HKS Turbo upgrade for EVO-> 3037S model?
Jun 9, 2003, 08:13 PM
#16
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Originally posted by BADWRX
In Japan...the kits start at 480,000 JPY. That means the RMR is chargint over 1000 to import them...what a joke.
That is not ridiculious priced from Kansai though. You get an outstanding turbo manifold with a Garrett GT flang, and an HKS 40MM external wastegate.
From RMR, it is a ripoff though.
Andy
In Japan...the kits start at 480,000 JPY. That means the RMR is chargint over 1000 to import them...what a joke.
That is not ridiculious priced from Kansai though. You get an outstanding turbo manifold with a Garrett GT flang, and an HKS 40MM external wastegate.
From RMR, it is a ripoff though.
Andy
One thing is for sure, hks, greddy, blitz are great quality products, and you get what you pay for.
remember mod cheap, mod twice.
Jun 9, 2003, 08:22 PM
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2085 , i think you might be talking about 2835 hks
its a ball bearing turbo and works very nicely in evos. One of my friends has that turbo and makes around 400hp with it.
anything larger 3037 3037s is much too big for a stock evo8, IMO
its a ball bearing turbo and works very nicely in evos. One of my friends has that turbo and makes around 400hp with it.
anything larger 3037 3037s is much too big for a stock evo8, IMO
Jun 10, 2003, 05:10 PM
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Ok, lets clear up some common misconceptions:
1. The turbos on our site in the Evo section are indeed turbos alone, not complete kits. These are not bolt ons by any means, and do require custom fabbing to work...however, they are both common turbos used worldwide on the later model Evo's (5's and up).
2. I have no clue about RM's practices, as we don't deal with them...though I did meat Rhys a couple years back at the Maine Rally (I am told he bought the TM 6.5 I was very close to purchasing after selling my Subaru, but was never able to confirm this). Anyway, he struck me as a very knowledgeable tuner, not to mention a guys whose driving skill is second to none. Charging $1000 markup is not unfair IMHO for that kit, all things considered. What most people don't understand is when buying parts from Japan, you cannot just convert yen to dollar and call it a day. Most vendors in Japan do not wholesale at all, which can make it very difficult for a US based vendor to even source the parts in the first place. Secomd, there are shipping costs (that turbo kit would run around $400 shipping via air feight), customs fees, duties, etc to consider. If we then add that stuff on top of the fact that most vendors in Japan don't wholesale to begin with, and it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that there is not much profit being made on such an expensive kit. Best bet is to order from a source who you know, or have reason to know, can get you the kit in a reasonable amount of time (trust me when I tell you more than 50% of the places that claim they can get JDM stuff cannot).
3. HKS does not use "standard" Garret Turbos - the GT series from HKS are Ballistic based turbos, though the wheel combos are proprietary to HKS. We have tried ordering turbos that duplicate HKS's 3037 and 2835 offerings, only to be told they were not offered to the public. HKS is one of the largest afternarket performance brands in the world, and have been tuning Japanese cars longer than many Evo owners have been alive. Is their stuff expensive? If price is your only consideration when making a purchase, then yes. But, the amount of R&D that goes into a product before they bring it to market is unmatched in the industry. Further, every part they sell fits, without exception, as advertised. The of course is the tech support offered, and their warranty program. So, are their parts expensive? Relative to what they provide, I think their prices are justified, and bringing value per dollar is one of the reasons we offer their products.
4. The 1G and 2G manifold are interchangeable, as is the manifold from an Evo 1-3. The Evo 4 and up have a different flange design, and the Evo 5 and up (may include the 4 as well..have never seen one in person) featrure the twin scroll manifold, which again is altogether different.
5. I have personally driven Evo 5's and 6's on 3037S systems, and they are very driveable on the street....it is all down to proper parts selection, and more importantly, competant tuning.
6. As we get the update to our site done, we'll have full specs on teh Kansai kits, as well as on the Greddy kits, which are very popular in the UK and Japan.
7. As for the JIC manifold, it too is a very nice piece, but is a direct replacement for the factory manifold. HKS offers a similar product, that again, replaces the factory manifold, and bolts to the factory turbo. The manifolds from HKS Kansai, Trust and others, are all designed to use those specific brands turbos (for HKS its either their 2835 or the 3037S; for Trust/GReddy its their Mitsubishi based 25G), as well as external wastegates. These kits come complete with the hard parts needed, though fuel delivery and engine management are left up to the buyer/tuner.
