To stroke or not to stroke
May 25, 2010, 10:12 AM
#16
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You will need to bore out the motor to press the sleeves in and the check all your clearances etc etc. Not sure if you need to hone the sleeves but there is more if you do...i am not a mechanic or a machinist...i just know from checking into it for my build that it gets real expensive real fast.
May 25, 2010, 10:15 AM
#17
Plus once you put the pistons in you may need to hone the engine, or you probably would have to.
It is not a cheap build trust me.
May 25, 2010, 10:16 AM
#18
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^^^ check that again. its 1900 WITH CORE. so they're charging 1900 to put in 500 sleeves. If you want a new core, its almost 5k. No rods/pistons included. I'll stick with either a local machine shop or buschur 4400 new core with rods/pistons. Never been proven that we need sleeves, and hell, their 2.2l exploded after how long on the track in gate's car? Until we hear why, we dont know for sure that the sleeves didn't walk.
May 25, 2010, 10:18 AM
#19
^^^ check that again. its 1900 WITH CORE. so they're charging 1900 to put in 500 sleeves. If you want a new core, its almost 5k. No rods/pistons included. I'll stick with either a local machine shop or buschur 4400 new core with rods/pistons. Never been proven that we need sleeves, and hell, their 2.2l exploded after how long on the track in gate's car? Until we hear why, we dont know for sure that the sleeves didn't walk.
May 25, 2010, 11:01 AM
#22
i'll stick to stock 86mm if i were you. rev all you want and with alot of reliability. do like murlo did as i would also follow his footsteps hopefully 1 fine day 
87mm is a little more than 2.05L
pistons, rods, bolts, bearings, honing if required, balance crank if required, resurface head deck or maybe headwork if budget permits, larger in/ex valves, cams, springs, retainers, etc etc, all this will give you a very strong motor without touching the block !
just the stuff above mentioned cost approx. 6K +/- with labor depending on parts/brands/deals excluding downtime. just imagine if you're planning to do more work on the block.
estimated cost with block work and to stroke is approx. 10k and up ! i'd rather save up the balance to do other stuffs.
just my 2 cents
87mm is a little more than 2.05L
pistons, rods, bolts, bearings, honing if required, balance crank if required, resurface head deck or maybe headwork if budget permits, larger in/ex valves, cams, springs, retainers, etc etc, all this will give you a very strong motor without touching the block !
just the stuff above mentioned cost approx. 6K +/- with labor depending on parts/brands/deals excluding downtime. just imagine if you're planning to do more work on the block.
estimated cost with block work and to stroke is approx. 10k and up ! i'd rather save up the balance to do other stuffs.
just my 2 cents
May 25, 2010, 11:18 AM
#23
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If your car is going to be down, then reconsider your fuel setup. I'd recommend a BlaqOPs kit and a Boomba rail (if you aren't going all-JDM).
I bought the AMS rail and ended up pulling it off a month later. It's a terrible design at a high price, imo. The fitting at the rail will spring a leak more likely than not...mine did and I spoke to multiple people with the issue.
I bought the AMS rail and ended up pulling it off a month later. It's a terrible design at a high price, imo. The fitting at the rail will spring a leak more likely than not...mine did and I spoke to multiple people with the issue.
Last edited by mlomker; May 25, 2010 at 11:21 AM.
May 25, 2010, 11:21 AM
#24
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but isn't the problem with drop in pistons w/o touching the block that they won't fit perfectly. The clearances on our pistons are so small, w/o boring out even .5mm, how could you get the perfect fit? Local race shop will charge 100 to bore out the engine, so it's not that huge a deal i suppose
May 25, 2010, 11:33 AM
#25
.5 overbore is very common and then hone it (many shops would recommend this, then you can get your correct clearances). Another shop quoted me this and it is a normal way to do it.
1 mm overbore isn't necessary i don't think, the more sleeve you leave in tact the better. This is a better question for whoever is doing the work though.
With getting a brand new OEM block though I should be fine with going stock sized pistons with a hone.
1 mm overbore isn't necessary i don't think, the more sleeve you leave in tact the better. This is a better question for whoever is doing the work though.
With getting a brand new OEM block though I should be fine with going stock sized pistons with a hone.
May 25, 2010, 01:14 PM
#27
Murlo your build sounds like its pretty bad ***. Let me know your total price. I have a simular set up to your before yours went. I am really hoping it wasnt the MX1s without the valves/springs. My car would be down for months with me walking to work.
May 25, 2010, 01:18 PM
#28
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mlomker, if I were to bore out, i'd get oversized pistons as well. The purpose is to eliminate any/all slapping by having the bore made for the pistons. I know in the 4g, if you had a used engine and did drop in stock size pistons, you would burn through oil rather rapidly. If this is no longer true with the 4b11, that would be awesome.
May 25, 2010, 01:19 PM
#29
^ I highly recommend a second car...i picked one up last week, another 2 grand down the drain, but now I have a DD that is slow, gets good gas mileage and is reliable and cheap.
Once the Evo is paid for, i intend to get a good DD though.
The MX1's are a possibility and so is an injector and so is just making too much torque...i am leaning towards something going wrong though since i wasn't even pushing it at the time.
Once the Evo is paid for, i intend to get a good DD though.
The MX1's are a possibility and so is an injector and so is just making too much torque...i am leaning towards something going wrong though since i wasn't even pushing it at the time.
May 25, 2010, 01:19 PM
#30
If your car is going to be down, then reconsider your fuel setup. I'd recommend a BlaqOPs kit and a Boomba rail (if you aren't going all-JDM).
I bought the AMS rail and ended up pulling it off a month later. It's a terrible design at a high price, imo. The fitting at the rail will spring a leak more likely than not...mine did and I spoke to multiple people with the issue.
I bought the AMS rail and ended up pulling it off a month later. It's a terrible design at a high price, imo. The fitting at the rail will spring a leak more likely than not...mine did and I spoke to multiple people with the issue.
& my turbo is still staring at me saying when the h*ell you gonna put me in 
but isn't the problem with drop in pistons w/o touching the block that they won't fit perfectly. The clearances on our pistons are so small, w/o boring out even .5mm, how could you get the perfect fit? Local race shop will charge 100 to bore out the engine, so it's not that huge a deal i suppose
Standard value
"Cylinder bore: 86 mm (3.4 inches)
Cylindricity: 0.010 mm or less (0.0004 inch)"
so the block has to be bored & then fit a 86mm piston in to get a perfect fit since it is bored 0.5mm but 86mm +0.5mm = 86.5mm so maybe get a 86.5mm piston to get a perfect fit ?
""clearance between the pistons and cylinders.
Standard value: 0.03 − 0.05 mm (0.001 − 0.002 inch) "
on your current block if the cylinder walls are ok and not damaged from factory, imo just hone the block and drop the new 86mm pistons in and it shall fit in nicely. there are recommended practices & tolerances from manufacturer
sorry being dumb here but i'm always glad to be educated.