XEDE dyno results, now with boost control
Aug 7, 2003, 09:24 PM
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XEDE dyno results, now with boost control
Hi guys,
As some may already now, we’re spending much of this week testing or new boost-control enabled XEDE maps and plug-in harness. Managed to take some good pictures for the installation manual as well
Until now, we’ve only had SubZero (stock EVO) and Stage Zero (EVO with 3” cat-back) maps for pre-boost control XEDEs. Today, we had the opportunity to test a completely stock EVO on our dyno, with and without the fully-featured XEDE. The car we tested was one of the EVOs tested last weekend at the dyno day we hosted. It made 195-197 wheel hp then. Today, it made 197-200 wheel hp (it was a bit cooler today). Both results in-line with most other stock EVOs we've seen.
After an afternoon of XEDE testing/tuning, it made a repeatable 218-222 wheel hp through boost, timing, knock sensor sensitivity and fuel changes. Peak boost pressure is unchanged from stock (18 PSI) but holds to redline. A/F ratios are still quite rich (below 10.5:1) under boost, making things perfectly appropriate for 91 octane CA fuel. Peak hp and torque is still at 6400 and 4100RPM, respectively. At 7200RPM, the difference in output is 25-30 wheel hp. Compared to our old pre-boost control mapping, we are running a bit richer and more consistently with the new plug-in, boost controlling XEDEs while still making the same, if not more, power. There is also more power under the curve with noticeable torque gains as low as 4500RPM.
Next up, we removed the muffler section and ran the car again several times. With the axle back removed, boost increased by 1psi and power went up to 225-230 wheel hp with a few humps and dips in the torque/power curves (the extra boost was inducing knock sensor activity). After remapping the boost tables to bring boost back down a bit, power stabilized at a repeatable 225 wheel hp. Next, we removed the intermediate pipe and ran the car again. Now with the entire cat-back removed, power output climbed to 235 wheel hp without any tuning. This should give us a hint of what is to come tomorrow when wel install our 3" cat-back and wrap up Stage Zero mapping. But based on today’s results, we expect to see Stage Zero output in the 230-240 range which would be a bit better than we originally expected.
Again, these results are on 91 octane fuel with 3rd gear pulls. Our 93/94 octane maps should, all other things equal, should make another 10-15 wheel hp. Also, all our dyno results are from our in-house Dyno Dynamics all-wheel drive dyno which reads substantially lower than the traditional intertial-style Dynojet dynos. To get an idea of Dynojet output, multiply our numbers by 1.15-1.17.
We will update the forum tomorrow with final results as well as a bunch of dyno graphs (hp,torque,afr,boost) of both Stage Zero and SubZero.
Cheers,
shiv
As some may already now, we’re spending much of this week testing or new boost-control enabled XEDE maps and plug-in harness. Managed to take some good pictures for the installation manual as well
Until now, we’ve only had SubZero (stock EVO) and Stage Zero (EVO with 3” cat-back) maps for pre-boost control XEDEs. Today, we had the opportunity to test a completely stock EVO on our dyno, with and without the fully-featured XEDE. The car we tested was one of the EVOs tested last weekend at the dyno day we hosted. It made 195-197 wheel hp then. Today, it made 197-200 wheel hp (it was a bit cooler today). Both results in-line with most other stock EVOs we've seen.
After an afternoon of XEDE testing/tuning, it made a repeatable 218-222 wheel hp through boost, timing, knock sensor sensitivity and fuel changes. Peak boost pressure is unchanged from stock (18 PSI) but holds to redline. A/F ratios are still quite rich (below 10.5:1) under boost, making things perfectly appropriate for 91 octane CA fuel. Peak hp and torque is still at 6400 and 4100RPM, respectively. At 7200RPM, the difference in output is 25-30 wheel hp. Compared to our old pre-boost control mapping, we are running a bit richer and more consistently with the new plug-in, boost controlling XEDEs while still making the same, if not more, power. There is also more power under the curve with noticeable torque gains as low as 4500RPM.
Next up, we removed the muffler section and ran the car again several times. With the axle back removed, boost increased by 1psi and power went up to 225-230 wheel hp with a few humps and dips in the torque/power curves (the extra boost was inducing knock sensor activity). After remapping the boost tables to bring boost back down a bit, power stabilized at a repeatable 225 wheel hp. Next, we removed the intermediate pipe and ran the car again. Now with the entire cat-back removed, power output climbed to 235 wheel hp without any tuning. This should give us a hint of what is to come tomorrow when wel install our 3" cat-back and wrap up Stage Zero mapping. But based on today’s results, we expect to see Stage Zero output in the 230-240 range which would be a bit better than we originally expected.
