george3

iTrader: (39)

Has anyone put on a Forge Brake Duct Cooling Kit?
I'd like to hear comments.

EVO8LTW

iTrader: (41)

I'm in the process of installing one. If you are debating between the different kits, I would pay a lot of attention to the way the vents mount to the calipers. The Forge kit has machined spacers that ensure that the aluminum ducts don't function as crush washers under the caliper bolts. It reuses the stock washers together with the spacers to ensure that the calipers continue to be torqued with no aluminum in the equation. I'm not explaining this very clearly, but if you do a search, member "ez" did a post about this a while back. After installing the Forge vents this past weekend, I see exactly what he was talking about and why it's important to ensuring that the calipers stay securely mounted.

jid2

iTrader: (62)

It may be a nice feature to have the duct floating and not sandwiched between the bolts and the caliper - but it's not a problem if it is.

The modulus of aluminum and steel can be very similar, so there will be no "crushing" unless there is actual geometry intended to deflect. It's not like aluminum is weak or squishy. And to add to that the coefficient of thermal expansion is higher for aluminum than steel. So as the parts get hot the torque on the bolts will actually increase.

The AMS parts are stainless steel just so you know. Which I don't know why. Stainless is a horrible conductor of heat and will end up storing heat compared to similar aluminum parts.

george3

iTrader: (39)

<<The AMS parts are stainless steel just so you know. Which I don't know why.>>

Probably stainless for rust resistance reasons. I went with the Forge system. It is now installed and will be tested this weekend at Watkins Glen.

Ludikraut

iTrader: (17)

I don't have any temp measurements, but would a two-toned caliper be evidence of effective cooling? I just put on a new set of front calipers, and after one track day, the outside half of the calipers have turned brown, the inside is a dark red.

l8r)

george3

iTrader: (39)

That just means you're using your brakes hard... as you should.
This is perfectly normal. Mine are the same way.

EVO8LTW

iTrader: (41)

Mine have not turned brown (maybe a darker red) nor have I ever boiled the fluid, but my car has seen a decent amount of track time. I'm adding ducts anyhow in the hope of extending pad and rotor life.

Ludikraut

iTrader: (17)

My point wasn't that my calipers are turning darker, it's that unlike my first set, they are changing color at different rates for the inside half of the caliper vs the outside half. The inside half is cooled by a brake duct (ghetto, homemade style), so I'm just wondering if that should be taken as a sign that the brake ducting is actually working.

l8r)

george3

iTrader: (39)

The cooling kit is not to extend pad life or rotor life. It is to prevent/minimize pedal fade under extremely hard braking in track conditions.

EVO8LTW

iTrader: (41)

Keeping pad and rotor temps down on the track will prolong their life.

ForcedFedRS

iTrader: (23)

Damn Rich, I have no idea how you didn't turn your calipers brown at VIR. Your car is much faster than mine and I turned mine almost brown in that one event. I was braking very late in some sections though I'm looking into brake ducts at this point as well and haven't decided wether or not I will build my own or buy some. AMS kit looks nice, as does the Forge kit

AutoMotoSports

iTrader: (42)

Keep in mind our system was used on our own time attack car....with GREAT results.

one nice point about out kit is not only do we give you a custom machined duct that directly diverts air into the Vein of the rotor but we also ditch the factory dust shield and replace them with a rust preventing, tighter fitting Stainless steel counter part....again custom machined here in house.

Lastly for you SCCA guys the AMS Brake cooling kit is the only SCCA T2 approved brake kit for The EVO VIII/IX

Eric

EVO8LTW

iTrader: (41)

What is the purpose of replacing the dust shield (as opposed to removing it), especially with something that is tighter fitting? It protects the electrical connections and the tie rod ends, but that can be accomplished in other ways.

A properly functioning rotor will pull air from its center and exhaust it out the edges right? Especially aftermarket one with curved vanes.

By closing off the inside of the rotor, aren't you limiting air flow to what can come through the ducting (which is somewhat restrictive because of (1) the narrow slit that the air has to pass through between the caliper and the rotor center and (2) the relatively small 2" duct tubing), rather than letting the rotors inhale through both the ducting and the other air inside the wheels?

I'm no engineer and maybe I'm misunderstanding something fundamental, but I've always wondered this about the AMS ducting design.

jid2

iTrader: (62)

Currently I have ghetto ducts which are simply hoses pointed in the general direction of the calipers and rotors. They work good enough that I've never had brake fade, and my calipers are still more red than brown.

But I'm building some aluminum ducts to mount directly to the calipers. Hoping to direct the airflow to the correct places and the aluminum structure of the ducts actually create a nice heat sink surface.

The whole idea of ducting is to increase airflow through the rotors. They are the most effective place to transfer heat as they have a large surface area. Directing air at the calipers will help keep them a little cooler, but when looking at the braking system overall, the best heat exchanger is the rotors.

Ludikraut

iTrader: (17)

My understanding of the design is that by funneling the air into the narrow slit, you are speeding it up, which helps to ensure that it actually flows where it should and is not impacted as much by air turbulence around the caliper/rotor. IMO whether the 2" ducting is enough is somewhat moot. You could just front load the ducting with a 3" or larger funnel if you want more airflow. The redesigned heatshield is an improvement over the stock heatshield in that it is smaller, hence it exposes more of the rotor to open air, but still protects the ABS sensor. You could just take off the heat shield completely and take your chances with the sensor, though.

l8r)