Forced Performance's Newest Turbo Oil Feed Line
Jun 17, 2009 | 08:06 PM
#62
I think this will settle all of this. This is a e-mail message I got in response asking about this issue.
We recently got a PDF from MHI, it wasnt easy but we convinced them we needed something in writing. Anyway, MHI wants 45psi oil pressure at the turbo. Many motors never generate that much at the head.
The Gen2 line goes to the filter housing to tap into the 100+psi oil pressure source, that line uses a .070" restrictor to limit pressure to 70psi (in most cases, lots of variables here of course).
If you want to change to the Gen2 line, then give us a call to order it and I'll deduct what you paid for any other line you bought from us.
Al the engines we measured were a little different, but none of them met MHI requirement for 45psi at ful power, not even with the Gen1 line from the head to the turbo.
I recommend you update your line, we are pricing the gen2 line kit at cost, so it is as affordable as we can make it, and if you bought a previous line setup from us we can deduct that expense from the cost of the new line since the gen1 line kit is now a component of the Gen2 kit.
We recently got a PDF from MHI, it wasnt easy but we convinced them we needed something in writing. Anyway, MHI wants 45psi oil pressure at the turbo. Many motors never generate that much at the head.
The Gen2 line goes to the filter housing to tap into the 100+psi oil pressure source, that line uses a .070" restrictor to limit pressure to 70psi (in most cases, lots of variables here of course).
If you want to change to the Gen2 line, then give us a call to order it and I'll deduct what you paid for any other line you bought from us.
Al the engines we measured were a little different, but none of them met MHI requirement for 45psi at ful power, not even with the Gen1 line from the head to the turbo.
I recommend you update your line, we are pricing the gen2 line kit at cost, so it is as affordable as we can make it, and if you bought a previous line setup from us we can deduct that expense from the cost of the new line since the gen1 line kit is now a component of the Gen2 kit.
This, I suppose, is great information. But the question begs to be asked, will this be the final "upgraded" oil line? And if we have the previous line, will the warranty on the turbo still be honored?
Jun 17, 2009 | 09:50 PM
#63
Thread Starter
Evolving Member
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 210
Likes: 2
From: Cincinnati Ohio
And also this is on thier site as now as well:
http://store.forcedperformance.net/m...Lancer-TurboHW
We no longer recommend using oil supply from the cylinder head for the FP GREEN&trade for the Mitsubishi Evolution 9 or FP RED&trade for the Mitsubishi Evolution 9 in applications that run elevated boost pressures. Oil pressure measurements made on various engines indicate that in some cases the amount of available oil pressure at the cylinder head feed location is less than desirable. This head feed location prioritizes the turbo oil supply after all other oil supply duties within the engine. We want the turbocharger to be supplied with a minimum of 45psi of oil pressure under full engine load, and sourcing oil supply from the cylinder head simply does not ensure this under all circumstances or possible combinations of engine configuration, oil viscosity, temperatures, balance shafts, main and rod bearing clearances etc.
Relocating the oil supply to the oil filter housing allows the turbocharger to be fed by a more stable and consistent source. This source is much higher pressure than required by the turbocharger (can be over 150psi), so our line kit includes a inline filter that also features the appropriate size restrictor to limit the pressure at the turbo to a maximum of 70psi hot oil pressure.
While many may insist that 20 or 30psi of oil pressure is sufficient to supply a typical floating journal bearing turbo, it is our specific experience that this is not always true in the case of an automotive racing turbocharger used in a performance application where excessive EGT, high shaft speed and maximum thrust load are the norm, not the exception.
Currently, damage resulting from insufficient oil pressure can still be repaired under the standard product warranty in cases where the turbocharger was purchased and installed prior to the introduction of this new solution to oil starvation. Of course it would be preferable to update the oil feed to the turbo prior to having a problem, and existing customers will be helped in every way possible in their efforts to update their oil feed lines in existing applications.
Relocating the oil supply to the oil filter housing allows the turbocharger to be fed by a more stable and consistent source. This source is much higher pressure than required by the turbocharger (can be over 150psi), so our line kit includes a inline filter that also features the appropriate size restrictor to limit the pressure at the turbo to a maximum of 70psi hot oil pressure.
While many may insist that 20 or 30psi of oil pressure is sufficient to supply a typical floating journal bearing turbo, it is our specific experience that this is not always true in the case of an automotive racing turbocharger used in a performance application where excessive EGT, high shaft speed and maximum thrust load are the norm, not the exception.
