91TB78

iTrader: (2)

I agree and the times I've spoken with Robi he's really made me feel like he knows a ton of what he's doing.

A local guy did quite well with his KW setup in Autocross, so I know Robi can and does work magic.

Within the realm of Robi, I'm still having a dilemma of a basic stiff coilover setup like the many sub-$1500 coils or going with the mid-level dollar coilover setup (KW Comp2 for example)

robi

iTrader: (24)

My cars are faster with a "soft setup" then the no travel harsh riding stiffies....

boomn29

iTrader: (47)

I'm trying to decide between the robispec basic setup and the KW 3's. Basically sounds like I get all the suspension goodies and alignment with both and the choice is weather to do just springs or full coilovers.

According to Robi's earlier post, both setups come with:
"rear swaybar rear bump steer correction kit. rear trailing arm bushing kit, alignment "

I do track the car, and also want to maintain the driveability on the street. I'd rather get it setup once and be done. I don't like to piece things together if I don't have to. Sounds like both options could suit my needs, so perhaps the decision is just monetarily based on my behalf.

Oh, I'm also curious if running stock Advan A046's on a robi-spec'd car makes sense? Like would it be a cruel joke to not upgrade to a stickier set of rubber after investing in robi-spec'd suspension?

Tristar

iTrader: (7)

Hey hey, the St. Loius connection! We all need to decide what upgrade route we want to buy, and I will start a thread dedicated to a 'for sure' list of people and their purchases for Robi. We can keep this one open for general talk of the event.

boomn29

iTrader: (47)

STL - That's me baby.

That sounds like a good idea, but I need to keep speculating for now! I'm thinking my tax refund money is going to suspension (and possibly GSC S1 cams and AMS retune). Would robi want us to purchase all our parts before the date, have them shipped to us and we bring them? Or would he be bringing everything?

Tristar

iTrader: (7)

He mentioned to me he needs people to purchase so he can ship it out. Some items need some lead time, so the sooner a decision the better.

robi

iTrader: (24)

My setups do include the mentioned parts. Please just don't get confused with the pricing
the Basic is the rear With Springs all setup for 1200.00
the V3's (or any coilover setup purchsed through me that I offer) is the price of the coilover + 800 to doo the listed rear end mods/align/and cornerweight the car.

Supply your own coilovers add 195 for install/ cornerweighting

boomn29

iTrader: (47)

Cool, thanks.
So for the KW Variant 3 which are listed on your site at $2100 - add $800 for the setup as you noted? So in this case it'd be $2900 for the full setup + whatever travel costs we split as a group?

robi

iTrader: (24)

Yes..I throw in the cornerweighting for "free" with this package

goforwand

iTrader: (132)

I'm up for the Whiteline front roll center Kit when Robi comes to Chi-town, along with the alignment adjustment.

boomn29

iTrader: (47)

I know this has been covered a lot in different threads - and many different answers have come of it, but I wanted to pose it to Robi.

At what point should you choose to upgrade to Coilovers? Like what are the added bonuses of the KW 3's vs a set of Springs (all else being equal). Obvisously you have more adjustability for your setup, but what else?

I'm still trying to decide between the robispec basic setup and the KW 3's. The choice to do just springs or full coilovers..... more than just monetarily based right?


And I'll bump this question back up:

Michael Adair

Gents, some thoughts from a guy who has the Basic set up and has a freind who has the KW setup and has worked with Robi...if you have the money you will not go wrong with the full KW set up (easily some of the best coilovers on the market regardless of cost) adjustable ride height is a plus if you are going to track the car..also you will achieve a better ride quality at the same time because of the 3 way adjustable dampening..visually you can adjust ride height to exactly balance wheel gap etc...remember it is over twice as much money however. Now, if you have an '03 the KYB struts did not match the springs very well and the low speed dampening was terrible as you know by the way your car rides. I switched out my struts to MR Bilsteins and Swift springs (robi is specific about Swift or Espiler because of where the spring rate occurs in relation to the struts) and went with the basic setup and am very happy. The ride quality I now have is far superior to stock and can be easily used for a trackday. Remember, the basic set up isn't basic at all...you will see by the labor involved and time spent on your car. Bushing removal and swap in the trailing arms is time consuming, rear sway bars and bushings take time, he can add in some front negative camber as well and then his alignment is ridiculously accurate. All things considered the basic setup is a steal. The KW setup will yield an even better ride quality than the MR Bilstein/Swift combo IMHO and you still get the rest of the basic package as well. Start dealing with corrosion and rusty fasteners, your time etc and for me it's a hell of a value. The car now has turn in that will freak you out...and ride quality that is 100% improvement over the stock '03 setup. Robi is great to work with and you will learn alot...I hope this helps.


