Need help reading plugs please...pics attached
Jul 15, 2011, 07:31 AM
#1
Need help reading plugs please...pics attached
So about 6-7 months ago I had part of the porcelain insulator break off of a spark plug, it was a BPR8ES from cylinder 4. I decided to go to the coldest step plug because even with new plugs it was misfiring a little at higher boost (35ish psi on an hta86) so I went to 9ES's and I'm also on a Sparktech non-cdi cop set up. At the time this cleared up the issue. They're gapped at .020.
My car started suddenly misfiring again late last week anytime boost was built in first gear, say 5psi. The other gears felt fine. I was driving it easy anyway while I'm waiting on a new slave cylinder. On Wednesday I was in third and got up to about 5psi and it started missing. I know last week when I was logging third waas fine, but now it was missing. I decided to pull the plugs and of course, this time two plugs have missing pieces of porcelain, cylinders 2 & 4. Attached are pictures of the plugs. The plug from 4 is the worse looking one, the normal one is from cylinder 3 which was identical to cylinder 1.
I swapped the plugs for another set of plugs and drove them to work and home, 30 miles round trip, and the two from cylinders 2 & 4 already look pretty worn already, the ones from 1 & 3 look brand new still.
On a side note I had posted in another thread about going lean above 6k. Editing my fuel tables does nothing for 3rd gear. Even with the fueling set at 7.4 in the High Octane map 3rd gear climbs to 13.1 at 7000 but 1st and 2nd show 9-10AFR's. I've only done 1 or 2 pulls in 3rd since noticing that issue. There was 0 knock as I'm running e85 but I know it can still cause issues. The fuel is e85 tested to be true e85.
This is not, I repeat this is not a tune issue, this is hardware related. This same exact tune was used to make over 670hp with 0 knock.
Things I have not tried yet...
- Swapping back to the stock COP, I did check the SparkTech and all 4 are firing.
- Swapping back to the stock fuel feed line from the double pumper. Currently it's a -8 feed line using a fuellab 8micron fiberglass filter. I'm starting to think my going lean at higher rpm issue started when I swapped that, maybe the filter element is actually a restriction?
Is this a cylinder fueling issues? An ignition issue? Any ideas? All help would be appreciated, thanks a ton in advance
My car started suddenly misfiring again late last week anytime boost was built in first gear, say 5psi. The other gears felt fine. I was driving it easy anyway while I'm waiting on a new slave cylinder. On Wednesday I was in third and got up to about 5psi and it started missing. I know last week when I was logging third waas fine, but now it was missing. I decided to pull the plugs and of course, this time two plugs have missing pieces of porcelain, cylinders 2 & 4. Attached are pictures of the plugs. The plug from 4 is the worse looking one, the normal one is from cylinder 3 which was identical to cylinder 1.
I swapped the plugs for another set of plugs and drove them to work and home, 30 miles round trip, and the two from cylinders 2 & 4 already look pretty worn already, the ones from 1 & 3 look brand new still.
On a side note I had posted in another thread about going lean above 6k. Editing my fuel tables does nothing for 3rd gear. Even with the fueling set at 7.4 in the High Octane map 3rd gear climbs to 13.1 at 7000 but 1st and 2nd show 9-10AFR's. I've only done 1 or 2 pulls in 3rd since noticing that issue. There was 0 knock as I'm running e85 but I know it can still cause issues. The fuel is e85 tested to be true e85.
This is not, I repeat this is not a tune issue, this is hardware related. This same exact tune was used to make over 670hp with 0 knock.
Things I have not tried yet...
- Swapping back to the stock COP, I did check the SparkTech and all 4 are firing.
- Swapping back to the stock fuel feed line from the double pumper. Currently it's a -8 feed line using a fuellab 8micron fiberglass filter. I'm starting to think my going lean at higher rpm issue started when I swapped that, maybe the filter element is actually a restriction?
Is this a cylinder fueling issues? An ignition issue? Any ideas? All help would be appreciated, thanks a ton in advance
Last edited by 05blue8; Jul 15, 2011 at 08:43 AM.
Jul 15, 2011, 08:38 AM
#3
I updated my first post. This is not a tune issue (but either way the car is running 16 degrees up top, actually can run 17-18 with 0 knock but no more power so settled on 16). This same tune was making 670hp with 0 knock until my clutch started slipping so all I've done is turn the boost down via the wg duty cycle and these issues started. I maxed the fuel table in the load cells and it still shows that it is going lean. I reloaded the same map, issues still exist. Something has happened with the car, I just need to find out what. Thanks
Last edited by 05blue8; Jul 15, 2011 at 08:43 AM.
