Transfer Case after Trackday
Apr 21, 2010, 06:20 PM
#16
Don't feel lonely, several things contributing to the situation:
First, you are making more than stock power, correct? How much more?
Second, the oil definately looks questionable. The OEM Diaqueen is good stuff, but for track usage, there is a reason why folks like Shep carry Redline. If you drove the car hard, you had to notice how hot the entire car gets after a long session, that includes the oils and gears. I'm sure Amsoil makes a soild alternative as well. And track days are different from the drag racing and red-light launches. Sustained high loads and high heat.
Third, seems like the Evo Tcase death whine is almost inevitable once you start driving the car hard and upping the power. Shep and TRE both offer rebuild/upgrade services aimed at addressing the shortcomings of the stock OEM Tcase setup.
I know all this so very well because I have an 06 IX with 42k on it that developed a monster Tcase whine after my first track weekend. I am at 335 awhp and 3 hours of track time did the trick. We got to do 40 minute run sessions on the second day and the heat coming from every mechanical part of the cart after each session was a real shock. So I have a Shep stage 3 Tcase with Quaife LSD going in, as well as a complete tranny rebuild and fresh clutch.
You are far from alone.....
First, you are making more than stock power, correct? How much more?
Second, the oil definately looks questionable. The OEM Diaqueen is good stuff, but for track usage, there is a reason why folks like Shep carry Redline. If you drove the car hard, you had to notice how hot the entire car gets after a long session, that includes the oils and gears. I'm sure Amsoil makes a soild alternative as well. And track days are different from the drag racing and red-light launches. Sustained high loads and high heat.
Third, seems like the Evo Tcase death whine is almost inevitable once you start driving the car hard and upping the power. Shep and TRE both offer rebuild/upgrade services aimed at addressing the shortcomings of the stock OEM Tcase setup.
I know all this so very well because I have an 06 IX with 42k on it that developed a monster Tcase whine after my first track weekend. I am at 335 awhp and 3 hours of track time did the trick. We got to do 40 minute run sessions on the second day and the heat coming from every mechanical part of the cart after each session was a real shock. So I have a Shep stage 3 Tcase with Quaife LSD going in, as well as a complete tranny rebuild and fresh clutch.
You are far from alone.....
Apr 21, 2010, 06:22 PM
#17
For you other guys out there suggesting OEM fluids, stop. This car clearly sees the track. The OEM fluids were not meant to stand up to the rigors or frequent track use or high horsepower.
And if i were you guys, i would drain the OEM fluids strait away. GO with Redline or Amsoil products rated for the proper driveline parts.
Here is what i use:
Tranny: Redline MT-90 or a MT-90 cocktail(i personally use MT-90 strait)
TC: Redline Heavy ShockProof(you can also use Light ShockProof)
Rear Diff: Redline 75w90(you can also use the shockproof's i listed above, but will need to use a friction modifier. You can get away with not using the friction modifier, but the rear diff will be a little noisey)
Amsoil also makes great products...i would use either of the two....
I will say this though, OEM DiaQueen would of been better than the stuff the OP was using. At least DiaQueen was rated to be used in the TC.
And if i were you guys, i would drain the OEM fluids strait away. GO with Redline or Amsoil products rated for the proper driveline parts.
Here is what i use:
Tranny: Redline MT-90 or a MT-90 cocktail(i personally use MT-90 strait)
TC: Redline Heavy ShockProof(you can also use Light ShockProof)
Rear Diff: Redline 75w90(you can also use the shockproof's i listed above, but will need to use a friction modifier. You can get away with not using the friction modifier, but the rear diff will be a little noisey)
Amsoil also makes great products...i would use either of the two....
I will say this though, OEM DiaQueen would of been better than the stuff the OP was using. At least DiaQueen was rated to be used in the TC.
Apr 21, 2010, 10:00 PM
#19
Shep can also can also rebuild his tranny in his sleep and has access to the tools and parts to rebuild it time and time again. The rest of us if a Transfer case blows it'll kill us. I think the OEM fluid handles heat quite well. I think the Redline fluid is too thin and will melt parts, what fluid did the rally teams use?
Apr 22, 2010, 05:04 AM
#21
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Thanks for al the reply's and support, it's really helpfull!
The oil used was from Cusco, recommended to me by a Evo specialist. I told him what happened, and i'm sure things will get sorted.
The car is running stock turbo, but stage 1 mods. Made ~275 WHP on the VDR 5.71 programm. So that shouldn't be the problem I believe, there are cars running much more power than this.
The car is indeed tracked on a regular basis, but this happened after a long tracktime so everything could really warm up and probably the oil lost it's lubricating ability?