Happy boosting!
Adam
1. The turbos on our site in the Evo section are indeed turbos alone, not complete kits. These are not bolt ons by any means, and do require custom fabbing to work...however, they are both common turbos used worldwide on the later model Evo's (5's and up).
2. I have no clue about RM's practices, as we don't deal with them...though I did meat Rhys a couple years back at the Maine Rally (I am told he bought the TM 6.5 I was very close to purchasing after selling my Subaru, but was never able to confirm this). Anyway, he struck me as a very knowledgeable tuner, not to mention a guys whose driving skill is second to none. Charging $1000 markup is not unfair IMHO for that kit, all things considered. What most people don't understand is when buying parts from Japan, you cannot just convert yen to dollar and call it a day. Most vendors in Japan do not wholesale at all, which can make it very difficult for a US based vendor to even source the parts in the first place. Secomd, there are shipping costs (that turbo kit would run around $400 shipping via air feight), customs fees, duties, etc to consider. If we then add that stuff on top of the fact that most vendors in Japan don't wholesale to begin with, and it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that there is not much profit being made on such an expensive kit. Best bet is to order from a source who you know, or have reason to know, can get you the kit in a reasonable amount of time (trust me when I tell you more than 50% of the places that claim they can get JDM stuff cannot).
3. HKS does not use "standard" Garret Turbos - the GT series from HKS are Ballistic based turbos, though the wheel combos are proprietary to HKS. We have tried ordering turbos that duplicate HKS's 3037 and 2835 offerings, only to be told they were not offered to the public. HKS is one of the largest afternarket performance brands in the world, and have been tuning Japanese cars longer than many Evo owners have been alive. Is their stuff expensive? If price is your only consideration when making a purchase, then yes. But, the amount of R&D that goes into a product before they bring it to market is unmatched in the industry. Further, every part they sell fits, without exception, as advertised. The of course is the tech support offered, and their warranty program. So, are their parts expensive? Relative to what they provide, I think their prices are justified, and bringing value per dollar is one of the reasons we offer their products.
4. The 1G and 2G manifold are interchangeable, as is the manifold from an Evo 1-3. The Evo 4 and up have a different flange design, and the Evo 5 and up (may include the 4 as well..have never seen one in person) featrure the twin scroll manifold, which again is altogether different.
5. I have personally driven Evo 5's and 6's on 3037S systems, and they are very driveable on the street....it is all down to proper parts selection, and more importantly, competant tuning.
6. As we get the update to our site done, we'll have full specs on teh Kansai kits, as well as on the Greddy kits, which are very popular in the UK and Japan.
7. As for the JIC manifold, it too is a very nice piece, but is a direct replacement for the factory manifold. HKS offers a similar product, that again, replaces the factory manifold, and bolts to the factory turbo. The manifolds from HKS Kansai, Trust and others, are all designed to use those specific brands turbos (for HKS its either their 2835 or the 3037S; for Trust/GReddy its their Mitsubishi based 25G), as well as external wastegates. These kits come complete with the hard parts needed, though fuel delivery and engine management are left up to the buyer/tuner.
Happy boosting!
Adam
Last edited by Z1 Performance; Jun 10, 2003 at 05:14 PM.
Jun 10, 2003, 05:58 PM
#19
Originally posted by Z1 Performance
Ok, lets clear up some common misconceptions:
1. The turbos on our site in the Evo section are indeed turbos alone, not complete kits. These are not bolt ons by any means, and do require custom fabbing to work...however, they are both common turbos used worldwide on the later model Evo's (5's and up).