Again, these results are on 91 octane fuel with 3rd gear pulls. Our 93/94 octane maps should, all other things equal, should make another 10-15 wheel hp. Also, all our dyno results are from our in-house Dyno Dynamics all-wheel drive dyno which reads substantially lower than the traditional intertial-style Dynojet dynos. To get an idea of Dynojet output, multiply our numbers by 1.15-1.17.
We will update the forum tomorrow with final results as well as a bunch of dyno graphs (hp,torque,afr,boost) of both Stage Zero and SubZero.
Cheers,
shiv
Last edited by shiv@vishnu; Aug 7, 2003 at 09:33 PM.
Aug 7, 2003, 09:32 PM
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impressive...
so, what is the status of the remapped factory ECU's...? is that still in the works...?
so, you will have Xede's for both 91 and 93 octane...? and this is all plug and play now, no more splicing...?
so, what is the status of the remapped factory ECU's...? is that still in the works...?
so, you will have Xede's for both 91 and 93 octane...? and this is all plug and play now, no more splicing...?
Aug 7, 2003, 09:33 PM
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i also wanted to say congrats on the C&D article... your EVO performed very well, and was probably one of the more honest numbered cars there... so many of those cars seemed to have over stated hp claims... and no numbers to back the claims up...
were you driving the car, or did one of their drivers...?
were you driving the car, or did one of their drivers...?
Aug 8, 2003, 10:34 AM
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Re: XEDE dyno results, now with boost control
Originally posted by shiv@vishnu
Hi guys,
As some may already now, we’re spending much of this week testing or new boost-control enabled XEDE maps and plug-in harness. Managed to take some good pictures for the installation manual as well
Until now, we’ve only had SubZero (stock EVO) and Stage Zero (EVO with 3” cat-back) maps for pre-boost control XEDEs. Today, we had the opportunity to test a completely stock EVO on our dyno, with and without the fully-featured XEDE. The car we tested was one of the EVOs tested last weekend at the dyno day we hosted. It made 195-197 wheel hp then. Today, it made 197-200 wheel hp (it was a bit cooler today). Both results in-line with most other stock EVOs we've seen.
After an afternoon of XEDE testing/tuning, it made a repeatable 218-222 wheel hp through boost, timing, knock sensor sensitivity and fuel changes. Peak boost pressure is unchanged from stock (18 PSI) but holds to redline. A/F ratios are still quite rich (below 10.5:1) under boost, making things perfectly appropriate for 91 octane CA fuel. Peak hp and torque is still at 6400 and 4100RPM, respectively. At 7200RPM, the difference in output is 25-30 wheel hp. Compared to our old pre-boost control mapping, we are running a bit richer and more consistently with the new plug-in, boost controlling XEDEs while still making the same, if not more, power. There is also more power under the curve with noticeable torque gains as low as 4500RPM.
Next up, we removed the muffler section and ran the car again several times. With the axle back removed, boost increased by 1psi and power went up to 225-230 wheel hp with a few humps and dips in the torque/power curves (the extra boost was inducing knock sensor activity). After remapping the boost tables to bring boost back down a bit, power stabilized at a repeatable 225 wheel hp. Next, we removed the intermediate pipe and ran the car again. Now with the entire cat-back removed, power output climbed to 235 wheel hp without any tuning. This should give us a hint of what is to come tomorrow when wel install our 3" cat-back and wrap up Stage Zero mapping. But based on today’s results, we expect to see Stage Zero output in the 230-240 range which would be a bit better than we originally expected.
Again, these results are on 91 octane fuel with 3rd gear pulls. Our 93/94 octane maps should, all other things equal, should make another 10-15 wheel hp. Also, all our dyno results are from our in-house Dyno Dynamics all-wheel drive dyno which reads substantially lower than the traditional intertial-style Dynojet dynos. To get an idea of Dynojet output, multiply our numbers by 1.15-1.17.
We will update the forum tomorrow with final results as well as a bunch of dyno graphs (hp,torque,afr,boost) of both Stage Zero and SubZero.
