Evo vs...M5
Dec 4, 2005, 06:42 PM
#46
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After I sold my Evo I cross-shopped a few cars as potential replacements. The contenders were:
a new or used Evo (kept stock)
'03-'04 E46 M3
'01-'02 E39 M5
'05 Lotus Elise.
I eliminated the Evo because I was grew tired of the the FnF stigma, both from punks and cops. Also I wanted to avoid the temptation of cheap mods. The Evo is so easy to mod and get huge gains from it but you quickly eradicate any amount of civility left remaining in the car by the factory.
I considered the M5 somewhat seriously. A local used car dealer had a low mileage '01 that really caught my attention. The M5 is just soooo pimp. I ultimately decided against it because it would be too heavy to track without dumping an assload into suspension and brake mods.
I really, really looked hard at the Lotus Elise as well. As far as a pure track car and a pure driver's car, the Lotus probably comes closest to the description. To make a long story short, despite the Toyota drivetrain I decided that the Lotus wouldn't fit the bill as a daily driver. Too low to the ground to be safely seen in DC traffic and from the reports I read online, too many idiosyncracies such as roof leaks, oil leaks and other crap.
Ultimately I "settled" on an CPO'd '03 E46 M3 w/ 13K miles. I think it will fit the bill for my style of daily driving needs and will be fun on the track for the half dozen or so track events per year I'll end up doing with it. It will hold me over until I can muster the funds to buy a dedicated track car.
a new or used Evo (kept stock)
'03-'04 E46 M3
'01-'02 E39 M5
'05 Lotus Elise.
I eliminated the Evo because I was grew tired of the the FnF stigma, both from punks and cops. Also I wanted to avoid the temptation of cheap mods. The Evo is so easy to mod and get huge gains from it but you quickly eradicate any amount of civility left remaining in the car by the factory.
I considered the M5 somewhat seriously. A local used car dealer had a low mileage '01 that really caught my attention. The M5 is just soooo pimp. I ultimately decided against it because it would be too heavy to track without dumping an assload into suspension and brake mods.
I really, really looked hard at the Lotus Elise as well. As far as a pure track car and a pure driver's car, the Lotus probably comes closest to the description. To make a long story short, despite the Toyota drivetrain I decided that the Lotus wouldn't fit the bill as a daily driver. Too low to the ground to be safely seen in DC traffic and from the reports I read online, too many idiosyncracies such as roof leaks, oil leaks and other crap.
Ultimately I "settled" on an CPO'd '03 E46 M3 w/ 13K miles. I think it will fit the bill for my style of daily driving needs and will be fun on the track for the half dozen or so track events per year I'll end up doing with it. It will hold me over until I can muster the funds to buy a dedicated track car.
Dec 4, 2005, 06:50 PM
#48
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Originally Posted by justinhazard
Honda Civic Si or Bugatti Veyron? 
Dec 4, 2005, 06:52 PM
#49
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Another factory you have to look at, What if you get the M5, you get the warranty they sale you. Right after it expires, something breaks. You are a** out man. If you get the Evo IX MR, you will be good for at least 5 years, 60000 miles. Simple bolt ons will not void the warranty, so you don't have anything to worry about.
Dec 4, 2005, 06:53 PM
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I guess I should also mention my serious concern with Evo resale. I, for one, would never buy a used Evo, under any circumstances. I think that is a fairly common sentiment.
Dec 4, 2005, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by cloudy
Id prob have to go with the Civic, just cause the bugatti's interior looks so cheaply made and like everyother car
Dec 4, 2005, 07:12 PM
#52
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Originally Posted by inariv5573
THAT interior is cheaply made? You have gotta be kidding me! That has gotta be one of the most extravagant interiors ever! It is like the chandolier of interiors. One Paris Hilton or Steve Wynn would love. Steve Wynn=owner and designer of Bellagio, Mirage, and the Wynn in Las Vegas for those who don't know.
Dec 4, 2005, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by V8EaterEvo
Another factory you have to look at, What if you get the M5, you get the warranty they sale you. Right after it expires, something breaks. You are a** out man. If you get the Evo IX MR, you will be good for at least 5 years, 60000 miles. Simple bolt ons will not void the warranty, so you don't have anything to worry about.
