Evo or sti??? Which should i buy. Please help
Mar 27, 2014, 02:05 PM
#136
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I would stay away from a Subaru unless keeping bone stock so you still have a warranty. They are not reliable even in stock form. Might not know this but the Suabru dealers, at least by me, always have two bottom ends in stock. Mitsu doesnt do this. Subaru is also open deck. Also the power steering reservoir sits lower than the pump, so fluid fights gravity. This usually leads to a PS pump failure and can potentially take out the rack as well.
It also has a horrible design for forced induction, exhaust manifold is horribly unequal, the "rumble" ppl refer to is turbulence and actually hurts performance. The fuel rails are designed poorly which leads to cylinder 3 or 4, drawing a blank right now, running leaner than the rest. over time that cylinder will let go.
The 5 speeds break if you look at them wrong and the 6 speed gears are way to short. If you go FMIC you have 30 feet of IC piping, exaggeration obviously but you get the point. Oil pick up tubes crack and that leads to spun bearings. Subaru is plagued with many issues.
It also has a horrible design for forced induction, exhaust manifold is horribly unequal, the "rumble" ppl refer to is turbulence and actually hurts performance. The fuel rails are designed poorly which leads to cylinder 3 or 4, drawing a blank right now, running leaner than the rest. over time that cylinder will let go.
The 5 speeds break if you look at them wrong and the 6 speed gears are way to short. If you go FMIC you have 30 feet of IC piping, exaggeration obviously but you get the point. Oil pick up tubes crack and that leads to spun bearings. Subaru is plagued with many issues.
Mar 27, 2014, 02:16 PM
#137
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I would stay away from a Subaru unless keeping bone stock so you still have a warranty. They are not reliable even in stock form. Might not know this but the Suabru dealers, at least by me, always have two bottom ends in stock. Mitsu doesnt do this. Subaru is also open deck. Also the power steering reservoir sits lower than the pump, so fluid fights gravity. This usually leads to a PS pump failure and can potentially take out the rack as well.
It also has a horrible design for forced induction, exhaust manifold is horribly unequal, the "rumble" ppl refer to is turbulence and actually hurts performance. The fuel rails are designed poorly which leads to cylinder 3 or 4, drawing a blank right now, running leaner than the rest. over time that cylinder will let go.
The 5 speeds break if you look at them wrong and the 6 speed gears are way to short. If you go FMIC you have 30 feet of IC piping, exaggeration obviously but you get the point. Oil pick up tubes crack and that leads to spun bearings. Subaru is plagued with many issues.
It also has a horrible design for forced induction, exhaust manifold is horribly unequal, the "rumble" ppl refer to is turbulence and actually hurts performance. The fuel rails are designed poorly which leads to cylinder 3 or 4, drawing a blank right now, running leaner than the rest. over time that cylinder will let go.
The 5 speeds break if you look at them wrong and the 6 speed gears are way to short. If you go FMIC you have 30 feet of IC piping, exaggeration obviously but you get the point. Oil pick up tubes crack and that leads to spun bearings. Subaru is plagued with many issues.
Thank you. This is some really good info. The only one I was aware of was the exhust mani which is why they sell the symmetrical mani's (something like that, basically makes subi sound normal/ricey). Definitely was not aware of the open deck/bottom end issues. Now with these; are they year/model specific or generalities across the board.
Mar 27, 2014, 02:31 PM
#138
Evolving Member
these issues are present on all of them, from bug eyes to brand new ones. Customer of ours had a 2013 wrx with 4,000 miles and spun rod bearings already, on a bone stock car. In the last 4 months have had 6 Subarus that all needed bottom ends. Only one failed from making to much power. Years ranged from 04-2013. As far as the exhaust mani you can buy a Perrin equal length exhaust manifold for example. But as you stated it sounds like a Civic with a fart cannon.
Mar 27, 2014, 02:43 PM
#139
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these issues are present on all of them, from bug eyes to brand new ones. Customer of ours had a 2013 wrx with 4,000 miles and spun rod bearings already, on a bone stock car. In the last 4 months have had 6 Subarus that all needed bottom ends. Only one failed from making to much power. Years ranged from 04-2013. As far as the exhaust mani you can buy a Perrin equal length exhaust manifold for example. But as you stated it sounds like a Civic with a fart cannon.
