I know there are threads, and I've been searching for a couple of hours while working.

I guess I messed up the install on my timing belt. I have not got around to installing the new one and I haven't even accessed the balance shaft belt yet.

Here is where I am:

• removed accessory belt and tensioner
• removed lower timing cover. I thought the engine was at TDC based on the cam gears and the markings on the valve cover. I could not see a mark on the crank sprocket... What made me think everything was wrong was that I had a screw driver in the oil hole and then when I pulled the lower timing cover (and after I had pulled off the old timing belt) I realized that the TDC markings on the oil sprocket were no aligned.
• I spun the oil sprocket around and realized that it lines up with the markings on the engine and also has the passage open every other full turn. So right now it's lined up with the markings as well as the screw driver in the hole - I believe this is correct.
• BUT now I think the crank is in the wrong spot. The cam gears are still stuck in TDC with the Jay Racing tool and they line up with the markings on the valve cover. How do I know if the crank is in the right spot? Does piston #1 need to be at the highest point? Can I rotate the crank without the timing belt on it or will that make the valves hit against the pistons?

I need any advice I can get


thanks


-John

 

I put the lower cover back on with the pulley and where the TDC markings are it says

| 10 | T

my crank was at the vertical mark between T and 10. I don't know if this is correct, but that's how the car was when I took it apart. I haven't rotated the crank since I took off the belt. The top cam gears are still lined up with the markings on the valve cover. The 2 outside pistons are at the top of the stroke I think, because when I put a long screw driver in there it immediately hits the top of the piston


the oil sprocket was off which is why I think the whole timing was off, but maybe I'm over thinking it

 

If I remeber correctly there is a little plate behind the crankshaft sprocket that has in indent in it, you line this indention with a mark on the block towards the top left.
It doesn't really matter how it was when you took it off as long as you line everything up correctly when it goes back together.

 

well all that had me worried was the oil sprocket being off. I'm uploading pictures right now because those say 1000 words... gimme 5 minutes

 

intake cam



exhaust cam



crank pulley







oil sprocket ***this is after I turned it a few times myself and lined it up with both the marks and the screw driver stuck in the hole like 5"







crank sprocket with pulley removed. It's hard to get a picture of, but there is a cut in the crank trigger plate that is in the top left of the picture. I see a marking where it appears it is supposed to line up, but it's off and it corresponds with the amount its off in the previous picture with the lower timing cover...






I did read somewhere that evo's are off sometimes from the factory, much like what mine is. Is this something I should keep the same or something I should make 100% TDC? I'm in the process of doing a full rebuild on the car so tuning will be from scratch and that's no an issue

 

search up on youtube there are some really good videos on there with the info you need.

 

With that lower cover on, that little mark in the harmonic balancer needs to be at the "T" on the cover. Make sure when you spin the oil pump sprocket, that youhave the counterweight on the balance shaft correct. You should just barely spin it and the weight should make the sprocket almost bounce back to the timing mark. Ive never even done the screwdriver trick on motors that ive timed with bs belts. I always use the method I just mentioned.

Ive never did timing on any evo or dsm without it being 100% TDC when I do it.

I dont mean to be a douche, but I kinda feel like if your having troubles lining the marks up and whatnot, maybe you shouldnt be doing it?

Timing can really screw the head up, sometimes motor if it goes at a high rpm.

 

http://www.evoscan.com/vehicle-manuals

Is it me or are you not changing the balance shaft belt??

 

set the trigger plate so the mark on the frontcase is centered with it then check your pulleys. it looks like once the crank is aligned your mivec cam is goign to be off more then a tooth.

the oil pump sprocket (for the balance shaft) will be off as well clockwise.

the crank is the main thing you want to make sure is right then from there adjust everything else to align with it!



real old pic but might help you understand what im referring to in regards to the notch on the trigger plate.

 

are you 100% sure all 4G63 motors actually land on T? I read an article about some motors being off on timing from the factory.

This is where my next question comes in. The cam gears are at TDC like you can see in the pictures. The oil sprocket is correct at TDC now, but the crank is off slightly. The car currently still has the balance belt on and as you know, the balance shaft has a TDC mark on it. When this is balance shaft is at perfect TDC, the crank shaft is not according to the markings on the block... I don't understand what's going on with this 4G63. I thought everything would line up at TDC perfectly...

I'm trying to get to the balance shaft belt right now. Can't get the bolt off the crank sprocket without the crank wanting to turn on me, so I guess I'll use an impact.

 

My trigger plate is off from the timing mark by like 1/8" and that's how it was before I took the belt off... I'm assuming my car with 45k miles had the factory belt on it, but there's no guarantee.


here's the biggest question I have. Should I just disregard how the car was before and set everything on TDC and put it back together? Is there a reason the crank was slightly off while everything else is TDC?

After I get it together I would spin the crank about 15 times and make sure all the TDC markings are still lining up...

 

this picture gives you an idea of how mine looks (this is not my picture). It's just slightly off and on the underside of the marking on the block.



and with the crank like that, it looks like this on the lower timing cover. It's on the marking between T and 10

 

Your trigger is off then, as stated before you need to be on the T of the timing mark.

Also, did you open the service manual on the link I had, and look at the diagrams on the procedure to change the belt. It is very helpful.

 

yes that picture you posted is wrong as well as 4RETECH just stated.

also make sure once its all said and done, remove the grenade pin from the tensioner, rotate the engine until the dowells face up and everythings in time again.

at this time you should beable to slide the pin in and out of the tensioner arm.. if you cant you must readjust the tension on the belt, otherwise you risk the belt failing sooner & bearings in pulleys not lasting as long as they should due to improper tension.

 

yep I read all that in the service manual and I think I understand what to do and why to do it.

The only concern was that the crank is not at TDC according to both the timing cover and the trigger plate. So after all the belts are taken off, should I put it back like it was or should I put it back with everything at true 100% TDC? (according to the block markings). I'll go ahead and make everything TDC according to block markings and just assume the car was put together wrong in the first place. When it's all said and done, the balance shaft, oil sprocket, cam gears and harmonic balancer all should read perfect TDC, correct?

Again, just to clarify: The motor was like this when I took it apart, I'm not sure if it's factory or if the previous owner had a bad timing belt job done - but the car only has 45k miles so I assume it's factory...


oh and one more question (sorry) - in the service manual it mentions moving gears back 1 tooth and such, but with both cam gears locked in place, is that necessary? Do I need to pull both the crank and oil sprocket 1 tooth counterclockwise then put the belt on? Will the tension then put them in the correct spot?