Dec 4, 2005, 10:35 PM
#54
Trackstar,
The M5 front brake ducts are really simple, formed plastic tubes that direct cool air to the brake rotors. These are stock BMW parts that are standard on Euro M5's (but are not offered on US models) and can be fairly easily installed by most home mechanics. You can draw your own conclusions as to why the US did not get the brake ducts. This is probably the least expensive mod one can do on the M5... but very functional and worthwhile.
Here is a link with more info: http://www.bmwm5.com/greg/brake_ducts
The forum "tips and tricks" on the www.M5board.com also has good info.
Bob
The M5 front brake ducts are really simple, formed plastic tubes that direct cool air to the brake rotors. These are stock BMW parts that are standard on Euro M5's (but are not offered on US models) and can be fairly easily installed by most home mechanics. You can draw your own conclusions as to why the US did not get the brake ducts. This is probably the least expensive mod one can do on the M5... but very functional and worthwhile.
Here is a link with more info: http://www.bmwm5.com/greg/brake_ducts
The forum "tips and tricks" on the www.M5board.com also has good info.
Bob
Dec 5, 2005, 08:54 PM
#55
Originally Posted by RTU M5
I have watched this board for about 2 years and never have anything to offer, but in this case I feel qualified to chime is as an owner of a 2000 M5 and 2003 Evo.
Everyone here seems to know all about the Evo, so I'll aim my comments towards the M5.
I've put 40k miles on the M5 in 5 years, so it's more of a weekend car for me. I have done 12 track days at Laguna Seca and Infineon with it during this time. At the track, the stock M5 feels a bit heavy and understeers. Over time I modded many items including a Dinan Stage III suspension & exhaust, more aggresive brake pads, brake cooling ducts, and lastly Hoosier race slicks on lighter wheels. The suspension package made an immediate difference in handling. The car felt more nimble and turn in was much better. The trade-off was excessive tire wear on the front inside edges during normal street driving (done is 7k miles). Better brake pads and cooling ducts were needed as my confidence grew and speeds increased. The last upgrade to race slicks transformed my sedate family sedan to a track sleeper, but quickly exposed the weakness in the stock brakes. My confidence and speeds went up, but the brakes were not up for it and overheated. I have since retired the M5 from track duty and now have the Evo for that.
The M5 is in a completely different league when it comes to build quality and comfort. After I got my car I was very impressed with the attention to detail... for instance, the interior is completely covered in stitched leather including the entire dash and kick panels along the doors and tranmission tunnel. The headliner is alcantara (a synthetic suede). BTW, I believe the all leather dash was discontinued after '01 and only came with the "luxury" (not sport) interior option.
The M5 is not going to do well in a drag race (it was never meant to), but it will excel at highway speeds and above. The car feels stable and planted, even at 150+. The torque of the M5 V8 is addicting, this engine pulls at (almost) all RPM's. Mechanically, I have not had many problems (but I only have 40k miles on it) and I know many M5 owners who would agree that the cars are solid. I would highly recommend checking out this board for feedback directly from M5 owners: http://www.m5board.com
I would recommend buying a BMW Certified Preowned (CPO) M5 as it will carry the factory warranty. It will certainly cost more than buying a private party car, but IMO the BMW factory warranty coverage will be worth it. This even applies to cars with third party extended warranties. These types of warranties have not had good reviews.
Trackstar, I hope this helps and good luck with your decision.
Bob
Everyone here seems to know all about the Evo, so I'll aim my comments towards the M5.
I've put 40k miles on the M5 in 5 years, so it's more of a weekend car for me. I have done 12 track days at Laguna Seca and Infineon with it during this time. At the track, the stock M5 feels a bit heavy and understeers. Over time I modded many items including a Dinan Stage III suspension & exhaust, more aggresive brake pads, brake cooling ducts, and lastly Hoosier race slicks on lighter wheels. The suspension package made an immediate difference in handling. The car felt more nimble and turn in was much better. The trade-off was excessive tire wear on the front inside edges during normal street driving (done is 7k miles). Better brake pads and cooling ducts were needed as my confidence grew and speeds increased. The last upgrade to race slicks transformed my sedate family sedan to a track sleeper, but quickly exposed the weakness in the stock brakes. My confidence and speeds went up, but the brakes were not up for it and overheated. I have since retired the M5 from track duty and now have the Evo for that.