Agreed on the fart cannon. That's absolutely ridiculous. I understand maintenance, but that to me is unacceptable. I am sure all who have read this thread can see my bias and even I admit my mind is already pretty made up. Thanks for some icing on this cake.
Does this issue also plague the 2.0 wrx's as well? If I cant find the evo I want within a certain amount of time I may go for a wrx and save some more then trade the wrx in on the deal. I always have a contingency plan and loans/multiple trips to cali (where there is an unfair plethora of EVO's) is not viable. One trip maybe more than that is a NO GO.
Mar 28, 2014, 09:36 AM
#142
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Wife's water pump was making noise at 60k. Did a timing belt and water pump 30k earlier because it was a failure waiting to happen. Bearings were pretty bad on that and another timing component.
Mar 28, 2014, 01:11 PM
#144
all cars last a long time if maintained properly, i suppose.
on my WRX i installed a Killer B oil pickup and pan because i tracked the car. the pickups do crack , though. that is catastrophic. the upgraded pickup is 100% necessary.
EL headers do not sound ricey. there is still a bit of "rumble" due to the format of the engine. it does, however sound MUCH cleaner and more efficient. i loved the exhaust note. they do actually even out the EGTs and AFRs, though, along with helping spool and i made more power.
on my WRX i installed a Killer B oil pickup and pan because i tracked the car. the pickups do crack , though. that is catastrophic. the upgraded pickup is 100% necessary.
EL headers do not sound ricey. there is still a bit of "rumble" due to the format of the engine. it does, however sound MUCH cleaner and more efficient. i loved the exhaust note. they do actually even out the EGTs and AFRs, though, along with helping spool and i made more power.
Apr 12, 2014, 08:53 AM
#145
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all cars last a long time if maintained properly, i suppose.
on my WRX i installed a Killer B oil pickup and pan because i tracked the car. the pickups do crack , though. that is catastrophic. the upgraded pickup is 100% necessary.
EL headers do not sound ricey. there is still a bit of "rumble" due to the format of the engine. it does, however sound MUCH cleaner and more efficient. i loved the exhaust note. they do actually even out the EGTs and AFRs, though, along with helping spool and i made more power.
on my WRX i installed a Killer B oil pickup and pan because i tracked the car. the pickups do crack , though. that is catastrophic. the upgraded pickup is 100% necessary.
EL headers do not sound ricey. there is still a bit of "rumble" due to the format of the engine. it does, however sound MUCH cleaner and more efficient. i loved the exhaust note. they do actually even out the EGTs and AFRs, though, along with helping spool and i made more power.
I think there is a more ricey tone to it, but yes it does clean up the sound. Personally, I love the wrx. I seriously think if the evo isn't an option at the time I come home I may just pick one up and just sell it when the evo becomes an option. They still have really good resale.
***Update***
Just want to let you guys know I am sitting at my MOB station and in an undetermined amount of time I will be jumping across the pond. For the next year or so I will be on at random. I appreciate all the well wishes and all the other troops out there. God Bless America.
Apr 12, 2014, 05:00 PM
#146
I've owned both and frequently drive STI's and WRX's where I work.
I just got an evo 9 about 3 weeks ago, and I plan on always having one evo to drive for the rest of my life (I love it that much). The only thing I miss about driving the subaru was the sound. I know some people might say the sound is obnoxious etc, but it is really the only con about getting my evo (even though the evo sounds better at max RPM's
). Another thing was that the amount of STi's & WRX's in Oregon influenced my choice. I've only seen 3 evo's driving around for the entire time I've been in Oregon. Also, after Mitsubishi announced that they will stop the production of the Evo, expect that they will hold their value more.