Took the T-case apart last night and here are some pics. Please tell me what you make out of this:
The end that goes into the gearbox is damaged, both the outside and inside "tube". the teeth aren't damaged, but the "head on" part is.
Needs a new one of these...
And this one too...
you can see the blue discolouration where the bearing used to run, caused by heat. There is also a slight egde / height difference there.
Blue discolouration of the shaft that goes in the transferbox
When I turn one of the tubes comming out of the gearbox the are noisy too, so will be removing that as well, just to be sure...
Gearbox drainplug. It didn't look like this 2000 miles ago when I put the new oil in.
The gearbox also had Cusco oil, so don't hope that is broken too.....
The oil used was from Cusco, recommended to me by a Evo specialist. I told him what happened, and i'm sure things will get sorted.
The car is running stock turbo, but stage 1 mods. Made ~275 WHP on the VDR 5.71 programm. So that shouldn't be the problem I believe, there are cars running much more power than this.
The car is indeed tracked on a regular basis, but this happened after a long tracktime so everything could really warm up and probably the oil lost it's lubricating ability?
Took the T-case apart last night and here are some pics. Please tell me what you make out of this:
The end that goes into the gearbox is damaged, both the outside and inside "tube". the teeth aren't damaged, but the "head on" part is.
Needs a new one of these...
And this one too...
you can see the blue discolouration where the bearing used to run, caused by heat. There is also a slight egde / height difference there.
Blue discolouration of the shaft that goes in the transferbox
When I turn one of the tubes comming out of the gearbox the are noisy too, so will be removing that as well, just to be sure...
Gearbox drainplug. It didn't look like this 2000 miles ago when I put the new oil in.
The gearbox also had Cusco oil, so don't hope that is broken too.....
Apr 22, 2010, 05:14 AM
#22
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Rear diff is fine, but will be changing that oil too, just to be sure!
Tranny looks to have some wear too, looking at the drain plug I took out.
Apr 22, 2010, 06:29 AM
#23
uhh....some of the people on here kill me.
1. For those that think a non-synthetic gear oil is better than a synthetic, you need to rethink what you believe. Oem DiaQueen is not the best stuff out there. We know that to be a fact. So why argue that people should use it, when there are known better oils out there? Don't you want the best for your evo too? Especially knowing how fragil our tc is?
2. Who ever said Redline was too thin has no idea what they're talking about. Redline Heavy Shockproof is extremly thick and can withstand just about anything you can throw at it. It's so thick, it's hard to drain all of it.
3. Amsoil makes great stuff, not sure why people would feel the OEM non-synthetic fluids would out perform or out protect any quality synthetic like Amsoil or Redline.
That is all.
1. For those that think a non-synthetic gear oil is better than a synthetic, you need to rethink what you believe. Oem DiaQueen is not the best stuff out there. We know that to be a fact. So why argue that people should use it, when there are known better oils out there? Don't you want the best for your evo too? Especially knowing how fragil our tc is?
2. Who ever said Redline was too thin has no idea what they're talking about. Redline Heavy Shockproof is extremly thick and can withstand just about anything you can throw at it. It's so thick, it's hard to drain all of it.
3. Amsoil makes great stuff, not sure why people would feel the OEM non-synthetic fluids would out perform or out protect any quality synthetic like Amsoil or Redline.
That is all.
Apr 22, 2010, 09:56 AM
#27
This will start you off, this is a specific test done on different gear lubes, only for gear lubes for TC, rear diffs and tranny apllicable. OEM Diaqueen is not in there.
Its a huge document but very very good info inside, pay close attention to the pages i mention, specially during the Falex testing and ball wear test, these are very important for your ring and gear assy inside your TC
You will notice there are a couple brands that perform very well,,,, BUT IT JUST HAPPENS that my brand i sell outperforms,,,,LOL
http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2457.pdf
there is a few testing scenarios, look at pages, 6, 7, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 21, 22, 24
Its a huge document but very very good info inside, pay close attention to the pages i mention, specially during the Falex testing and ball wear test, these are very important for your ring and gear assy inside your TC
You will notice there are a couple brands that perform very well,,,, BUT IT JUST HAPPENS that my brand i sell outperforms,,,,LOL
http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2457.pdf
there is a few testing scenarios, look at pages, 6, 7, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 21, 22, 24
Apr 22, 2010, 10:01 AM
#28
In reality at your power level, where your components don't see high torque loads OEM or anything less than should be great.
Now if you are looking to extend your drain intervals, and looking for a cooler temp inside your components, looking for better lubricity of neddle bearings and other parts, good cushion between gears than you might want to concider synthetics. they hold the heat better and handle loads better for a longer period of time.,,,, and my claims here you wil see on the report i provided you with.
Andy