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Jul 15, 2011, 01:46 PM
#8
wow 2 and 4 look like total ****.. id be scared if i pulled plugs that looked like that out of my car.
on another note regarding the fuel,
maybe since you ran bigger fuel pump lines to the rail now we need to rescale the injectors.. pm me and we can work on the trims to confirm.
as for why those 2 plugs look like that is beyond me.. they look horrible though.
cylinder #1 gets the most pounding from my understanding. hopefully someone else will post in here that's experienced plugs like this before on just 2 cylinders.
on another note regarding the fuel,
maybe since you ran bigger fuel pump lines to the rail now we need to rescale the injectors.. pm me and we can work on the trims to confirm.
as for why those 2 plugs look like that is beyond me.. they look horrible though.
cylinder #1 gets the most pounding from my understanding. hopefully someone else will post in here that's experienced plugs like this before on just 2 cylinders.
Jul 15, 2011, 03:33 PM
#11
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I'm having a similar issue. Misfires at high boost. I have narrowed mine down to a fuel problem also. I'm also using fic injectors. Unfortunately the only way to know for sure is if you have an O2 sensor on each cylinder. So after doing some thinking i decided to get this......
http://www.aemelectronics.com/4-chan...ontroller-1223
It does cost alot and i AM pissed that i gotta buy it. It just makes me nervous knowing that the afr could be off a good bit from cylinder to cylinder. Not a huge issue if they are off a tad on E85 but i plan to go back to pumpgas for daily use and that is a VERY big deal on pumpgas. That would be an easy way to loose an engine. So im going to be the gunni pig and try one out. Should be interesting at least.
My plugs have never looked that bad man. If they are fairly new injectors FIC will test them for free if you really feel that is you issue. Hope you get it solved without hurting anything!
http://www.aemelectronics.com/4-chan...ontroller-1223
It does cost alot and i AM pissed that i gotta buy it. It just makes me nervous knowing that the afr could be off a good bit from cylinder to cylinder. Not a huge issue if they are off a tad on E85 but i plan to go back to pumpgas for daily use and that is a VERY big deal on pumpgas. That would be an easy way to loose an engine. So im going to be the gunni pig and try one out. Should be interesting at least.
My plugs have never looked that bad man. If they are fairly new injectors FIC will test them for free if you really feel that is you issue. Hope you get it solved without hurting anything!
Jul 15, 2011, 03:42 PM
#12
I'm having a similar issue. Misfires at high boost. I have narrowed mine down to a fuel problem also. I'm also using fic injectors. Unfortunately the only way to know for sure is if you have an O2 sensor on each cylinder. So after doing some thinking i decided to get this......
http://www.aemelectronics.com/4-chan...ontroller-1223
It does cost alot and i AM pissed that i gotta buy it. It just makes me nervous knowing that the afr could be off a good bit from cylinder to cylinder. Not a huge issue if they are off a tad on E85 but i plan to go back to pumpgas for daily use and that is a VERY big deal on pumpgas. That would be an easy way to loose an engine. So im going to be the gunni pig and try one out. Should be interesting at least.
My plugs have never looked that bad man. If they are fairly new injectors FIC will test them for free if you really feel that is you issue. Hope you get it solved without hurting anything!
http://www.aemelectronics.com/4-chan...ontroller-1223
It does cost alot and i AM pissed that i gotta buy it. It just makes me nervous knowing that the afr could be off a good bit from cylinder to cylinder. Not a huge issue if they are off a tad on E85 but i plan to go back to pumpgas for daily use and that is a VERY big deal on pumpgas. That would be an easy way to loose an engine. So im going to be the gunni pig and try one out. Should be interesting at least.
My plugs have never looked that bad man. If they are fairly new injectors FIC will test them for free if you really feel that is you issue. Hope you get it solved without hurting anything!
also heres another customer that recently had fueling issues on e85 and i told him to remove injectors and this is what he found:
turns out he used a oring on ID2000 that shouldnt of been used and the e85 just ate right into it.. and quickly at that. E85 is some nasty **** if the rubber is not up for its challenge.
His car ran like complete crap. I told him dont even bother with ID based on my other friends experience with them, so he called FIC and FIC cleaned them and had them back to him in no time.. fired car up, ran perfect again.
FIC customer service is top notch and will clean any injector no matter what brand it is. I highly recommend them to everyone that needs injector cleaning.
Jul 16, 2011, 06:52 PM
#15
Two are almost 100% clogged injectors, 1 was about 60% clogged, one was clear. The two clogged wouldn't even pull fuel through when pulsing them directly *sigh*
They're being overnighted to FIC. UGH, f'in e85 *double sigh* I got lucky, damn e85 showed no knock...keep an eye on that wideband gauge from time to time guys!
Tom when I get them back we can hopefully get the right scaling on these mfers (this explains my trim issue finally)
They're being overnighted to FIC. UGH, f'in e85 *double sigh* I got lucky, damn e85 showed no knock...keep an eye on that wideband gauge from time to time guys!
Tom when I get them back we can hopefully get the right scaling on these mfers (this explains my trim issue finally)