Noize

iTrader: (24)

That is the most wafer thin weak argument I've ever seen you waste the time to type. The reason the bottom fell out on Unichips is because they are being replaced with all in one units like the XEDE and UTEC. You'll notice that resale values on both those units are quite high. You're going to have to be A LOT more convincing than that.

I defy you to come back to earth and realize that there are more people near San Fransisco, CA with Evos than in Milford, CT. News flash, anybody in the middle cannot get a custom tune from either shop! At least with the XEDE you can start with a close map and then datalog and fine tune the system yourself. Also notice that in the poll, the Xede is winning by a pretty wide margin. It costs more, but you get end user control over every parameter.

As opposed to the WRX which was a lot more dangerous? Vishnu and TXS customers didn't have any problems there. You start with a base map with an XEDE, and you can use any AWD dyno in the country with a wideband O2 to tune your car. With your reflash, you're screwed with whatever they give you if you don't do it on site, and you have to go back everytime you mod to get it reflashed... again... and again. The XEDE will give you a very close map to start from.

If I was in with a shop like you are and had basically unlimited reflashing, I'd probably use it too. But for the majority of Evo drivers, Milford, CT might as well be the North Pole.

Alfriedesq

iTrader: (6)

There s NO such thng as a lbrary of tunes - you CAN NOT share tunes wth other cars and run good power safely

Any tuner who tunes through the mail is making a calculated trade off of saftey vs. power and has to add in a large measure of saftey to allow for car to car variance

THERE IS NO WAY to get a lot of power - safely - when you are not doing the tune ON THE CAR

Of course - there is more $$$ to be made selling units through the mail - once you have the map it takes 5 mins to program it in and there is ZERO cost . The way we are doing requires a $100,000 dyno machine, someone to operate the dyno - lots of effort strapping down the car and a whole hour of time to run it. We feel its the ONLY safe way to tune the EVO 8's so that is the way we are doing it.

When you JUST rent the dyno for an hour to tune a SAFC, emanage or other device it costs $250.00 per hour just for the dyno time - - so I think its a real value for $450.00 to have the tune and dyno time included

Evo11V

iTrader: (18)

I'm going to try pruven's DynoFlash and let everyone know how i like it instead of all this fight talk. I'll give you an honest opinion on the product Pruven is selling.

Alfriedesq

iTrader: (6)

We really dont care how many customers we get. I am not getting involved with this to make a lot of cash. I am involved becuase I enjoy evos like working on evos and I like the idea of giving fellow hobiests a great value for the $$. We stand behind every tune - we are not looking for sales records - we want dyno records and timeslips - we rather do 10 great tunes than 100 in the "ball park" tunes

Its true if your not in the NY metro area your prob too far away - but the poplulation within 100 miles of Milford, CT is very very large

We prefer to stick with a car by car system as Pruven's name and reputation is way too important to risk having problems with slow and dangerous tune through the mail set ups

If you started with a base map exede paid for a dyno and someone to adjust your exede and the softwear you need you will be way over $1,000.00. Then you woudl still have a piggy back BTW - I think the exede and the emanage are great products - obvioulsy tailored more to a do it yourself customer who knows how to tune

The Dyno Flash is geared more to someone who wants to get instant great results without guess work and a lot of wasted time tuning the car on the street

I find re-flahses superior to piggy backs - I've been watching what WRX owners are doing with reflashes and they have gotten some great results

EVOMIZ

iTrader: (11)

dynoflash all the way
I have seen to many people with sandalone systems f-ck there motor up trying to play tune master on the street all it takes is one hard knock. The dyno is the ****, and $450 is worth it. you do get a print out of how much power you make. It's better than the butt dyno, i have seen people leaving the dyno making 50 and more hp. At $250 per hr for dyno time you are paying $200 for minimum 20hp. what mod can you do to your car for $200 and get a dyno sheet and 20 hp? you buy a standalone or piggy back for $300 up to $1000 and you still need to put that thing on the dyno? what it comes down to is that don't just get one mod and run to get the reflash. when I first had halteck on my dsm i felt big gains in the butt dyno untill i got to the dyno and found out what real power feel like. without the dyno tune i would have never made my firts 11 sec past.

bbyevo8

Alfriedesq's car was "dynotuned" and he still f-ck his motor (in your own words). Good luck EVOMIZ, I would very much rather use a "safe" map and sacrifice 10hp instead on going all crazy and having my car in the shop every other week like Alfriedesq's car. Besides have you been on the board for long EVOMIZ?? Alfriedesq was just but a ECU newbie a couple months ago...where shiv corrected him on many of his ECU and tuning misconceptions. I still don't trust him and all his salesman talk.

BTW, dynos are only $100-$150 per hour. $250/hour is another crazy number which I'm not willing to pay. What a ripoff...is all i can say..

EVOMIZ

iTrader: (11)

i think it sill says newbie under your name also

i tell you what i am not new to standalone and i know its not for most people, it's not something you want to test on your brand new car without a dyno.

bbyevo8

Newbie evo owner yes, newbie turbo car owner/enthusiast no... I was a WRX owner for 2 years and was a member of NASIOC all along.