Cheers,
shiv
Hi guys,
As some may already now, we’re spending much of this week testing or new boost-control enabled XEDE maps and plug-in harness. Managed to take some good pictures for the installation manual as well
Until now, we’ve only had SubZero (stock EVO) and Stage Zero (EVO with 3” cat-back) maps for pre-boost control XEDEs. Today, we had the opportunity to test a completely stock EVO on our dyno, with and without the fully-featured XEDE. The car we tested was one of the EVOs tested last weekend at the dyno day we hosted. It made 195-197 wheel hp then. Today, it made 197-200 wheel hp (it was a bit cooler today). Both results in-line with most other stock EVOs we've seen.
After an afternoon of XEDE testing/tuning, it made a repeatable 218-222 wheel hp through boost, timing, knock sensor sensitivity and fuel changes. Peak boost pressure is unchanged from stock (18 PSI) but holds to redline. A/F ratios are still quite rich (below 10.5:1) under boost, making things perfectly appropriate for 91 octane CA fuel. Peak hp and torque is still at 6400 and 4100RPM, respectively. At 7200RPM, the difference in output is 25-30 wheel hp. Compared to our old pre-boost control mapping, we are running a bit richer and more consistently with the new plug-in, boost controlling XEDEs while still making the same, if not more, power. There is also more power under the curve with noticeable torque gains as low as 4500RPM.
Next up, we removed the muffler section and ran the car again several times. With the axle back removed, boost increased by 1psi and power went up to 225-230 wheel hp with a few humps and dips in the torque/power curves (the extra boost was inducing knock sensor activity). After remapping the boost tables to bring boost back down a bit, power stabilized at a repeatable 225 wheel hp. Next, we removed the intermediate pipe and ran the car again. Now with the entire cat-back removed, power output climbed to 235 wheel hp without any tuning. This should give us a hint of what is to come tomorrow when wel install our 3" cat-back and wrap up Stage Zero mapping. But based on today’s results, we expect to see Stage Zero output in the 230-240 range which would be a bit better than we originally expected.
Again, these results are on 91 octane fuel with 3rd gear pulls. Our 93/94 octane maps should, all other things equal, should make another 10-15 wheel hp. Also, all our dyno results are from our in-house Dyno Dynamics all-wheel drive dyno which reads substantially lower than the traditional intertial-style Dynojet dynos. To get an idea of Dynojet output, multiply our numbers by 1.15-1.17.
We will update the forum tomorrow with final results as well as a bunch of dyno graphs (hp,torque,afr,boost) of both Stage Zero and SubZero.
Cheers,
shiv
Also why are there so many EVO's making diffrent boost???
I hit 1.34 on the greddy gauge and I see some people that make much less. (1.22)
Thanks
Eric
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Aug 8, 2003, 10:42 AM
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I ordered an Xede earlier this week..i am supposed to get it today. so i take it the one i am getting doesn't have the boost control capability or is all that is needed is to load a different map....also curious if i will be getting the plug and play harness. thanks.
Aug 8, 2003, 12:20 PM
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So the XEDE is $795+$90 for the plug and play harness that "Comes with everything required for boost control and map switching , while maintaining the OEM look."
Does the harness control the boost?
How much of a performance difference is there between the $880 XEDE w/harness and the $449 WORKS reflash?
Does the harness control the boost?
How much of a performance difference is there between the $880 XEDE w/harness and the $449 WORKS reflash?
Aug 8, 2003, 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by heshamnaim
I ordered an Xede earlier this week..i am supposed to get it today. so i take it the one i am getting doesn't have the boost control capability or is all that is needed is to load a different map....also curious if i will be getting the plug and play harness. thanks.
I ordered an Xede earlier this week..i am supposed to get it today. so i take it the one i am getting doesn't have the boost control capability or is all that is needed is to load a different map....also curious if i will be getting the plug and play harness. thanks.
Aug 8, 2003, 02:23 PM
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Originally posted by Daveyd
So the XEDE is $795+$90 for the plug and play harness that "Comes with everything required for boost control and map switching , while maintaining the OEM look."
Does the harness control the boost?
How much of a performance difference is there between the $880 XEDE w/harness and the $449 WORKS reflash?
So the XEDE is $795+$90 for the plug and play harness that "Comes with everything required for boost control and map switching , while maintaining the OEM look."
Does the harness control the boost?
How much of a performance difference is there between the $880 XEDE w/harness and the $449 WORKS reflash?
Aug 8, 2003, 02:29 PM
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Re: Re: XEDE dyno results, now with boost control
Originally posted by Eric Lyublinsky
So subzero on a Dyno jet should put down 270hp or so on 93oct.
