Best bang for the buck tire
Jul 16, 2010 | 11:02 AM
#1
Best bang for the buck tire UPDATED with feeback after 5weeks use
THIS IS MY 5 WEEK UPDATE
Nitto NT05 255/40/17
Nitto NT05 255/40/17
Because all the tires below are very close in performance and longevity, the only other major factor was price, and I got a set of 255/40/17 NITTO NT05 mounted and balanced on SE BBS rims 5 weeks go. At the same time I got the car aligned (with me sitting in it) at -2 deg front, -1.5 deg rear, 0" toe all around.
Wear is a non factor, I am not able to tell that the tire has any wear at all. I have put two road trips on it (Dallas to Austin both times), and I drive hard in my special areas. The tires' grip is amazing. In street tire terms I have been on stickier rubber, but for almost 3x as much money. All out street tire grip I'd rate them a 9/10.
And wow do they ride quiet. I'm very surprized, usually large tread block ultra performance street tires sound like a truck on mud terrain tires. These are quiet. We aren't talking Lexus quiet, but if we are going to use Lexus quiet as a 1 and a 4x4 truck on mud tires as a 10 these are a 2/10.
Wet weather performance is phenominal. I truely have never been on another tire that was more confidence inspiring in the wet. Even 3x more expensive tires. And I'm not talking "the neighbor's sprinkler got the road wet" kind of damp. If you have been watching the weather you know Dallas has been slammed this week with torrential downpoars and a tornado hit down town somewhere. Standing 4-5" water, running water, falling from the sky sideways kind of rain fellas. Out of every tire I have ever had in the wet these are the absolute best, 10/10.
All around this was easily the best money I have spent on my Evo to date. The enjoyment factor, performance, comfort, and peace of mind, all leave me with a huge smile on my face.
One negative, these things are STICKY. If you drive on gravel, or dirt roads I would NOT suggest these. Rocks stick to the tires and they get slung around like they are being shot out of a slingshot.
One neutral observation, these are a true performance tire with rigid sidewalls to resist rolling over during high g loads. As such you will feed the ride difference if you are riding on a soft cooshy tire, they are stiff!
So I am in need of a good set of tires. I have a set of perfect all season tires that I'm on right now but I want a set of sticky buns that I can daily drive on, go to the track/autocross, have a blast, be fast, and drive home on. To complicate matters I don't want to spend an arm and a leg, which means the stock Advans (while awesome) won't work because of price. So I do what I do best, collect data, and correlate all acquired data into a single reference-able data point. For this exercise I will call it, "Dollar per Grin".
What I did was start out by identifying all tires that were likely competitors for the “Stickiest daily drivable tire” award. What I came up with was the following:
· Yokahama Neova A08 (stock tires)
· Bridgestone Potenza RE11
· Toyo R1R
· Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec
· Nitto NT05
· Kumho Ecsta XS
I then set out to acquire simple data about each tire, price, weight, and average mileage when used as both a daily driver and autocross/track day tire. The last item was difficult to determine because I had to go find posts on many different forums for people running these tires. Then find out how they used them, and if they didn’t use them for 50/50 track/street I had to throw the numbers out. What I ended with was the following:
As you can see, on this section I used the stock tire as the reference point. One thing I want to point out here is that I included weight and will be using this later. So many people go off and spend thousands of dollars to drop 1-2lbs with lightweight wheels when they never check their TIRE weight. And since the tires are on a further rotation point from the center axis than even the rim of the wheel, losing weight in your tires is of even greater effect than losing weight with light wheels.
I then went and compiled results from several comparison tests. I didn’t take into account reviews, just data from direct comparison tests where the tires in question were directly compared against each other in the same conditions. I took the results from each test, and averaged them against the top finisher for that test to get an equal data point for each test. Because some tests were on a 30sec autocross course, some were on a 2min track, and some were on a purpose built skid pad (wet and dry) I had to average the winners this way.
After I had all the figures for direct comparison tests I then averaged them amongst the entire group, giving a winner of the direct comparison tests. What I learned here was that all the above tires are actually within 3% of each other when measured statistically from a road course performance perspective. To make this number more accurate on the full performance gain you would get (or loose) from each tire, I then added in the tire weight numbers. This is what I came up with for pure performance using the stock tire as a baseline:
Now, I want to point out. This doesn’t mean that the NT05 was whooping everyone around road courses. It jumped that high in performance due to the incredible performance it did show (usually within 99.3% of the stock tire’s raw performance numbers), along with the weight loss from using this tire yielding in lower unsprung weight, more HP to the ground, and better suspension articulation. If you want the actual ultimate performer out of this group and don’t care about weight, nothing beat the stock tire in raw performance.
Now that I had all my data I came to one conclusion…these tires (for the average Joe) are all within fractions of each other in actual performance. You may get better feel/turn-in on the Potenza, more stability on the Yokohama’s, or other subjective items. But for raw performance they are all on par with each other.
