fox2boost

iTrader: (8)

keep the 100 and move on, dam i hate scammers.

dustin03

iTrader: (54)

The fact of the matter is he sent them, he has a tracking number for them. It even says it was shipped and recived. Point is 2 boxes showed up only one was stolen kind of funny don't you think. Also if you sold this guy so much stuff "I know I do it when someone has no seller rating I hook them up by giving them one" Why did you never leave him one or him give you one. This is a big thing here on Evo-m..... Is it not? it is the way we do business. I have sold many things on here.

scorke

iTrader: (18)

Because I knever thought it was a big deal? I have purchased plenty of things from people and not give nor recieved feedback.

Yes I think its strange, however stranger **** has happened.

Scorke

dustin03

iTrader: (54)

So very true........ Why would Anthony come on here and do this........ Why didnt you come on here along time ago...... Hold on I know you were hoping he would cave in and give you the money....... Wrong ando I hope you like those gauges and they look good in your car. Move on this is one battle you will not win......

rollo

It's not really that strange. Imagine you're an opportunist scumbag walking along the street. You see two packages on a doorstep, one a heavy big-*** box (the strut brace) and one smaller box (the gauges), then obviously you're gonna steal the smaller one. And yeah.. UPS does leave stuff without signatures. I know all this stuff because last week I bought an FPR for my Corrado (small box, ~1lb). UPS web tracking shows "delivered" / "left at front door", but in the four hours between delivery and when I get home from work, it's mysteriously disappeared. And I live at the end of a quiet cul-de-sac, in a "good" area, not on a busy street or anything. It's not the first time either, and always small boxes. So I can see that it could easily happen. By the way, to those who are questioning who puts in the claim, either the shipper or recipient can put in the claim.

It really doesn't sound like a scam if Ando bought 3k worth of other stuff without problems. For a start, generally speaking scammers don't pay with real money then try to get it back by threatening you with Interpol. All this crap about Paypal is neither here nor there. If the Moneygram cashed and is legit, then that's that.

On the other hand, the gauges were sent in good faith. UPS doesn't issue claims payouts for nothing. If anyone here were a scammer, wouldn't they quietly disappear instead of coming on here and joining in the argument?

Seems to me like the guilty party is the random lowlife who swiped the package. Obviously they'll never be caught, so I guess the answer is for everyone to calm down and agree that **** happens. If the OP has the UPS payout for the gauges though, all things being equal the buyer should at least get that hundred bucks back.

CDO

iTrader: (2)

If UPS claims it was delivered and there's written proof of them saying that, the seller should've sent that proof to the buyer. The buyer then has an issue with UPS, not the seller.

If UPS claims to have lost the package, the seller owes the buyer $395. (The package should've been insured for $350)

Because UPS gave the seller $100 it sounds like they're admitting it was lost and the package wasn't insured for full value as it should have been.

But if UPS claimed they didn't lose it but are just giving the $100 to be nice about the whole thing that $100 should go to the buyer and the buyer will have to try on his own to get the rest back from UPS.

TempeRacerGuy

iTrader: (9)

LOL I have been in this same situation. Here is the deal

The seller is liable for ensuring the goods get to the destination (In this case, the place in the US, the middle man). Now, if there was a conversation about insurance being extra, and the buyer declines the safeguards, then the seller's only liability is to give the package to the shipper and pay for the minimums of service.

If the shipper aggrees that the package was lost, then the shipper will pay the insurance claim. They will pay the value of the package (in this case $395) to the seller (the one who paid for the shipping services). OR, they will pay the maximum of the insurance claim. whichever is the lesser.

It sounds like, the shipper gave it to UPS, declined the extra insurance (which would be $1.05 on this package by the way), and also declined other services such as "signature required". So the shipper has one responsibility. to deliver the product to the property within the time table given. If it is stolen from that property after the shipper leaves, it's not their responsibility.

So, sorry seller. you are SOL here. yes it may have been a scam (doubtfull as the buyer has already had vouchers), yes it may have been stolen off of the middle man's porch. but you did not take the measures to ensure that the delivery was protected.

When shipping packages, ship them insured for more than the value of the item. (UPS and Fed Ex insure up to $100, it's 35 cents per $100 over that). and also check the little box that says "signature required" or if shipping with USPS, click on "registered", or "proof of delivery required"

Sorry, but Seller... you are in the wrong here. You did not do your due dilligence to insure the delivery. Man up and take the hit and learn your lesson.

As for the $850 for the buyer... you are smoking crack. The seller owes you the money he recieved for the items., not for what it cost you to get the money to him, not for your time going to western union to get the moneygram... only the EXACT figure that he received for the items with shipping.


As for those saying "UPS always leaves a note saying they will be back" UPS only does that if they have a package with "signature required" checked. Otherwise they can leave it anywhere they want.

