tranny fluid change for X
Apr 11, 2008, 12:21 AM
#16
Evolved Member
Thread Starter
Doc, I read that it is suitable for 75W85, 75W90. and 80W90. What worries me with MTG, is that it doesn't say it's approved for 75W80, which is what the X calls for. Is it safe to run that stuff being a different weight/viscocity than what the manufacturer recommends?
Apr 11, 2008, 07:32 AM
#17
IMPORTANT
OK,
DO NOT put that second fluid in your transmission, ever. Its a GL-5, and GL-5 based fluids are known to have chemicals that damage phosphor bronze that is in our gearboxes.
Here is a nice bit lo light reading about gear oil and API classifications: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gear_oil
I ordered BG Synchroshift II from Buschur Racing. First off, their prices are great on the stuff, second of all they ship super fast. I've used BG in Mitsu trannies for years at the advice of DSM guys and got rid of a nasty 4th gear grind in my VIII like that.
Well, BG is 75w80, but its a GL-4. Guess what? The Evo X uses GL-3 fluid.
IMO, this is probably what the freaking problem is right here. This is the first modern manual transmission Japanese car that I have ever seen that uses a GL-3. The VIII and IX called for GL-4.
The capacity of the new box is less as well to save space. It takes 2.6 quarts of fluid. As far as I know, a GL-4 should not be corrosive in any way to a modern transmission. **That said, replace the GL-3 at your own risk!**
I have not added the BG Synchroshift to the car yet, because part of me wants to wait to hear what Mitsubishi decides.
A bigger part of me thinks the problem is that the Diaqueen New Multi Gear Oil GL-3 is a **** poor product for this gearbox and believes that the BG Synchroshift II is the right viscosity and will probably cure the transmission immediately if it is indeed a fluid issue and not an engineering flaw. Since its based similarly off the IX transmission, the fluid change makes the most sense to me.
I just wanted to post up and tell you guys that putting a GL-5 in your transmission could produce disasterous results. Until Mitsubishi tells us its OK to use a good synthetic GL-4, it might be wise to hold off.
If anybody has used a quality GL-4 at the factory weight recommendations and gotten rid of the notchiness, I would love to hear about it.
I heard a rumor in another thread that mitsu is aware of the notchy problem and has been investigating redline fluids as a possible solution. I don't know if this is true, but these 2 oils seem like they would be the most likely oils that they are experimenting with. MTL, which is a 70W80 sounds like it would be a good fit. Also check out the lightweight gear oil, which is a 75W80. I believe that either one of these would be fine for the car, and both are the same weight, with the exception that the MTL has better cold flow properties. I am considering changing over to this, but need to do more research first. BTW for anyone not aware, unlike the 8 and 9, the X calls for a 75W80 transmission fluid. Let me know what you guys think. 
MTL FLUID
http://redlineoil.com/products_gearl...p?categoryID=7
Lightweight gear oil link
http://redlineoil.com/products_gearl...5&categoryID=6
MTL FLUID
http://redlineoil.com/products_gearl...p?categoryID=7
Lightweight gear oil link
http://redlineoil.com/products_gearl...5&categoryID=6
OK,
DO NOT put that second fluid in your transmission, ever. Its a GL-5, and GL-5 based fluids are known to have chemicals that damage phosphor bronze that is in our gearboxes.
Here is a nice bit lo light reading about gear oil and API classifications: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gear_oil
I ordered BG Synchroshift II from Buschur Racing. First off, their prices are great on the stuff, second of all they ship super fast. I've used BG in Mitsu trannies for years at the advice of DSM guys and got rid of a nasty 4th gear grind in my VIII like that.
Well, BG is 75w80, but its a GL-4. Guess what? The Evo X uses GL-3 fluid.
IMO, this is probably what the freaking problem is right here. This is the first modern manual transmission Japanese car that I have ever seen that uses a GL-3. The VIII and IX called for GL-4.The capacity of the new box is less as well to save space. It takes 2.6 quarts of fluid. As far as I know, a GL-4 should not be corrosive in any way to a modern transmission. **That said, replace the GL-3 at your own risk!**
I have not added the BG Synchroshift to the car yet, because part of me wants to wait to hear what Mitsubishi decides.
A bigger part of me thinks the problem is that the Diaqueen New Multi Gear Oil GL-3 is a **** poor product for this gearbox and believes that the BG Synchroshift II is the right viscosity and will probably cure the transmission immediately if it is indeed a fluid issue and not an engineering flaw. Since its based similarly off the IX transmission, the fluid change makes the most sense to me.
