sparky

iTrader: (1)

I am not arguing with you. The Green compressor flows a conservative 47 according to FP. Apparently, their 56lb./min. flow rating for the Red's compressor is on the conservative side as well. Still, this is an 18% increase in air flow.

Shacochis06

i wasnt arguing i was just saying

Warrtalon

iTrader: (6)

Sparky, two things to remember:

1. Razorlab and others on the West Coast combat knock-sensitive 91oct with fuel, so they have much richer open-loop values than those on 93, which increases IDC.
2. Meth decreases IDC, so when he's using that, he'll be in good shape for running more boost without needing more injector
3. I agree, though, that it doesn't make sense to purchase Denso 720s to go with a Red, especially when 880s cost the same and would have no negative side effects. There are MANY of us using 880-1000s on stock turbos and stock ECU with E-85, so there's no reason to skimp out with a Red even on pump

sparky

iTrader: (1)

Yes, Warr, you're right. To get around engine knock, 91 octane fuel tables need to be richer than 93 octane tables. I agree with you.

Still, personally I wouldn't want to run anything smaller than a 780 with a Red on a low boost(24-25 PSI) pump gas tune. What worries me about the Densos is that if they are marginally adequate at 24-25 PSI(I realize that I have no actual proof)), then what's going to happen at higher boost levels, such as 28-30#. They(the 720's) just wouldn't seem to provide enough headroom for turning up the wick for higher boost applications on pump+additives(octane booster) or 100 octane unleaded.

The Red, since it has lower compressor discharge temps than the Green, is going to want more fuel at the same boost numbers. And, it also allows higher boost levels on pump than the Green did. Higher knock threshold than the Green on any given fuel.

Yeah, the 720's would probably be O.K. on pump/meth, just as you say. You should know, as you were a meth addict yourself until you switched over to E-85

Phalse

iTrader: (2)

I got the Denso 720s as a friend was upgrading to larger ones for e85 and these were very reasonable, and a person who tunes countless numbers of evos said the 720s will be fine, ill follow his advice.

I really hope the turbo will flow enough that the 720s will be inadequate and force me to upgrade, i reall do

Warrtalon

iTrader: (6)

You know someone who has tuned countless Reds? You can get 880s just as easily as those 720s. I bought my 880s and now 100s for low cost.

Phalse

iTrader: (2)

Warr, reds, no, bigger, yes. Why does it matter? Its someone whos opinion i find significantly more trustworthy and relevant than some self important forum jocky.

I'm glad you got your 880s at what you feel to be a good deal, a friend had some 720s for sale, im on stockers, so i grabbed them. Your talent for finding something to criticise in other peoples threads is as prevalent as ever.

Please go away.

Warrtalon

iTrader: (6)

Wow, wasn't criticizing...just trying to help. Amazing reaction there...sorry. My 1000s were $200 shipped. Can't imagine that being a roadblock when purchasing a new Red, nor can I imagine leaving such a big turbo at low pump gas boost. I apologize for defending and helping to explain why you MIGHT be ok above. I will make sure not to do that nex time.

sparky

iTrader: (1)

If you're going to run meth you'll probably be o.k. Otherwise I'd sell them on here and get some FIC 850's for about $275 new. No tuner has a lot of experience tuning the Red, yet. The thing moves considerably more air than the Green does though. So, we're waiting for flashers to give us some feedback on AFR's and IDC's with the Red, once they tune a few. In fact, you can send me your Red if you want(What me jealous....Naw?).

Edit: I guess that you're gonna lob some flak my way as you did with Warr. It's really o.k. as I deserve it, more than he does. He was only defending your decision.

compscibOi

iTrader: (19)

Ill bet you are one happy Evo owner.

How much do these run and whats the waiting list like? I am sure they are in high demand.

Phalse

iTrader: (2)

Sparky: nah its cool, I'm just not a big fan of warrtalon's attitude and his need to post in all threads.

compscibOi: Actually I got very lucky. While reading one of the FP red threads, Mike@AwdMotorsports mentioned that he had 3, 1 sold already 2 others ready to go, so as soon as I read it I called and bought one of his, so no wait at all. I think this was one of the first batch to go out to the vendors from FP, it was $1925 shipped. Mike's a great guy, thanks again for the no wait hookup.

Shacochis06

theyve been out for a minute now...but anybody ordering thru fp good luck with that one

Evo H8

iTrader: (3)

I am in the same position as Phalse - I currently have 720 injectors and I have a Red on order. I'll be using meth, but I'm a little worried that my injectors may not be enough... I'm interested to see the outcome.

Keep us posted on your results Phalse!

EE

iTrader: (9)

720's are good for 54 lb/min with 11.5 afr with 100 IDC

when only running 93 (no meth), at 24-25 psi they should be ok.
turn the boost up to 28-30 and you'll be on the edge.
It's always a good safety margin not to have idc above 80%, let alone 95%+

I'd say you should be ok for high boost levels when using injection - o'wise 26 psi should be about the limit.


Elie

EE

iTrader: (9)

when going race gas (without injection), assuming an afr of 12, these injectors will max out at 56 lb/min, which is relatively low given that we've already seen as high as 63lb/min with the red on race gas.

Of course, when using injection, you can still use 100% meth to help the injectors -but this wouldn't be the "proper" way to tune the car.

As for me, I wouldn't buy less than 850 inj. with the red



Elie