If you are going for power, I would say the evo wins again. My buddy has an 05 STi full "stage 2" running around 280whp. He isn't on that great of a tune but he told me he should be around 310 with a tune that tries to get the most out of his parts. As for the evo I've only put on an exhaust, fmic, and intake. With just those parts and a tune I'm running a few shy from 350whp @ 26lbs. Evo's are power monsters. He even told me if he could do it all again he'd take an Evo instead of the STi.
Test drive both and see which you enjoy more, but I was a subaru guy for a little, and I've got no regrets making the change.
I just got an evo 9 about 3 weeks ago, and I plan on always having one evo to drive for the rest of my life (I love it that much). The only thing I miss about driving the subaru was the sound. I know some people might say the sound is obnoxious etc, but it is really the only con about getting my evo (even though the evo sounds better at max RPM's
). Another thing was that the amount of STi's & WRX's in Oregon influenced my choice. I've only seen 3 evo's driving around for the entire time I've been in Oregon. Also, after Mitsubishi announced that they will stop the production of the Evo, expect that they will hold their value more.If you are going for power, I would say the evo wins again. My buddy has an 05 STi full "stage 2" running around 280whp. He isn't on that great of a tune but he told me he should be around 310 with a tune that tries to get the most out of his parts. As for the evo I've only put on an exhaust, fmic, and intake. With just those parts and a tune I'm running a few shy from 350whp @ 26lbs. Evo's are power monsters. He even told me if he could do it all again he'd take an Evo instead of the STi.
Test drive both and see which you enjoy more, but I was a subaru guy for a little, and I've got no regrets making the change.
Apr 12, 2014, 06:41 PM
#147
As for the evo I've only put on an exhaust, fmic, and intake. With just those parts and a tune I'm running a few shy from 350whp:
Last edited by kaj; Apr 14, 2014 at 09:38 AM.
Apr 13, 2014, 05:19 AM
#149
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since this is a forum, allow me to have my say.
I always feel funny about these posts.
Almost as bad as the one i read on the http://www.skylinesaustralia.com forum.
Some guy asked; I'm thinking of two cars to buy, "R34 GT-R or Evolution IX, which is BETTER?"
Seriously, a No-Brainer question, what do you think the response was?!
Incase its not obvious, The website is an Aussie Skylines forum (that arrange meet ups, cruises etc etc)
The majority of people are under 27 yrs old, lives at home with their parents and owns a R32 GTS, R33 GTS-t, R32 GT-R, R33 GT-R and R34 GT-T. Some of these guy would probably some how get the BNR34 onto their beds and have their way with the car… (with them, on top of course). In other words, No doubt, every skyline owner would WISH and WORSHIP the BNR34.
So the outcome, the EVO got trashed except for 2 people. Majority said it was literally a crappy, Glorified-lancer with a turbo and oversized spoiler. and that the GTR-34 is KING.
and that the GT-R would munch the EVO in all aspects.
in reality, it doesn't… speaking stock vs stock or even Stage 1 vs stage 1. there is no way in heaven, hell or earth can any of the R32, 33 or 34 GT-Rs outperform majority of the EVO from say; V - X…especially on the track.
BUt theres no point arguing with them, its a skyline forum… people there can actually really love and adore their cars.
Try going to a Mustang/corvette V8 forum and ask them "what should i buy, a V8 or a JDM Turbo 4cyl"…
They would probably call you a "ricer" for even considering a JDM… (Ive even seen the R35 GT-R being called a "ricer" by an Internet Keyboard hero on youtube).
Anyhow, back on topic.
I would also join the Subaru/STI Forum and ask the same question there.
Don't take any as gospel… at the end of the day its your money and your car. You will be the one stuck with it.
To sum things up and to answer your question from my own opinion;
The 2006' STI is the best looking STI, if i didn't end up finding my car (the IX) i would of probably end up buying that one. They're both brilliant cars.
Mechanically wise, i find the Subaru boxer motors a real pain in the butt to service, as someone said here. The spark plugs actually took me over 1.5hr as well, on an RS 2004'.
But took 15 mins on the 4G63 the other day.
In performance wise, there are countless comparisons on youtube.
both cars have been closely compared by Presenters such as Top Gear, Fifth gear, Motortrend, Edmunds and Best motoring.