Currently, damage resulting from insufficient oil pressure can still be repaired under the standard product warranty in cases where the turbocharger was purchased and installed prior to the introduction of this new solution to oil starvation. Of course it would be preferable to update the oil feed to the turbo prior to having a problem, and existing customers will be helped in every way possible in their efforts to update their oil feed lines in existing applications.
Also as for the question, is this the final.. There is no where else to get the oil from. This is common to get oil from the oil filter housing when you want to give something more oil. My local shop I worked at did something similar with vg30dett's to give the mains and rods more oil.
Last edited by jimib; Jun 17, 2009 at 09:54 PM.
Jun 18, 2009 | 06:08 AM
#64
And also this is on thier site as now as well:
http://store.forcedperformance.net/m...Lancer-TurboHW
Also as for the question, is this the final.. There is no where else to get the oil from. This is common to get oil from the oil filter housing when you want to give something more oil. My local shop I worked at did something similar with vg30dett's to give the mains and rods more oil.
http://store.forcedperformance.net/m...Lancer-TurboHW
Also as for the question, is this the final.. There is no where else to get the oil from. This is common to get oil from the oil filter housing when you want to give something more oil. My local shop I worked at did something similar with vg30dett's to give the mains and rods more oil.
Jun 18, 2009 | 01:29 PM
#65
Newbie
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 63
Likes: 0
From: Raleigh, NC
F this i just bought the damn install kit from them last week (142.00) which came with what was suppose to be everything needed to install this turbo
now your saying i should spend another 150.00 for a stupid as oil line
i wish i would have never bought this turbo i dont even have it on the car yet and its costing me money
now your saying i should spend another 150.00 for a stupid as oil line
i wish i would have never bought this turbo i dont even have it on the car yet and its costing me money
Take the time to read the valuable information in this thread and you wouldn't be so upset!
Jun 18, 2009 | 07:38 PM
#67
Since you are upset at having the best street turbo presently available, and dislike good advice from the shop who makes it and has the best warranty in the business, I suggest that you take steps to change your situation and thus your attitude.
Sell the turbo to some one who deserves and appreciates it. Problem solved.
Sell the turbo to some one who deserves and appreciates it. Problem solved.
Jun 18, 2009 | 07:41 PM
#68
Since you are upset at having the best street turbo presently available, and dislike good advice from the shop who makes it and has the best warranty in the business, I suggest that you take steps to change your situation and thus your attitude.
Sell the turbo to some one who deserves and appreciates it. Problem solved.
Sell the turbo to some one who deserves and appreciates it. Problem solved.
when i asked FP(the great company you speak of) what is everything i will need to have for this turbo install (1 week ago) they said install kit which i bought and recieved 3 days ago.......now it is outdated all they had to say was wait a few days and spend a few more bucks and the kit will have everything you need
but thanks for your concern of my attitude im still pissed
Jun 18, 2009 | 08:13 PM
#69
It looks like the black inline filter with 70 psi restrictor included in the new kit is different than the red inline filter that was included in the old oil line kit. I hope that FP will credit the price of the previous oil line kit, including the price of the filter, and that the credit offer isn't limited to the filterless line kit only.
I think this will settle all of this. This is a e-mail message I got in response asking about this issue.
We recently got a PDF from MHI, it wasnt easy but we convinced them we needed something in writing. Anyway, MHI wants 45psi oil pressure at the turbo. Many motors never generate that much at the head.
The Gen2 line goes to the filter housing to tap into the 100+psi oil pressure source, that line uses a .070" restrictor to limit pressure to 70psi (in most cases, lots of variables here of course).
If you want to change to the Gen2 line, then give us a call to order it and I'll deduct what you paid for any other line you bought from us.
Al the engines we measured were a little different, but none of them met MHI requirement for 45psi at ful power, not even with the Gen1 line from the head to the turbo.
I recommend you update your line, we are pricing the gen2 line kit at cost, so it is as affordable as we can make it, and if you bought a previous line setup from us we can deduct that expense from the cost of the new line since the gen1 line kit is now a component of the Gen2 kit.
We recently got a PDF from MHI, it wasnt easy but we convinced them we needed something in writing. Anyway, MHI wants 45psi oil pressure at the turbo. Many motors never generate that much at the head.
The Gen2 line goes to the filter housing to tap into the 100+psi oil pressure source, that line uses a .070" restrictor to limit pressure to 70psi (in most cases, lots of variables here of course).
If you want to change to the Gen2 line, then give us a call to order it and I'll deduct what you paid for any other line you bought from us.