I just wanted to post up and tell you guys that putting a GL-5 in your transmission could produce disasterous results. Until Mitsubishi tells us its OK to use a good synthetic GL-4, it might be wise to hold off.
If anybody has used a quality GL-4 at the factory weight recommendations and gotten rid of the notchiness, I would love to hear about it.
Apr 11, 2008, 07:43 AM
#20
"We've been told to look out for you, boy. That GL-4 done F'd up your tranny. Warranty VOIDED. Get out your billfold."
Apr 11, 2008, 11:51 AM
#24
Evolved Member
Thread Starter
Well noize I really appreciate the suggestion. I always paid attention mostly to the weight and not the GL rating. I for some reason thought that the higher the number the higher the quality rating. It apperars as though that is NOT the case! Thanks for clarifying that. I am with you on wanting to try a new fluid but being hesitant and wanting to see what mitsu says first. They are officially aware of the problem now at least, and have issued a TT to dealerships to not work on the car until a fix is officially released. Ughhh, hurry up Mitsubishi!!!!!!
Apr 11, 2008, 05:08 PM
#26
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I need verification of a GL-3 recommendation on an EVO X for starters... A GL-3 Lube is for use with ferrous metals and as far as I know, is an antiquated rating. The tranny on the EVO's have Brass/Bronze parts in them therefore a GL-4 is required. Maybe I am all wet here as I haven't had to deal with any irregularities of gear lubes in about 3 years....
I am really not concerned about the 75W-80 as most gear lubes don't meet any of the Specs listed on the bottle.
I could not get hold of our Driveline Tech as AMSOIL was closed due to a Winter Storm dumping 18 inches of snow on them and 50-60 MPH winds. We have a lube that carries the 75W-80 rating along with a GL-4, but I want it in writing from AMSOIL before I make a recommendation.
Doc
I am really not concerned about the 75W-80 as most gear lubes don't meet any of the Specs listed on the bottle.
I could not get hold of our Driveline Tech as AMSOIL was closed due to a Winter Storm dumping 18 inches of snow on them and 50-60 MPH winds. We have a lube that carries the 75W-80 rating along with a GL-4, but I want it in writing from AMSOIL before I make a recommendation.
Doc
Apr 11, 2008, 06:03 PM
#27
Evolved Member
Thread Starter
Well, MTG says that it is recommended for 75w85, 75w90, and 80w90. I wonder why it doesn't say that it's suitable where a 75w80 is called for? Is it still safe to run it? Can running a GL-4 hurt the transmission when it calls for a GL-3? Is the notchiness being caused by a fluid that wasn't chosen properly by mitsubishi? How could they not test this out before they released the car? First year cars will always have little quirks that need to be fixed, but this should have been caught before the cars left the factory. Hurry up mitsu, I'm losing patience and so is everyone else.
Apr 11, 2008, 09:56 PM
#28
Well, MTG says that it is recommended for 75w85, 75w90, and 80w90. I wonder why it doesn't say that it's suitable where a 75w80 is called for? Is it still safe to run it? Can running a GL-4 hurt the transmission when it calls for a GL-3? Is the notchiness being caused by a fluid that wasn't chosen properly by mitsubishi? How could they not test this out before they released the car? First year cars will always have little quirks that need to be fixed, but this should have been caught before the cars left the factory. Hurry up mitsu, I'm losing patience and so is everyone else.
Its _substantially_ better with the BG. My car would notch into second at high RPM. Not anymore. It still is a tiny bit notchy into second and third from 2000-3500rpm, but so much less. If I rev to 4k to upshift, its almost perfect. It never feels quite as nice as my IX transmission did, but it is much better than it has ever been.
I have a pretty strong suspicion that the clutch is dragging in these cars. I think that is why the problem is so widespread. Don't get me wrong, the fluid change produced amazing results, but I would like to know what the deal really is.
I didn't want to post this up, but who cares? The car should have GL-4 in it. The trans is very similar to the IX trans, and that had GL-4. Its the exact same weight as the stock stuff, and makes the car much better to drive.
I bet the Amsoil stuff would be worth every penny. If its even a smidge better than the BG Synchroshift II, it would probably feel exactly like a IX transmission.
The change is a snap if you have the right tools. The undertray in this car is much nicer to take off than the PITA one on the IX.