Driven hard to the limits by Professional race car drivers…. the truth is, the STI almost….ALWAYS gets outperformed by the EVOs… just about EVERY TIME.
Accelerating, Braking, cornering… you name it.
I always feel funny about these posts.
Almost as bad as the one i read on the http://www.skylinesaustralia.com forum.
Some guy asked; I'm thinking of two cars to buy, "R34 GT-R or Evolution IX, which is BETTER?"
Seriously, a No-Brainer question, what do you think the response was?!
Incase its not obvious, The website is an Aussie Skylines forum (that arrange meet ups, cruises etc etc)
The majority of people are under 27 yrs old, lives at home with their parents and owns a R32 GTS, R33 GTS-t, R32 GT-R, R33 GT-R and R34 GT-T. Some of these guy would probably some how get the BNR34 onto their beds and have their way with the car… (with them, on top of course). In other words, No doubt, every skyline owner would WISH and WORSHIP the BNR34.
So the outcome, the EVO got trashed except for 2 people. Majority said it was literally a crappy, Glorified-lancer with a turbo and oversized spoiler. and that the GTR-34 is KING.
and that the GT-R would munch the EVO in all aspects.
in reality, it doesn't… speaking stock vs stock or even Stage 1 vs stage 1. there is no way in heaven, hell or earth can any of the R32, 33 or 34 GT-Rs outperform majority of the EVO from say; V - X…especially on the track.
BUt theres no point arguing with them, its a skyline forum… people there can actually really love and adore their cars.
Try going to a Mustang/corvette V8 forum and ask them "what should i buy, a V8 or a JDM Turbo 4cyl"…
They would probably call you a "ricer" for even considering a JDM… (Ive even seen the R35 GT-R being called a "ricer" by an Internet Keyboard hero on youtube).
Anyhow, back on topic.
I would also join the Subaru/STI Forum and ask the same question there.
Don't take any as gospel… at the end of the day its your money and your car. You will be the one stuck with it.
To sum things up and to answer your question from my own opinion;
The 2006' STI is the best looking STI, if i didn't end up finding my car (the IX) i would of probably end up buying that one. They're both brilliant cars.
Mechanically wise, i find the Subaru boxer motors a real pain in the butt to service, as someone said here. The spark plugs actually took me over 1.5hr as well, on an RS 2004'.
But took 15 mins on the 4G63 the other day.
In performance wise, there are countless comparisons on youtube.
both cars have been closely compared by Presenters such as Top Gear, Fifth gear, Motortrend, Edmunds and Best motoring.
Driven hard to the limits by Professional race car drivers…. the truth is, the STI almost….ALWAYS gets outperformed by the EVOs… just about EVERY TIME.
Accelerating, Braking, cornering… you name it.
Last edited by wowzers; Apr 14, 2014 at 01:20 AM.
Apr 14, 2014, 05:06 AM
#150
Ive owned both a 420whp legacy gt with a built motor, and now a 420whp evo with a built motor. Both have been a major pain in the ***. The evo predominantly because it wasnt serviced well by the previous owner and I inherited his problems.
If you want to roll around with 400whp "reliably" get an Evo. EJ's cannot take the abuse. It is a very popular trend on nasioc high HP builds will fail much fast than EVO's. The motors are fragile, and need even a closer eye on maintenance and checklists than the EVO's.
If you have a warranty and dont plan on modifying it, I will say the subarus are much more livable as a daily driver than an EVO. I have not driven an EVO X, but the 9's are ridiculous for a street car in my opinion. Maybe im getting old.
These are my honest thoughts.
If you want to roll around with 400whp "reliably" get an Evo. EJ's cannot take the abuse. It is a very popular trend on nasioc high HP builds will fail much fast than EVO's. The motors are fragile, and need even a closer eye on maintenance and checklists than the EVO's.
If you have a warranty and dont plan on modifying it, I will say the subarus are much more livable as a daily driver than an EVO. I have not driven an EVO X, but the 9's are ridiculous for a street car in my opinion. Maybe im getting old.
These are my honest thoughts.