To Cam or not to Cam!?!?
Feb 19, 2005, 05:18 PM
#16
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I don't think you could do it without cams. Well may be you could but you would be seriously overboosting the car and that is going to hurt the reliability as much as anything (except detonation of course).
Using a bigger turbo without the car breathing any more is like pouring 2x as much fluid down a funnel; yeah it may flow a little more but what it is really doing is just building up pressure. the stock cams can only flow so much and they are perfectly matched (well actually they could stand to be a little bigger IMO) with the stock turbo. Go with a bigger turbo and they aren't going to be able to keep up. If you do the bigger turbo make sure you have the supporting mods and cams are on that list.
Using a bigger turbo without the car breathing any more is like pouring 2x as much fluid down a funnel; yeah it may flow a little more but what it is really doing is just building up pressure. the stock cams can only flow so much and they are perfectly matched (well actually they could stand to be a little bigger IMO) with the stock turbo. Go with a bigger turbo and they aren't going to be able to keep up. If you do the bigger turbo make sure you have the supporting mods and cams are on that list.
Feb 20, 2005, 12:44 AM
#18
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LOL! I guess my next mod will be Cams and Head studs.... But what cams is the question? I do feel the top end of this car really is very weak. My 2G eclipse had tons of top end it was a roll on queen from 60mph kind of car. I really miss it and want that top end back. Where I am it is very very hard to "neogiate" a stop light race. Mostly roll's are what I get.... When you get beat by a civic hatch you kinda start to look for mods... :P I knew those drag radials meant something..... So is the 272 worth it? How is it when it comes to stalling? I can deal with it hear and there.... But if that is all it does I will not be very happy this is my daily driver....
Feb 20, 2005, 01:19 AM
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Im asking myself the same question right now......Ive decided to get cams but cant decide between HKS 264/272 or 272/272......
Has anyone ran the 264/272 and 272/272 that can give there impressions......
I know with proper tuning-flash,safc,or cam gears you can get the 272s to idle good but Im concered about loosing good amounts of torque for small amounts of peak horsepower and more lag......
I dont have much experiance when it comes to modifying cars but from what I have read,if the top end of the 264/272's(and if this cam combo is safe) is similar to the 272's then that would be a great setup for stock to midsize turbos...IMO......
Has anyone ran the 264/272 and 272/272 that can give there impressions......
I know with proper tuning-flash,safc,or cam gears you can get the 272s to idle good but Im concered about loosing good amounts of torque for small amounts of peak horsepower and more lag......
I dont have much experiance when it comes to modifying cars but from what I have read,if the top end of the 264/272's(and if this cam combo is safe) is similar to the 272's then that would be a great setup for stock to midsize turbos...IMO......
Feb 20, 2005, 01:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Nesiop
You do the turbo to be safe you will need to do internals anyway. Headstuds and rod bolts are a very recommended thing... And a clutch eventually to hold better. But you will def. want cams. It is internal but not a huge thing. I need to get a set when taxes come in. It is one of the largest gains for small money. People see gains between 20-30 awhp and .1-.2 off the quarter. Plus 272's def. make up on the highway disadvantage of the evo's awd.
Tim
Tim
Feb 20, 2005, 01:29 AM
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Originally Posted by BlkEvo8AMS
go with the HKS 272's, once u get on the highway with those youll have a grin the whole way home
Feb 20, 2005, 08:31 AM
#25
The only time I have had straight 272's stall is on a car with an aftermarket MAF pipe. On the cars I've installed the cams on with the OE MAF pipe (even with an aftermarket filter on the end of it) there has been not one incident of stalling. This is pre-tune. Now the idle is pretty rough before you get it tuned for the cams, but not so much so that the car is stumbling and stalling. After a tune, I really "like" the lopey idle. I've gotten more complements from the V8 crowd on how good the car sounds at idle. I've yet to install them in a car and it "lose low end torque". Of course I've also yet to install them on a car that didn't at least have a full 3" TBE (something else the layman believes "loses low end torque"). After experience, I have to concur with David Buschur. The 272's are the way to go, unless you have to have a lope free idle. His dyno testing (along with dyno graphs) have shown that the 272 cams give up nothing, nowhere in the power band to the OE or 264 cams.
Feb 20, 2005, 03:51 PM
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In Buschurs staged packages they used 264..... So your saying most people recommend 272's? I don't mind a lope to the idle... My bike has a very lopey idel and I love it. I just don't want driveability throw out the door. My bike stalls rather easy once it gets warm.. Are cam gears a must with 272's?
Last edited by ThEHiTMaN; Feb 20, 2005 at 03:54 PM.
Feb 20, 2005, 03:59 PM
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I've got about 15oo miles on an HKS 272Intake 264Exhaust setup with Fidanza cam gears set at -3, -2. The idle is a little lumpy but I have never stalled and I can feel quite a bit of difference since the cam install. Once the car is warmed up, the idle issue becomes nonexistent for me. Actually my next mod is either going to be the TME 16g Ti turbo (if I can find one in the next week..... since I'm getting tuned in March and would have to have it in by then....) or the mystical 20g that everyone has been talking about. I think having the cams before the turbo is the practical way to do it, but I could be wrong. Just my 2 cents....
Feb 20, 2005, 08:13 PM
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I am between the HKS 264 and HKS 272.... I am not looking to upgrade the valve train so other brands are kinda out.... I don't really want to do cam gears at this time so would 272's really be ok straight up?