My instance was when the UPS driver, who was a friend of mine, and I saw EVERY day, left a package in my recycle bin as I wasn't home, thinking I would see the package when I put more papers in it. However it was recycle day. I got home, and rolled my recycle bin to the curb. Truck came by, and my parts went out with the cardboard and newspapers.

Told the shipper I didn't get my parts. a search was started. delivery log scan said "Delivered to recycle bin" and gave a time. UPS called me to hear my side of the story. they found that the parts were "lost". Paid the claim to the shipper, and the shipper sent me new parts. If they did not have replacement parts, they would have refunded me my entire order. From then on, Greddy sent everything "signature required"

DsmAwdTurbo

iTrader: (10)

Ando,

The whole thing about you not having paypal.....You told me you had paypal... and you were unable to send the amount I was asking for the gauges... I dont care about that. Here is what im willing to do. Correct I didn't insure the gauges...Its whatever now. Heres the deal. I did my part by shipping the gauges to you. They got from point A to point B. Im already out alot of cash for the gauges anyways. I will send you what UPS gave me... Thats what I offer. Take it or leave it.

rollo

Great post TempeRacerGuy, some sound advice there.

Definitely a good point; "signature required" would have ended this before it started. Legally though, whose responsibility is the package once UPS drops it? Surely not the sender, and not really the recipient. They didn't ask for the thing to be put on their doorstep. The situation sucks cos it was hardly gross negligence on anyone's part. But it seems pretty decent of UPS to pay anything on it, since legally I imagine they wouldn't be compelled to do so.

LOL.. I bet your buddy had a hard time explaining that one..

TempeRacerGuy

iTrader: (9)

There was a time when I had millions of dollars in product going through UPS/Fed Ex each year. UPS knew this, and my UPS shipping account bill for the year was in the 5 figure range. Losing a $500 package was not a big deal. As for my buddy, he had hundreds of positive checks in his book, one negative ding wasn't going to hurt him... In fact, last week I got a call from my mother that she had hired him and his new landscaping business to install a sprinkler set with auto timers and the works. Him and his crew did all the yards in a day.

BACK ON TOPIC...

The seller's responsibility is to get the package to the buyer... or the buyer's receiver in this instance, this is why there is a NAME on the top line of the "To" section of the package). If it is not expressed how, it doesn't matter how it gets done, it could be Fed-Ex, UPS, US-mail, Pony Express, Hand Delivered, or Stork... it doesn't matter as long as the product gets to the intended PERSON within a "reasonable time", not the receiver's property. Generally, if a package gets to the property, it gets to the person. However in situations like mine and this one, that did not happen. This is why there is protection like "signature required"

There is a whole arguement here that when delivering to the property, the seller's due diligence is done... however something being left at the door is not secure. With US mail, mail delivered to the mail box is considered delivered to the person (Because the inside of US mail boxes are federal property and protected by federal law), However with private shipping services, they and the seller are taking a gamble by leaving the items unprotected on the property. In fact, if a delivery from UPS is over a certain figure, they will ONLY deliver it with a signature to protect themselves

The long and short of it is this.

DSMAWDTURBO: You did not insure delivery to the recipient. If you purchased the insurance or checked signature required, you would be protected. You cheaped out on shipping, and it didn't get to the recipient. You should refund the total amount received. Delivered to property is not delivered to recepient... Now, if requested that the package was delivered to "General Delivery" or no name, just an address... then you would be protected. However if you put a name on that top line, you're responsible.

Ando (whatever your screen name is)
You are entitled to the money's that DSMAWDTURBO received ($395), not what it cost you to send the money to him, and not what the gauges were worth in your opinion.


Now, for the rest of you reading this.... I suggest that you post what DSMAWDTURBO should do. He may or may not listen, but I think his concious will be unburdoned if he follows what the majority say? No?

rollo

Okay, no offense intended. Just thought it was a funny story, and from the UPS folk I know round this way, middle management there isn't generally blessed with much of a sense of humour.

Back to the topic in hand. Just reading back through, this has been going on for almost a year?! For the sake of a couple hundred bucks, I'd think all of your time and stress is probably worth more than that. What sucks is that whatever the resolution, somebody is gonna end up losing out. Maybe you guys need to get on a conf call and hammer it out.

DsmAwdTurbo

iTrader: (10)

I think thats the whole problem. We both feel like we are losing out. Gotta be a happy medium somewhere. Im out the money I paid for the guages... so basically it would be me throwing away retail value of the gauges - 100 bucks. I see points from all directions however.

mis4tun81

Doubbbbbble post

mis4tun81

Remember the gauges were stolen AFTER you sold them and recieved payment in full of your agreed upon amount.

So the $100 from UPS is not yours to keep, scam or not, once you cashed the money gram the gauges wern't yours, and neither is the insurance money.

You had no loss in the deal. You got everything you asked for. You are not losing out, or throwing anything away, as you suggest.

Keeping the $100 is the only crime I see.

DsmAwdTurbo

iTrader: (10)

I agree keeping the 100 bucks is the crime. I am offering the 100 bucks...