Al the engines we measured were a little different, but none of them met MHI requirement for 45psi at ful power, not even with the Gen1 line from the head to the turbo.
I recommend you update your line, we are pricing the gen2 line kit at cost, so it is as affordable as we can make it, and if you bought a previous line setup from us we can deduct that expense from the cost of the new line since the gen1 line kit is now a component of the Gen2 kit.
Jun 19, 2009 | 10:37 AM
#70
Evolving Member
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 259
Likes: 0
From: McKinney TX
Jun 19, 2009 | 10:43 AM
#71
Evolving Member
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 259
Likes: 0
From: McKinney TX
I did not use heat when I did it, but it would help a lot. I reccomend an alan socket (proper metric size not the closest standars.. You would be surprised who does this). It was on there tight, but not immpossible. It made a huge pop when it freed up. I was scared. Thought I cracked the housing haha.
8mm and 5/16" are essentially the same. 8mm = .3149", 5/16"= .3125" .002" won't make that big of a difference, a worn out corner rounded hex socket will make more of a difference.
Jun 22, 2009 | 04:45 PM
#73
Does anybody have a secret phone number to call FP and talk to somebody...I have been calling them since Thursday, left a couple of messages and still no luck.
I want to order the new oil line but Ive had no luck getting thru to the sales dept.
: (
I want to order the new oil line but Ive had no luck getting thru to the sales dept.
: (
Jul 4, 2009 | 05:29 AM
#75
I installed this line a few weeks back, here are some observations (and NO, I ain't reading all the preceding pages, if this helps great , if not move on past this post :-)
I struggled getting enough heat on the plug with my home tools on the floor.
LEAVE enough room to get your passenger side tire off in order to get a good angle with your torch.
I followed ALL instructions to the letter and still had trouble breaking the oil housing plug free as described.
Eventually I had to buy a SOCKET HEAD STYLE ALLEN WRENCH in order to finally break the bond. I didn't find it to be quite as loose as the instructions infer, but that might have been due to the limited heat ransfer that I was able to achieve (as mentioned).
You can install it while the turbo is on the car.
I tested the install for my own piece of mind (since I was also one of the first, and on matters like like my car - I must be from Missouri "the show me" state :-)
1. After the install was complete, I disconnected the new line right before the filter - After the filter would likely be better - (oh well)
2. AS FAR AS I KNOW (correct me here if needed) The oil will not pump unless the engine is running - so just cranking the car with no spark will not work (again, as far as I know)
3. So have a friend either briefly start the car OR watch the oil line that you have pointed into a bucket or something. WE ARE TALKING THE BRIEFEST TEST STARTING
( A couple of seconds and you should see the oil squirting out. I preloaded the turbo with a bit of oil. If yours hasn't been removed from the car there is probably enough still in it, in case you are worried about it)
I would have taken pictures but my hands were really dirty
... and I was kinda pissed off by that point, having tried to get the friggin' plug loose over a couple of days. But it was a "relieved pissed off"
GOODLUCK and take your time!
I struggled getting enough heat on the plug with my home tools on the floor.
LEAVE enough room to get your passenger side tire off in order to get a good angle with your torch.
I followed ALL instructions to the letter and still had trouble breaking the oil housing plug free as described.
Eventually I had to buy a SOCKET HEAD STYLE ALLEN WRENCH in order to finally break the bond. I didn't find it to be quite as loose as the instructions infer, but that might have been due to the limited heat ransfer that I was able to achieve (as mentioned).
You can install it while the turbo is on the car.
I tested the install for my own piece of mind (since I was also one of the first, and on matters like like my car - I must be from Missouri "the show me" state :-)
1. After the install was complete, I disconnected the new line right before the filter - After the filter would likely be better - (oh well)
2. AS FAR AS I KNOW (correct me here if needed) The oil will not pump unless the engine is running - so just cranking the car with no spark will not work (again, as far as I know)
3. So have a friend either briefly start the car OR watch the oil line that you have pointed into a bucket or something. WE ARE TALKING THE BRIEFEST TEST STARTING
( A couple of seconds and you should see the oil squirting out. I preloaded the turbo with a bit of oil. If yours hasn't been removed from the car there is probably enough still in it, in case you are worried about it)
I would have taken pictures but my hands were really dirty
... and I was kinda pissed off by that point, having tried to get the friggin' plug loose over a couple of days. But it was a "relieved pissed off"GOODLUCK and take your time!
Last edited by nirvevo; Jul 4, 2009 at 05:40 AM.