BakZamGai

Hi all
Looking to start on the bottom end of my engine. Currently torn between using a 4G64 crank to run a 2.3 stroker or a 4G64 block mated to the Evo head.
Any comments regarding this? Which will be the better option?
What are the potential pitfalls with using the 4G64 block?
Are the conrods of the 63 and 64 the same? What about pistons?
Will the water/oil galleries match up? Timing belts? Accessory belts?

Anyone makes a 2.3l stroker using Pauter rods and CP pistons? They come highly recommended by my mechanic, so I'm hoping to be able to find everything from one source, rather than mix and match.

If it'll be helpful, my engine is currently running
- HKS 272 cams with sprockets
- HKS valvesprings
- Crower retainers
- Solid lifter conversion
- Some minor porting
- ARP headstuds
- Motec M800 running MAP
- Titanium turbo 9.8t with Mine's elbow
- Standard bottom end

en1gma19

iTrader: (23)

well, unless you have really deep pockets and plan on making it a pure race car, a stroker setup is not worth it. people are making PLENTY of power with the standard 2.0L. But, that's just my opinion, To answer your question, I would go with an aftermarket stroker setup. If you plan on running BIG power, and you must if you're stroking it out, then you will want more durable parts than a stock 4G64 crank/rods/etc. Tomei makes a really nice full stroker setup for a few grand. If I were to go that route, that's what I would choose.

edit: call RnR racing, as they have a setup that you might be interested in.

bpclements

iTrader: (41)

RnR Racing is currently using a 2.4L block in there car. They built it from a galant 2.4 block in which they had to add in the extra oil squirters. I am sure you can contact Ryan and he can give you details about the setup and quote you a price. You can also do a search on here and dig up some info on it also.

BakZamGai

I'm actually looking through Ryan's postings regarding the 2.4l conversion at the mo'..heh

Many will say that the 2.0l setup will make plenty of power..I don't doubt that. I've seen seriously powerful 2.0l setups. But I see there since I intend to rebuild the engine anyway, might as go all the way. Rods and pistons cost about $1400 or so and for $800 more, I get 300cc extra displacement which will allow me to upgrade to a bigger turbo without fear of lag problems.
The stroker setups don't rev as hard as the standard setup because of the rod ratio, which is why I'm looking into the possibility of using a 4G64 block, which may alleviate this problem somewhat.

en1gma19 :
The cost of a stroker setup isn't really that bad. It's about US$2200 from Magnus Motorsports compared to the Tomei 2.2l which I get for $4200. So if I went with the 2.3, I save quite a fair bit there.
There are limitations using the 4G64 crank but I'm after the 'ultimate street car' kinda setup, so crazy 800bhp stuff isn't my cuppa tea.

bpclements :
Ryan's 2.4 long block is going for US$4500 ..awfully close to a Tomei 2.2l stroker kit. The cost and hassle of having an engine sent here also adds costs and other headaches.

3240

I've got a 2.3l stroker in my EVO with an HKS3240 turbo. I went with Toda, which I wouldn't do again. The pistons and crank were fine but the rods looked pretty weak so I wound up replacing them with Pauter rods. Turned out to be a much more expensive process than it needed to be. If I had to do it again I would go with someone who makes their own customer kits like Magnus, as you mentioned. I believe that you can get excellent quality without going with a big name such as Jun, Tomei, or Toda even though they all make decent products.

I had the same objectives as you, I wanted a fast street car that I could also bring to the track when I felt like it. I've driven a 2.0l with a 3037 on it and find it to be a bit too laggy (still alot of fun) and not as powerful as I wanted. I knew that if I went with a bigger turbo the lag would become more noticable so I decided on a stroker kit. My car is as responsive as a stock car and much more responsive than the 2.0l with a 3037. I am rev limited to just over 7500 RPM's but my powerband is much more streetable than a car that you have to "wind up."

Everyone has their own opinions as to the value of a stroker. If high power and steetable is your goal, I say go for it. Good luck.

Aby@MIL.SPEC

iTrader: (161)

What does the 4G64 come in, years & models?

nebolic

iTrader: (1)

The 4G64 came in the 97-99 Eclipse Spyder NA (Non turbo'ed Convertibles)
Also the New eclipse, 3rd RS and GS motors use the 4G64 but it's rotated 180 degrees from the 2G eclipse that i mentioned above.

The 4G64 motor is SOHC. If you're really interested in it, i'm sure a lot of the DSM guys have insights to it as that motor has been around for a while and i believe a lot of people have been trying to mess around with that combo.

Nebo

RnR Racing

iTrader: (23)

Go with the 2.4 block. It will give you the most torque and power over a smaller motor. Driveability on a big turbo is so much fun. It spools instantly and makes driving the car on the street so much better.


