more of a liability than an advantage on anything other than a full on race motor where it will constantly be checked.
Jan 17, 2007, 03:36 AM
#22
Evolved Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 1,228
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think I am starting to see that the con's are outweighing the pro's on this part now. Soooo, I think I am going to pass on it for now...
Thanks all...
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Zombot
Evo X Engine / Turbo / Drivetrain
6
Jul 27, 2017 10:00 AM
bryonboals
For Sale - Miscellaneous Automotive
10
Sep 23, 2012 08:58 AM
vtluu
Evo How To Requests / Questions / Tips
16
Jan 8, 2011 07:57 AM
os2
For Sale - Cars For Sale
8
Dec 30, 2010 11:41 AM