Also why are there so many EVO's making diffrent boost???
I hit 1.34 on the greddy gauge and I see some people that make much less. (1.22)
Thanks
Eric
So subzero on a Dyno jet should put down 270hp or so on 93oct.
Also why are there so many EVO's making diffrent boost???
I hit 1.34 on the greddy gauge and I see some people that make much less. (1.22)
Thanks
Eric
Aug 8, 2003, 04:17 PM
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195 to 200 hp with temperature difference? What about SAE correction negating tmeprature and barometric pressure?
So with just a cat back and ecu tuning with 93/94 octane You offer (guarantee ? ) an increase from 195hp to 255hp? 60 hp or 70.2 hp = 60 * 1.17 on tired and true dynometers for just under 300hp on other dynos?
That's without cams, intake, cam gears?
So with just a cat back and ecu tuning with 93/94 octane You offer (guarantee ? ) an increase from 195hp to 255hp? 60 hp or 70.2 hp = 60 * 1.17 on tired and true dynometers for just under 300hp on other dynos?
That's without cams, intake, cam gears?
Aug 8, 2003, 05:43 PM
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Re: XEDE dyno results, now with boost control
Originally posted by shiv@vishnu
Hi guys,
Again, these results are on 91 octane fuel with 3rd gear pulls. Our 93/94 octane maps should, all other things equal, should make another 10-15 wheel hp. Also, all our dyno results are from our in-house Dyno Dynamics all-wheel drive dyno which reads substantially lower than the traditional intertial-style Dynojet dynos. To get an idea of Dynojet output, multiply our numbers by 1.15-1.17.
We will update the forum tomorrow with final results as well as a bunch of dyno graphs (hp,torque,afr,boost) of both Stage Zero and SubZero.
Cheers,
shiv
Hi guys,
Again, these results are on 91 octane fuel with 3rd gear pulls. Our 93/94 octane maps should, all other things equal, should make another 10-15 wheel hp. Also, all our dyno results are from our in-house Dyno Dynamics all-wheel drive dyno which reads substantially lower than the traditional intertial-style Dynojet dynos. To get an idea of Dynojet output, multiply our numbers by 1.15-1.17.
We will update the forum tomorrow with final results as well as a bunch of dyno graphs (hp,torque,afr,boost) of both Stage Zero and SubZero.
Cheers,
shiv
Additionally, do you plan to capture data from Stage Zero + DP?
Does this mean that the CEL issues have been resolved with new resistor and that Xedes are available for purchase/exchange with the PnP harness?
regards,
Last edited by jfh; Aug 8, 2003 at 05:50 PM.
Aug 8, 2003, 08:08 PM
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Shiv,
How much safety margin is built into your XEDE-tuned cars? What I mean is, Mitsu built in a big safety margin stock for a reason. The last thing they want to deal with are messed up engines from leaning or knocking issues.
I'm always very conservative when it comes to modding, especially altering the ECU's settings for boost, timing, etc.
While my area of the country mostly is 93/94 Octane, if I get Stage 0/1, I would use the 91 Octane mappings to help compensate for any small possibility that there would be any knock or leaning out due to change in temperature or fuel quality or any other unknown variable.
My question though is using the 91 Octane maps enough of a safety margin?
I realize I'm sacrificing 5-10whp but so be it. I'd prefer a tuned engine that lasts and is 100% reliable to another 5-10hp and pushing the edge of safety.
And if I use the 91 mapping on 93/94 octane gas, would there be any negative effect by it running a little richer? I would assume not since the stock ECU is even more rich.
How much safety margin is built into your XEDE-tuned cars? What I mean is, Mitsu built in a big safety margin stock for a reason. The last thing they want to deal with are messed up engines from leaning or knocking issues.
I'm always very conservative when it comes to modding, especially altering the ECU's settings for boost, timing, etc.
While my area of the country mostly is 93/94 Octane, if I get Stage 0/1, I would use the 91 Octane mappings to help compensate for any small possibility that there would be any knock or leaning out due to change in temperature or fuel quality or any other unknown variable.
My question though is using the 91 Octane maps enough of a safety margin?
I realize I'm sacrificing 5-10whp but so be it. I'd prefer a tuned engine that lasts and is 100% reliable to another 5-10hp and pushing the edge of safety.
And if I use the 91 mapping on 93/94 octane gas, would there be any negative effect by it running a little richer? I would assume not since the stock ECU is even more rich.