So lastly I put all the numbers together, and since they all performed so well it really came down to how much they cost. From what I found here, any tire on this list will give 95% of us 95% of the performance we could ever want. You want significantly better, get slicks. To make this easier to see I averaged dollar per mile of usage, with performance numbers adding in a slight twist and got the following:
So every time you turn your steering wheel, and pull enough g’s to make you smile, this is how much it is costing you for that smile.
Last edited by dyezak; Sep 9, 2010 at 08:12 PM. Reason: 5week update
Jul 16, 2010 | 11:06 AM
#2
Sumitomo HTR ZIII
A friend's cousin manages a tire shop and has been there for over 10 years and does stuff on his own cars so he knew his ****. And he hooked me up. I think they run around 150 depending on the size but so far they are AMAZING summer tires. Especially compared to the ****ty Dunlops that come stock on the STi.
I also believe they are brand new tires this year, so I'm not sure if there are many reviews on them or not.
A friend's cousin manages a tire shop and has been there for over 10 years and does stuff on his own cars so he knew his ****. And he hooked me up. I think they run around 150 depending on the size but so far they are AMAZING summer tires. Especially compared to the ****ty Dunlops that come stock on the STi.
I also believe they are brand new tires this year, so I'm not sure if there are many reviews on them or not.
Jul 16, 2010 | 11:10 AM
#3
Sumitomo HTR ZIII
A friend's cousin manages a tire shop and has been there for over 10 years and does stuff on his own cars so he knew his ****. And he hooked me up. I think they run around 150 depending on the size but so far they are AMAZING summer tires. Especially compared to the ****ty Dunlops that come stock on the STi.
A friend's cousin manages a tire shop and has been there for over 10 years and does stuff on his own cars so he knew his ****. And he hooked me up. I think they run around 150 depending on the size but so far they are AMAZING summer tires. Especially compared to the ****ty Dunlops that come stock on the STi.
#2, While the Sumitomo HTR is not even mentioned in any comparison reviews with any of the tires above. I don't consider it to be in the same class.
Jul 16, 2010 | 11:17 AM
#4
What class do you consider it to be in? I suppose it might not be quite as hardcore on the track as some of those other tires, since I asked for a tire that wouldn't wear too quickly, but they are certainly plenty grippy. While I haven't driven most of those tires save the stock VIII Advans and the XS. I can say the Sumitomos lie right in the middle of performance of the XS and Advans (since the Advans are, essentially, as close as you can get to a DOT legal R-Compound without actually buying an R-Comp tire).
I was only answering your question as to, in my experience, what the best bang for the buck summer tire was.
I wish the Dunlops really were as well known junk as you say. Perhaps then the Evo X community would stop scoffing at all the reviews the X wins... when it basically "cheats" (I suppose that may be too strong of a word) its way to victory with far superior tires. That's always been the case with the two cars though, so it isn't really a big deal.
I was only answering your question as to, in my experience, what the best bang for the buck summer tire was.
I wish the Dunlops really were as well known junk as you say. Perhaps then the Evo X community would stop scoffing at all the reviews the X wins... when it basically "cheats" (I suppose that may be too strong of a word) its way to victory with far superior tires. That's always been the case with the two cars though, so it isn't really a big deal.
Jul 16, 2010 | 11:25 AM
#6
This is an amazing post. Thank you for consolidating everything into something manageable. I recently went through this exact same scenario and ended up getting General Exclaim UHPs. I'm sad now. They were not cheap nor do they have the performance of other similiarly priced tires. I read this literally two weeks too late...
Jul 16, 2010 | 11:26 AM
#7
What class do you consider it to be in? I suppose it might not be quite as hardcore on the track as some of those other tires, since I asked for a tire that wouldn't wear too quickly, but they are certainly plenty grippy. While I haven't driven most of those tires save the stock VIII Advans and the XS. I can say the Sumitomos lie right in the middle of performance of the XS and Advans (since the Advans are, essentially, as close as you can get to a DOT legal R-Compound without actually buying an R-Comp tire).
I was only answering your question as to, in my experience, what the best bang for the buck summer tire was.
I wish the Dunlops really were as well known junk as you say. Perhaps then the Evo X community would stop scoffing at all the reviews the X wins... when it basically "cheats" (I suppose that may be too strong of a word) its way to victory with far superior tires. That's always been the case with the two cars though, so it isn't really a big deal.
I was only answering your question as to, in my experience, what the best bang for the buck summer tire was.
I wish the Dunlops really were as well known junk as you say. Perhaps then the Evo X community would stop scoffing at all the reviews the X wins... when it basically "cheats" (I suppose that may be too strong of a word) its way to victory with far superior tires. That's always been the case with the two cars though, so it isn't really a big deal.
Trending Topics
Jul 16, 2010 | 11:53 AM
#12
Jul 16, 2010 | 11:55 AM
#13
Jul 16, 2010 | 12:02 PM
#15
I have the Hankooks and love them for very aggressive driving. On an auto-x course, I've yet to dial them in to the point where they don't begin to plow a little too early. To their credit, their lateral grip (subjectively) doesn't vary drastically with heart. Next tire I get may be a Z1. Hate to add the weight, though, as 99% of my driving is on the street.