The Truth About Ohlins R/T Coilovers
May 4, 2006, 10:10 AM
#16
Originally Posted by EVOlutionary
I would hope that they would not seal up a shock they are rebuilding with permanent loctite.
EVOlutionary
Last edited by sspeed; May 4, 2006 at 10:37 AM.
May 4, 2006, 10:27 AM
#17
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Originally Posted by geminix3
pretty interesting statement, considering he's a direct competitor with a well documented history of getting into pissing matches (good natured or not) with the guys selling the r/t setup. think about it.
not to take anything away from robi or his opinions, but get real.
not to take anything away from robi or his opinions, but get real.
Funny you would assume I was pitting the R/T product against what Robi sells..(which by the way is at least 4 brands and he will help tune anything that is already on someones setup)..seems some are a little defensive......Yes, he just did my car last weekend BUT he had nothing but compliments for Paul. Paul has also been kind enough to help me on occasion too! Matter of fact ROBI talked very positively about three or four brands of coilovers and he also talked very positively about Works as well. He has more experience then you or I will ever accumulate in a lifetime so I did take some of what he said to heart...and my car works, period. It is a fairly low tech basic set up but my car has improved ten fold with minimal mods.....I also drove a new 9 MR with the KW setup and was astonished. Hell I don't even know enough about coilovers right now to comment on the RT's it just seems that ROBI sells what he believes works (mutiple brands) and what makes sense for the individual. In the end I chose ROBI because of the following reasons: 1. He will travel to where your car is. 2. He has a great entry level product that works and can be upgraded. 3. He answers phone calls and emails. 4. He doesn't say he is here to help the everyday Evo owner and then work on a teams race car for weeks on end and not return calls. (I am not referring to Paul or Works by the way!) Considering the amount of work he performed and information he imparted the labor charge was of great value.
I have been in retail for 30 years and am now a sales rep who has 400 accounts...ROBI was a great value and I felt like I actually got more than what I paid for...that doesn't happen often these days. I am sure I now sound like an a huge advocate for ROBI and I guess in a way I am. But of all the people I have dealt with in the EVO aftermarket world he was the LEAST bias of any I have had dealings with. In the end you have to make your own decision anyway. I just wanted to relay my experience because I imagine there are plenty of EVO owners out there with similiar thoughts of how to go about suspension upgrades...
Michael
Last edited by Michael Adair; May 4, 2006 at 05:15 PM.
May 4, 2006, 11:18 AM
#19
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Originally Posted by Michael Adair
Funny you would assume I was pitting the R/T product against what Robi sells..(which by the way is at least 4 brands and he will help tune anything that is already on someones setup)..seems some are a little defensive.....
Michael
Michael
fair enough, and like i said, i don't mean any disrespect to robi or his accomplishments, and i know nothing about him professionally, since i haven't done business with him. i hear nothing but good, and that counts for a lot.
what i *am* saying, is that there are numerous lengthy examples of he and paul (and mueller, and others, on occasion) getting into pretty noisy disputes over this, and your cryptic statement regarding his "straight scoop" on this product sounded to me like a (very polite) inference of more of the same. i'm not really in disagreement with your statement, but the pattern has been established.
personally, i'm inclined to simply work with the most skilled chassis tech i have access to, and follow his lead, wherever it takes me. sounds like we're in agreement- in your case that's robi, and i doubt you can go wrong with that path.
but maybe you've noticed two recurring themes:
1- there isn't a whole lot of agreement, even among the guys here who really know their sh*t, on the best path to take with chassis optimization.
and
2- any of the guys working at the level these guys are, can win on even the crappiest hardware. it's the setup, and it's agreement with the driver- not the hardware- that wins. i know we don't disagree on that.
May 4, 2006, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by geminix3
fair enough, and like i said, i don't mean any disrespect to robi or his accomplishments, and i know nothing about him professionally, since i haven't done business with him. i hear nothing but good, and that counts for a lot.
what i *am* saying, is that there are numerous lengthy examples of he and paul (and mueller, and others, on occasion) getting into pretty noisy disputes over this, and your cryptic statement regarding his "straight scoop" on this product sounded to me like a (very polite) inference of more of the same. i'm not really in disagreement with your statement, but the pattern has been established.
personally, i'm inclined to simply work with the most skilled chassis tech i have access to, and follow his lead, wherever it takes me. sounds like we're in agreement- in your case that's robi, and i doubt you can go wrong with that path.
but maybe you've noticed two recurring themes:
1- there isn't a whole lot of agreement, even among the guys here who really know their sh*t, on the best path to take with chassis optimization.
and
2- any of the guys working at the level these guys are, can win on even the crappiest hardware. it's the setup, and it's agreement with the driver- not the hardware- that wins. i know we don't disagree on that.
what i *am* saying, is that there are numerous lengthy examples of he and paul (and mueller, and others, on occasion) getting into pretty noisy disputes over this, and your cryptic statement regarding his "straight scoop" on this product sounded to me like a (very polite) inference of more of the same. i'm not really in disagreement with your statement, but the pattern has been established.
personally, i'm inclined to simply work with the most skilled chassis tech i have access to, and follow his lead, wherever it takes me. sounds like we're in agreement- in your case that's robi, and i doubt you can go wrong with that path.
but maybe you've noticed two recurring themes:
1- there isn't a whole lot of agreement, even among the guys here who really know their sh*t, on the best path to take with chassis optimization.
and
2- any of the guys working at the level these guys are, can win on even the crappiest hardware. it's the setup, and it's agreement with the driver- not the hardware- that wins. i know we don't disagree on that.