The M5 is in a completely different league when it comes to build quality and comfort. After I got my car I was very impressed with the attention to detail... for instance, the interior is completely covered in stitched leather including the entire dash and kick panels along the doors and tranmission tunnel. The headliner is alcantara (a synthetic suede). BTW, I believe the all leather dash was discontinued after '01 and only came with the "luxury" (not sport) interior option.
The M5 is not going to do well in a drag race (it was never meant to), but it will excel at highway speeds and above. The car feels stable and planted, even at 150+. The torque of the M5 V8 is addicting, this engine pulls at (almost) all RPM's. Mechanically, I have not had many problems (but I only have 40k miles on it) and I know many M5 owners who would agree that the cars are solid. I would highly recommend checking out this board for feedback directly from M5 owners: http://www.m5board.com
I would recommend buying a BMW Certified Preowned (CPO) M5 as it will carry the factory warranty. It will certainly cost more than buying a private party car, but IMO the BMW factory warranty coverage will be worth it. This even applies to cars with third party extended warranties. These types of warranties have not had good reviews.
Trackstar, I hope this helps and good luck with your decision.
Bob
Dec 6, 2005, 06:27 AM
#57
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I'll also chime in, having owned a 2003 EVO, moving onto a 2000 M5 and now back in an EVO.
RTU said quite a bit that is dead on. The car, in general, is in a different league. The attention to detail is fantastic, the ride quality and overall feel of the car is smooth and simple. The torque is addicting and when pushing it, the car does not feel as heavy or long as it really is.
If I could make one recommendation to you though, is to get the 2001+ M5 if you are really serious about them. The 2000's have a few common problems, as well as a couple less features. Those common issues are VANOS problems, MAF's and carbon buildup. If you read the forums (m5board.com) you will see these have been frequent. They also have a smaller NAV screen (4:3 vs 16:9), although trivial, potential buyers look for that.
So, with that in mind, the 2000 still ran fine, but at this point its value is decreasing rapidly due to these problems (Private Party Value has dropped significantly) and lack of features. I'd stick with the 01's and up.
Finally -- if you are looking for more track usage, or just something a little more fun to drive, get the EVO. I started with one, picked up the 5, and am now back in one. Finally, you are talking a 6 year old high performance, luxury car that started around 80k. In a few years it will be increasingly difficult to sell to someone who wants to finance because of the age.
Good luck
RTU said quite a bit that is dead on. The car, in general, is in a different league. The attention to detail is fantastic, the ride quality and overall feel of the car is smooth and simple. The torque is addicting and when pushing it, the car does not feel as heavy or long as it really is.
If I could make one recommendation to you though, is to get the 2001+ M5 if you are really serious about them. The 2000's have a few common problems, as well as a couple less features. Those common issues are VANOS problems, MAF's and carbon buildup. If you read the forums (m5board.com) you will see these have been frequent. They also have a smaller NAV screen (4:3 vs 16:9), although trivial, potential buyers look for that.
So, with that in mind, the 2000 still ran fine, but at this point its value is decreasing rapidly due to these problems (Private Party Value has dropped significantly) and lack of features. I'd stick with the 01's and up.
Finally -- if you are looking for more track usage, or just something a little more fun to drive, get the EVO. I started with one, picked up the 5, and am now back in one. Finally, you are talking a 6 year old high performance, luxury car that started around 80k. In a few years it will be increasingly difficult to sell to someone who wants to finance because of the age.
Good luck
Dec 6, 2005, 09:20 AM
#58
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I guess I didn't really answer the original question in my earlier post.
If the choice was strictly between a new Evo IX and an '00-'01 M5, I think I'd take the Evo IX and leave it stock. IMO, the Evo IX is lighter weight, under warranty and a better track performer. However, in my case, the F&F image and lack of interior amenities in the Evo lead me down a slightly different path.
If the choice was strictly between a new Evo IX and an '00-'01 M5, I think I'd take the Evo IX and leave it stock. IMO, the Evo IX is lighter weight, under warranty and a better track performer. However, in my case, the F&F image and lack of interior amenities in the Evo lead me down a slightly different path.
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