2. I have no clue about RM's practices, as we don't deal with them...though I did meat Rhys a couple years back at the Maine Rally (I am told he bought the TM 6.5 I was very close to purchasing after selling my Subaru, but was never able to confirm this). Anyway, he struck me as a very knowledgeable tuner, not to mention a guys whose driving skill is second to none. Charging $1000 markup is not unfair IMHO for that kit, all things considered. What most people don't understand is when buying parts from Japan, you cannot just convert yen to dollar and call it a day. Most vendors in Japan do not wholesale at all, which can make it very difficult for a US based vendor to even source the parts in the first place. Secomd, there are shipping costs (that turbo kit would run around $400 shipping via air feight), customs fees, duties, etc to consider. If we then add that stuff on top of the fact that most vendors in Japan don't wholesale to begin with, and it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that there is not much profit being made on such an expensive kit. Best bet is to order from a source who you know, or have reason to know, can get you the kit in a reasonable amount of time (trust me when I tell you more than 50% of the places that claim they can get JDM stuff cannot).
3. HKS does not use "standard" Garret Turbos - the GT series from HKS are Ballistic based turbos, though the wheel combos are proprietary to HKS. We have tried ordering turbos that duplicate HKS's 3037 and 2835 offerings, only to be told they were not offered to the public. HKS is one of the largest afternarket performance brands in the world, and have been tuning Japanese cars longer than many Evo owners have been alive. Is their stuff expensive? If price is your only consideration when making a purchase, then yes. But, the amount of R&D that goes into a product before they bring it to market is unmatched in the industry. Further, every part they sell fits, without exception, as advertised. The of course is the tech support offered, and their warranty program. So, are their parts expensive? Relative to what they provide, I think their prices are justified, and bringing value per dollar is one of the reasons we offer their products.
4. The 1G and 2G manifold are interchangeable, as is the manifold from an Evo 1-3. The Evo 4 and up have a different flange design, and the Evo 5 and up (may include the 4 as well..have never seen one in person) featrure the twin scroll manifold, which again is altogether different.
5. I have personally driven Evo 5's and 6's on 3037S systems, and they are very driveable on the street....it is all down to proper parts selection, and more importantly, competant tuning.
6. As we get the update to our site done, we'll have full specs on teh Kansai kits, as well as on the Greddy kits, which are very popular in the UK and Japan.
7. As for the JIC manifold, it too is a very nice piece, but is a direct replacement for the factory manifold. HKS offers a similar product, that again, replaces the factory manifold, and bolts to the factory turbo. The manifolds from HKS Kansai, Trust and others, are all designed to use those specific brands turbos (for HKS its either their 2835 or the 3037S; for Trust/GReddy its their Mitsubishi based 25G), as well as external wastegates. These kits come complete with the hard parts needed, though fuel delivery and engine management are left up to the buyer/tuner.
Happy boosting!
Adam
Ok, lets clear up some common misconceptions:
1. The turbos on our site in the Evo section are indeed turbos alone, not complete kits. These are not bolt ons by any means, and do require custom fabbing to work...however, they are both common turbos used worldwide on the later model Evo's (5's and up).
2. I have no clue about RM's practices, as we don't deal with them...though I did meat Rhys a couple years back at the Maine Rally (I am told he bought the TM 6.5 I was very close to purchasing after selling my Subaru, but was never able to confirm this). Anyway, he struck me as a very knowledgeable tuner, not to mention a guys whose driving skill is second to none. Charging $1000 markup is not unfair IMHO for that kit, all things considered. What most people don't understand is when buying parts from Japan, you cannot just convert yen to dollar and call it a day. Most vendors in Japan do not wholesale at all, which can make it very difficult for a US based vendor to even source the parts in the first place. Secomd, there are shipping costs (that turbo kit would run around $400 shipping via air feight), customs fees, duties, etc to consider. If we then add that stuff on top of the fact that most vendors in Japan don't wholesale to begin with, and it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that there is not much profit being made on such an expensive kit. Best bet is to order from a source who you know, or have reason to know, can get you the kit in a reasonable amount of time (trust me when I tell you more than 50% of the places that claim they can get JDM stuff cannot).
3. HKS does not use "standard" Garret Turbos - the GT series from HKS are Ballistic based turbos, though the wheel combos are proprietary to HKS. We have tried ordering turbos that duplicate HKS's 3037 and 2835 offerings, only to be told they were not offered to the public. HKS is one of the largest afternarket performance brands in the world, and have been tuning Japanese cars longer than many Evo owners have been alive. Is their stuff expensive? If price is your only consideration when making a purchase, then yes. But, the amount of R&D that goes into a product before they bring it to market is unmatched in the industry. Further, every part they sell fits, without exception, as advertised. The of course is the tech support offered, and their warranty program. So, are their parts expensive? Relative to what they provide, I think their prices are justified, and bringing value per dollar is one of the reasons we offer their products.