ps. Robi, you owe me.....

robi

iTrader: (24)

first...the car COMES with coilovers...(non-adjustable with mildly retarded damping curves imo)...the Bilsteins improve on this damping issue but are still non-adjustable for cornerweighting (10 tenths I know)...aftermarket springs do two things, they get the car lower and increase the spring rate...BOTH important for reducing the body roll and improving front grip...mainly due to camber curve preservation....on the outside front tire, but also the increased weight transfer through heavier springs.....as you track your car more and add WHP bigger stickier tires will be on the wish list.....and you will RUN OUT OF SPRING RATE with ANY aftermarket springs (including mine soon to market.....)since you can't "improve" the roll timing through adjusting the low speed damping sections (read KW Varient 3's here) ...you are stuck. It seems through testing that 255 "r"s like the Nitto Nto1 and Toyo RA1 are just over this limit and "DOT slicks" get there at 235's...(just under)

So when to change? just Ballpark suggestions.

1 improve ride quality.....(just stay away from any low end short stroke suspensions here)
My most comfortable street setup uses only slightly heavier springs than the stock car but will easily handle 245 DOT slicks...BUT THEN YOU ARE OUT OF SPRING AGAIN...This can bandaided through firming up the compresion and slowing down the rebound...(or fixed by going to or starting with the Robispec Clubsports with valving built to handle higher spring rates) Double adjustability is so important because all single adjustable shocks have a set progression which is a compromise position on what works best.... (I know Paul some compromises are better than others).
BUT the Physics is simple, corner entry and braking are primarily BUMP/Compresion events and corner exit with accelleration are rebound driven...to get the best/most you need to adjust each side ..to get the best of each damping curve..Oh the adjustments need to actually change the curve too...a major issue in lower priced (under 2K) coilovers.

2. using wide sticky tires...aftermarket coilovers (KW's used for example here) offer improved /corrected valving for spring rate up to triple what the stock dampers can handle... as you increase grip you will need some way to counteract role...or mercilessly lift the inner rear wheel in almost any corner. So depending on tire choice (compound/size) you need to select spring rates which will be soft enough to get the traction but stiff enough to keep the car from rolling over...Track and corner duration are important as you spend a lot more time in longer corners and any damping fixes to too low a spring rate will still be overwhelmed...in long duration sweepers..remember the damper afects roll RATE a timed event not the ultimate roll stopping point (spring provides this)

The Basic is just that get the car ready to track with the ride height "close" to what you will be using and get the car rotating like a balanced car should..ON A BUDGET.....on cold days you will have better grip than an over sprung/ over dampened coilover car on hot days slightly less...as you run your self out of spring with the improved grip as the r compounds get to temp..BUT the car will have all the improvements nessisary so WHEN they add ADJUSTABLE coilovers (remeber the Evo has coilovers right from the factory)..they get the most out of them...


The proof is always in the times...Basic cars have run within .5 seconds / mile of less than 1600.00 coilovers with less tire (remember the grip vs spring rate issue here) at our local tracks. Same car same driver add $5K in motons. same alignment with on day of testing add slicks and he ran 4 seconds faster with the same WHP...and the car rode like S*it....with the high spring rates and gas pressures needed to take advantage of the racing slick tires extra grip.

robi

iTrader: (24)

As Always!

Michael Adair

Hey Pal......if the Chicago stop happens I would consider coming down if you thought there was something to add to my setup.....realign, check over...I still have some noise down there....I added the adjustable endlinks myself etc....anything to add? I hope you are doing well.

Michael