With the 2.4 block we sell you get to keep your stock motor so you can always go back to stock later. There is also no core charge. Let me know if there are any other questions on the motor. I will happy to help you out.

Fenris Ulf

iTrader: (-1)

The problem is more the increase in piston speed and the pumping losses associated with a larger stroke. Many Hondas have worse rod ratios from the factory and yet rev higher than a 4G64. Apples to oranges, but dynamically there is MUCH more going on than just the rod ratio.

3240

The RnR setup looks awesome. If their 2.4l setup was available back when I started building my stroker they definately would have gotten my business.

BakZamGai

RnR Racing
Hi Ryan, thanks for the heads-up.
What advantages does using the 2.4l block have over using the 2.3 stroker?
Are there any fitment issues when installing in the Evo? Will the 6mm extra deck height cause any problems?
I actually have a spare head myself, so if I can use a 2.4l block, means I've got a spare engine! heh..
Could you email me with a list of parts that goes into the your 2.4l build? It would be difficult for me to buy a block from you and have it sent here, but I am willing to buy the parts necessary for the build-up from you.
BTW, congratulations on the success of your equal length manifold in the UK. It's a pretty big thing to be endorsed by Simon Norris. heh..

Fenris Ulf
Whoops..sorry for my lack of in-depth technical knowledge. Thank you for the explaination. What are the advantages of using the 2.4l block over the 2.3l stroker kit?

RnR Racing

iTrader: (23)

It would probably be expensive to ship over there. Email me and I will give a list of parts that we build to make the 2.4 work properly and also a list of parts you will need to buy.

BakZamGai

Fenris
Was looking at my friend's B20 build up where they altered the length of the rod to try and improve the efficiency of the setup.
You reckon this is possible on the 4G64 block? Or even on the 2.3l stroker setup? I'm not too familiar with the calculations involved so perhaps you could enlighten me regarding this?

RnR Racing
Hi Ryan, I've sent you a mail via your website. Thanks for offering you help. It's very much appreciated.
BTW, would like to pose you the same questions as above. Will altering the rod ratio on the 4G64 provide better efficiency? Or did you retain the standard stroke on your 2.4l setup?

ALL
How will the standard turbo react to a 2.4l block setup? Will the increase in the deck height pose a problem for the fitment of the downpipes and such?
I'm facing a problem of either starting with a turbo kit or with a stroker/big block. Honestly torn between the two. What do you guys reckon?

Cheers!

chuntington101

mate please do a search on strokers as many of these questions have bin answered before!

but here goes. on a stock turbo, a 2.3ltr strocker should be out the question. its just TOOOOOO big. the turbo will be out of puff by 5K rpm! unless you want to run a bigger turbo then i wouldn't bother with one. just get the bottom end built and run the stock turbo harder (will be good for 26psi to the redline, you could run it harder in the mid range).

if you do want to go for a strocker then i would say get the JUN 2.2. it is much better sized than the larger 2.3 unless you are going for a out right racer. speack to moses evo on here about them. he is running a 4G64 crank in his with stock length rods and he can only rev the thing top 7.5k. the JUN will make power to over 8.5k and has bin proven to 800bhp and 650+lbs ft of torque. the down sied toi this kit is that it is exspencive!

a cheaper option is to stick the 4G64 crank in there. you will have a problem with getting the right rod length though. you could use stock rod lengthbut this will not be ideal.

you could go for the RnR kit which looks good but again will limit the rpm that you can run!

Boost Solution is producing a 2.3 ltr strocker but have not heard anything from them in a while about how it is going. they said it would go to 9 and handle 1000bhp! but they only said that and most only run the smaller, lighter JUN kits to 8.5!

all of the above options will require a larger turbo unless you want to have the usable rev range of a turbo diesel with the stock turbo! i would go for a GT3037 min. with this, running at 1.6 bar (hard to run higher as it is just too restrictive) and you will get 475bhp and around 440lbs ft on pump fuel.

the ideal option is the GT3240. still very quick in spool up, and will give you all the top end you need (800bhp on JUN as done by Norris Designs). on the 2.3+ltr strockers/hybrids you will find the turbo restrictive past 1.7 bat though (rear housing just too small). in this case i would use a small GT3540.

i would personaly go for a turbo to start with. you could run a GT3037 with spool up a few hundred behind stock and still be able to produce 500bhp on race (about 450 on pump).

hope this helps and any questions just ask. i will try to help as much as pos!

thanks Chris.

Fenris Ulf

iTrader: (-1)

It is generally a good idea to go with the longest rod that is possible for the setup as this will reduce the side loading of the piston and improve longevity. I am sure that the RNR setup has a good rod length and would not be a bad choice.