4. The 1G and 2G manifold are interchangeable, as is the manifold from an Evo 1-3. The Evo 4 and up have a different flange design, and the Evo 5 and up (may include the 4 as well..have never seen one in person) featrure the twin scroll manifold, which again is altogether different.
5. I have personally driven Evo 5's and 6's on 3037S systems, and they are very driveable on the street....it is all down to proper parts selection, and more importantly, competant tuning.
6. As we get the update to our site done, we'll have full specs on teh Kansai kits, as well as on the Greddy kits, which are very popular in the UK and Japan.
7. As for the JIC manifold, it too is a very nice piece, but is a direct replacement for the factory manifold. HKS offers a similar product, that again, replaces the factory manifold, and bolts to the factory turbo. The manifolds from HKS Kansai, Trust and others, are all designed to use those specific brands turbos (for HKS its either their 2835 or the 3037S; for Trust/GReddy its their Mitsubishi based 25G), as well as external wastegates. These kits come complete with the hard parts needed, though fuel delivery and engine management are left up to the buyer/tuner.
Happy boosting!
Adam
Adam thanks for responding to my post. I live close to your shop and will contact you for parts when I get my EVO. I sure want to make it respectably fast and need the right parts to do it right and to do it once. I will not spare any expenses!!!
Jun 10, 2003, 06:28 PM
#21
Originally posted by value
Here are Value's HKS turbo kit prices:
GT 3240 580HP $5737.28
GT 3037S 500HP $5016.94
GT 3040 500HP $4974.00
GT 3037 420HP $4889.83
GT 2835 400HP $4635.00
All kits include turbo manifold price does not include shipping.
Here are Value's HKS turbo kit prices:
GT 3240 580HP $5737.28
GT 3037S 500HP $5016.94
GT 3040 500HP $4974.00
GT 3037 420HP $4889.83
GT 2835 400HP $4635.00
All kits include turbo manifold price does not include shipping.
Jun 11, 2003, 01:30 AM
#22
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Originally posted by Blue Evo 8
Thanks for the price quotes..... how would the GT2835R serioes to the GT3037S be for daily driving? In terms of throttle response, boost response?
Thanks for the price quotes..... how would the GT2835R serioes to the GT3037S be for daily driving? In terms of throttle response, boost response?
hks kit uses garrett turbos, reworked/ball bearing turbos
you cant get them through garrett, thats the deal hks set up with garrett, but they are reworked garrett turbos
(I got this info from a major japanese tuner)
gt3037s for daily driving
we really should have a newbie section
, dude 3037s is a turbo that can make up to 500hp, you would have to spend tons of money on engine mods, etc etc, and still it wouldnt be a daily driver. but then, Im not sure what you mean by "a daily driver"
I said it before look into hks2835 or GReddy 20g turbo kits for a daily driver, dont buy a huge turbo and expect 500hp.
The bottom line, you want 400hp, you have to spend at least 5grand on mods,
turbo kit, mappable ecu, fuel pump, am I forgetting anything?
Jun 11, 2003, 01:40 AM
#23
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Originally posted by maki
The bottom line, you want 400hp, you have to spend at least 5grand on mods, turbo kit, mappable ecu, fuel pump, am I forgetting anything?
The bottom line, you want 400hp, you have to spend at least 5grand on mods, turbo kit, mappable ecu, fuel pump, am I forgetting anything?
Jun 11, 2003, 04:23 PM
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Maki - I think you may have misunderstood my post. Yes, the HKS turbos are Garrett based, however the wheel combos HKS runs are proprietary to HKS as you said - i.e., they are near impossible to be had without going to HKS for the turbo purchase.
For a street driven Evo, a 2835 based kit would rock with the right supporting mods (which will make or brake any turbo upgrade).
As to what Claudius said, running the larger turbos at lower levels does promote longevity..though then you are not using the turbo to its potential. Most important thing is keeping the turbo in its efficiency range....that will go a very long way to promoting reliability of the turbo itself 9along with lots of oil changes!)
Adam
For a street driven Evo, a 2835 based kit would rock with the right supporting mods (which will make or brake any turbo upgrade).