May 4, 2006, 12:15 PM
#21
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Originally Posted by Michael Adair
Funny you would assume I was pitting the R/T product against what Robi sells..(which by the way is at least 4 brands and he will help tune anything that is already on someones setup)..seems some are a little defensive......Yes, he just did my car last weekend BUT he had nothing but compliments for Paul. Paul has also been kind enough to help me on occasion too! Matter of fact he talked very positively about three or four brands of coilovers and he also talked very positively about Works as well. He has more experience then you or I will ever accumulate in a lifetime so I did take some of what he said to heart...and my car works, period. It is a fairly low tech basic set up but my car has improved ten fold with minimal mods.....I also drove a new 9 MR with the KW setup and was astonished. Hell I don't even know enough about coilovers right now to comment on the RT's it just seems that ROBI sells what he believes works (mutiple brands) and what makes sense for the individual. In the end I chose ROBI because of the following reasons: 1. He will travel to where your car is. 2. He has a great entry level product that works and can be upgraded. 3. He answers phone calls and emails. 4. He doesn't say he is here to help the everyday Evo owner and then work on a teams race car for weeks on end and not return calls. (I am not referring to Paul or Works by the way!) Considering the amount of work he performed and information he imparted the labor charge was of great value.
I have been in retail for 30 years and am now a sales rep who has 400 accounts...ROBI was a great value and I felt like I actually got more than what I paid for...that doesn't happen often these days. I am sure I now sound like an a huge advocate for ROBI and I guess in a way I am. But of all the people I have dealt with in the EVO aftermarket world he was the LEAST bias of any I have had dealings with. In the end you have to make your own decision anyway. I just wanted to relay my experience because I imagine there are plenty of EVO owners out there with similiar thoughts of how to go about suspension upgrades...
Michael
I have been in retail for 30 years and am now a sales rep who has 400 accounts...ROBI was a great value and I felt like I actually got more than what I paid for...that doesn't happen often these days. I am sure I now sound like an a huge advocate for ROBI and I guess in a way I am. But of all the people I have dealt with in the EVO aftermarket world he was the LEAST bias of any I have had dealings with. In the end you have to make your own decision anyway. I just wanted to relay my experience because I imagine there are plenty of EVO owners out there with similiar thoughts of how to go about suspension upgrades...
Michael
btw - In all my conversatins with the old fart about Paul (total of 3), he has said nothing but good stuff about him, so just let that be known.
There are several ways to the same destination, if we all went the same way, life would be boring.
n
May 4, 2006, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by nils
couldnt have said it better and I share all your experiences. You my friend, understand why I am such a robi *****!... ha ha
btw - In all my conversatins with the old fart about Paul (total of 3), he has said nothing but good stuff about him, so just let that be known.
There are several ways to the same destination, if we all went the same way, life would be boring.
n
btw - In all my conversatins with the old fart about Paul (total of 3), he has said nothing but good stuff about him, so just let that be known.
There are several ways to the same destination, if we all went the same way, life would be boring.
n
May 4, 2006, 10:19 PM
#23
Originally Posted by DuncanG
There are other details that allow different shocks with identical F/V curves to perform drastically different, but that's another discussion.
That would be an interesting topic.
That would be an interesting topic.
May 4, 2006, 10:24 PM
#24
Originally Posted by geminix3
2- any of the guys working at the level these guys are, can win on even the crappiest hardware. it's the setup, and it's agreement with the driver- not the hardware- that wins. i know we don't disagree on that.
May 5, 2006, 03:18 PM
#26
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Originally Posted by Michael Adair
If that's what we are ROBI ****** so be it! Nils, give me some input on which of the 17/18 White Tarmac wheels you endorse given I am going to go with the 15mm front trac spacers ROBI is sending me...The various Enkei's, Compomotive and OZ WRC Tarmacs......I am going to copy your car......
I enjoy my current wheels alot, they have taken a beating and are still doing fine.
Not sure on the others as I have no personal experience with them.
sorry for the O-T guys, back on topic....
n
May 7, 2006, 06:43 PM
#27
Originally Posted by value
If all this is true I wonder why US customers are charged extra for Ohlins camber plates when they are sold the the Flag-L in Japan. EVOlutionary you never stated were you bought you RT's from??
EVOlutionary
May 7, 2006, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by sspeed
I just had Robi install the full KW setup and couldn't be happier with the equipment and his service... +1 to the above post. The guy will return calls at the oddest hours..not sure he sleeps!
I like the KW V3's because they give you high quality "real" double adjustability at a single adjustable shock price range...
last months Grassroots motorsports ..direct quote from "the white shock trailer owner" Joe Stimola the Penske GURU..this trailer is at the track to do any and all suspension /shock mods you might desire...shock dyno spare parts etc.. works on every shock system...been doing this since they invented DIRT....."in the beginning you had single-adjustable shocks which gave you the ability to make a change that might help you EITHER in the entrance or the exit of the turn BUT NOT BOTH". (caps added for clarity) Hence I advocate double adjustables if you can afford them...they give you options you don't have with ANY single-adjustable system PERIOD re-valved/witch-doctored/snake-oiled/ or smoke and mirrored...Physics are Physics they APPLY TO ALL...systems. The DMS 50 solution is GREAT..just seem to be out of most EVOistas price range...(but they have the pop for a 6 K turbo kit..lol..go figure//)....PS qualified all three cars this weekend for Super Streets Time attack at the end of the year (post SEMA)...My 05 RS TTA level BR stage 4 car STOCK BLOCK, TURBO, CAMS, AND HEAD..300HP on a good day.and full weight full interior (need the points for the suspension lol)....set Fast time of the weekend at WSIR (= Big track) Big thank you to Russ Warr......a STI driver we competed against last year..reping fo us as Dieter and I were winning/qualifing in PHX PIR....he's likeing the "dark side"///hehehehe........