Alfriedesq

iTrader: (6)

First - my stock evo motor made 518 whp with NO problems what so ever - came apart looking almost like new except for some streched head bolts

My built motor suffered a rare, unusual intake valve guide break which had nothing to do with tuning - but rather was prob a fluke casting defect. The bottom line is that if you want to try and make 600 hp on a 2.0 L you are going to have some issues if everything is not perfect and its not going to last for 100,000 miles like a factory motor at 300 hp - - in reality this has NOTHING to do with tuning or the dyno-flash

I am no ecu "newbie" - I've been at this for some time already and I can tell you that Pruven is one of the top few 4g63 tuners in the USA - they certainly are more than competant to re-adjust the factory fuel and ign curves - which are very basic procedures.

You can rent the Pruven dyno for $150.00 per hour just for the dyno - you tune yourself ; $185.00 with a/f sniffer - and its $250.00 and hour when they actually do the tuning on your car. I think these prices are in line with what other shops charge for tuning

mojo

iTrader: (4)

I don't get it Al just last month you were praising WORKS and how with there through the mail reflash you had achieved so much. Now you state:

"We prefer to stick with a car by car system as Pruven's name and reputation is way too important to risk having problems with slow and dangerous tune through the mail set ups"

Were you happy with the WORKS through the mail flash? If so why would you now be calling it dangerous? Am I missing something? I realize in context you were refering to the Exede but WORKS is through the mail also and you had nothing but good things to say.

Alfriedesq

iTrader: (6)

WORKS seems to have spent a LOT of time and development in creating their maps and they have confidence in their product. I had no problems what so ever with my WORKS reflash.

Also - I love the works throttle body and it has proven its worth on the dyno

Just because other tuners are doing through the mail tunes DOES NOT MEAN that every tuner has to do it.

ALL it means is that www.dynoflash.com is NOT comfortable doing through the mail tunes and is NOT interetsed in making $$ that way. Too much is left to chance and too much of the power must be left on the table to maintain a good margin of saftey to allow for car to car variance, altitude differnces, fuel variation and other variables.

I really don't need to pick any fights with any of you guys over this.

Its very simple - the concept is that www.dynoflash.com does ONE tune at a time - done on the dyno - tuned to match the particular car and optimized to the owner's needs. That is what the company does, thats the way we are doing it and just because others do it a different way does not mean they are wrong. There are many approaches to tuning. We feel this is the most professional and careful manner in which to proceed.

Finally, no one can dispute that having a before and after dyno sheet of what the tune is doing - on your car - is a very valuable resource.

I used to order a lot of "chips" and reflashes back in my ole BMW and Mercedes days - - you had to trust the vedor's word as to what HP gains they were claiming. Nothing like seeing it right on your car - verified on a dyno to know what you are getting.

mojo

iTrader: (4)

Hey Al,
no fighting here. I just didn't understand why you would say that after talking so highly about the WORKS reflash. If I lived in the area I would be getting the dynoflash done. Seems like a decent deal to me. I like the idea of having my car personally tuned for the mods I want. As it is I'm nowhere near Pruven so its not an option. Good luck in your new venture.

bbyevo8

Don't you get it...wherever the wind blows, Alfriedesq goes. For example, Alfriedesq used to have a WRX...It used to be such a "awesome" car for him. Then one day, the evo came out and Subarus became Slowbarus for him. Alfriendesq was the only one who ever used the word "Slowbaru" on nasioc forums insulting all subaru owners. Thus, Alfriedesq has become a very unpopular, even hated character in the Subaru community.

When Alfriedesq gets the eManage, it becomes the best fuel and timing management system - simply amazing he says. Now, it just doesn't cut it. When he gets the works reflash for free probably, he says all the nice stuff....and now this. For all you know, 2 years later when the Skyline GTR comes out... Our cars will become Mitslowbishi Slowvolutions to Alfriedesq. Until now, I don't even understand why tuners or businesses even want to get involved with such a undesirable guy, lowering their corporate image as well. I would rather go with Vishnu Tuning anytime. You guys have no idea how severe the drama was in nasioc when Alfriedesq posted all his c r a p about Evos versus "slowbarus". It made a big part of the Subaru community hate Evos. It took me a lot to buy one, that I had to be associated with ****** like Alfriedesq. But finally I decided that a car is a car, and a ***** is a *****. I won't associate my car in anyway with Alfriedesq, I will not buy any Pruven parts or services.

Rollaway

iTrader: (4)

im with you there...

mojo

iTrader: (4)

Hey bbyevo8,
when the GTR gets here I'll be calling my car Mitslowbishi


Al just likes attention and everyone complies and gets all bent up, which off course is the objective. Look at every thread he gets involved in. They all have like 200+ post and everybody is pissed. Its like a fight at recess, everybody wants to watch.
This is his entertainment. You can't take this **** personal, you'll have a heart attack. He just throws anything out there he's thinking without thinking and ends up contradicting himself sometimes.

If I was a vendor I probably wouldn't want him representing me but I'm not a vendor. I'd still try the dynoflash if I was close enough and had a bunch of mods I wanted tuned properly with a reflash. $450 seems reasonable to me for what your getting as long as it's done well.

Take care.