As to what Claudius said, running the larger turbos at lower levels does promote longevity..though then you are not using the turbo to its potential. Most important thing is keeping the turbo in its efficiency range....that will go a very long way to promoting reliability of the turbo itself 9along with lots of oil changes!)
Adam
Jun 12, 2003, 12:14 AM
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Originally posted by Z1 Performance
Maki - I think you may have misunderstood my post. Yes, the HKS turbos are Garrett based, however the wheel combos HKS runs are proprietary to HKS as you said - i.e., they are near impossible to be had without going to HKS for the turbo purchase.
For a street driven Evo, a 2835 based kit would rock with the right supporting mods (which will make or brake any turbo upgrade).
As to what Claudius said, running the larger turbos at lower levels does promote longevity..though then you are not using the turbo to its potential. Most important thing is keeping the turbo in its efficiency range....that will go a very long way to promoting reliability of the turbo itself 9along with lots of oil changes!)
Adam
Maki - I think you may have misunderstood my post. Yes, the HKS turbos are Garrett based, however the wheel combos HKS runs are proprietary to HKS as you said - i.e., they are near impossible to be had without going to HKS for the turbo purchase.
For a street driven Evo, a 2835 based kit would rock with the right supporting mods (which will make or brake any turbo upgrade).
As to what Claudius said, running the larger turbos at lower levels does promote longevity..though then you are not using the turbo to its potential. Most important thing is keeping the turbo in its efficiency range....that will go a very long way to promoting reliability of the turbo itself 9along with lots of oil changes!)
Adam
Jun 13, 2003, 01:00 PM
#27
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With production numbers needing to be so high these days I wonder if HKS uses a specific part number cartridge and then their own design housings. Anyone have specs, trim, exducer and inducer sizes on the 2835 or 3037. I do know that the garrett japan ball bearing cartridges were designed from scratch for inclusion of bearing housings and coolant passageways.
Jun 13, 2003, 01:59 PM
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I have stuff shipped from Japan all the time. $400...come on Adam. It is a turbo, manifold, and wastegate. Maybe $150 via Japanese post office air freight.
And if you are having trouble finding sellers of parts under retail...I have a whole list of guys who publicly sell and advertise under retail in Japan.
Adam, you are a great guy whom I admire alot. Gouging is gouging.
To the other guy, Adam is no n00b. He is very up an DSM and MMC tuning practices and setups.
Andhy
And if you are having trouble finding sellers of parts under retail...I have a whole list of guys who publicly sell and advertise under retail in Japan.
Adam, you are a great guy whom I admire alot. Gouging is gouging.
To the other guy, Adam is no n00b. He is very up an DSM and MMC tuning practices and setups.
Andhy
Jun 13, 2003, 07:24 PM
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Andy - I hear what your saying man, but the kit would be pretty pricey to bring in by air I think (I had it in my hands..its not a light box!). But I do agree that if it could be shipped EMS, thats the only way to fly...easily 1/2 the cost.
I do agree there are loads of places that wholesale...but maybe they don't deal with them? I know on stuff we bring in, which is once a week via air, and an average of once a month to month and a half via boat, I think we price things pretty fairly.
I don't think anyone called me a noob did they?
You got the 202 wheels...nice man Get some pics one of these days!
Adam
I do agree there are loads of places that wholesale...but maybe they don't deal with them? I know on stuff we bring in, which is once a week via air, and an average of once a month to month and a half via boat, I think we price things pretty fairly.
I don't think anyone called me a noob did they?
You got the 202 wheels...nice man
Get some pics one of these days!Adam
Jun 14, 2003, 05:04 PM
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I haven't been following too well but I have great sources for JDM importing if anyone needs anything. I also work with GReddy and HKS and can get all of these kits/turbos easily and at excellent prices. I actually plan on ordering some kits and turbochargers (2835 mostly) to store in my own inventory. I will probably order two GReddy kits and two 2835 turbos within the week !!
I can use some input as to what anyone is looking for so I can get an idea on how many and what I will exactly order. Thanks guys
I can use some input as to what anyone is looking for so I can get an idea on how many and what I will exactly order. Thanks guys
Last edited by DRC Imports; Jun 14, 2003 at 05:36 PM.