derekste

iTrader: (9)

So, I stopped to fill up on E85 as I have been doing for the past 5000 miles. I was pretty low, filled about 11.5 gallons. Started the car, left the gas station, got about 1/3 of a mile down the road, and the car died on me... gas pedal didn't seem to do anything. Coasted to the shoulder, tried to restart the car, and it would fire a few times, sputter then die. After a few more times, the car would just crank and wouldn't even catch.

I figured I got a bad batch of E85... but I have no way of confirming that. I hooked up the laptop, tried raising/lowering the injector scalings thinking that somehow I got regular gas, but no help there. Battery voltage is good, flashed the car several times, and even switched batteries. Like I said, the car cranks, maybe fires once or twice, and nothing happens. Gas pedal doesn't help.

I have NO idea what is going on. In addition to playing with scalings/latencies, I also swapped the fuel pump relay under the hood with the horn one, but this did nothing (didn't think it would).

Anyone have any ideas?? Next step is to drain the gas tank and try some different E85... but it wasn't immediately clear to me how I would go about draining the tank, and I couldn't find anything on here.

Any help appreciated!

Golden

iTrader: (1)

I would think the car would still run if you got pump gas. Granted it would run like crap, but still run. (i.e. way too rich)

Maybe you got crap gas and something is clogged? Or your fuel pump went belly up.

I'm thinking that you could try starter fluid or somehow getting e-85 into the engine to see if it starts. That would show that you weren't getting fuel. But I don't know how to do this on our cars, as I wouldn't want to hurt the turbo.

Kracka

iTrader: (49)

Spraying (with straw) into a vacuum line on the intake manifold is a good way.

derekste

iTrader: (9)

yeah... I thought about clogged fuel sock or possibly the under-hood JEGS fuel filter that comes with the BlaqOps... but why now??

The car is definitely *getting* fuel... but maybe not enough? The gas doesn't smell like E85 does... I went back and filled half a gallon from the same pump and it definitely doesn't have the vodka-ish smell of E85 that I am accustomed to...

I'll try starter fluid in the morning perhaps... car got towed to the nearest Mitsu dealer courtesy of roadside assistance... if I can't get it running by then, I'm going to have them drain the tank I think unless I get some other ideas?

tephra

iTrader: (6)

does it smell like diesel?

I would complain to the service station that their fuel is bad and they will need to pay for tow + drain + new fuel...

evolution2186

iTrader: (5)

If it doesn't smell the same, something isn't right. Keep some of the current fuel in the tank for a sample and proof the fuel is contaminated. It could have water in the fuel......

mlomker

iTrader: (1)

I'd certainly pull the fuel hanger and inspect the pump install before draining the tank. You could also attach a hose to the fpr and make sure that it is pushing fuel when it is turned over. Having a fuel pressure gauge would be better, of course. Walbros do fail now and then...especially if your fuel pressure is abnormally high for some reason.

skiracer

iTrader: (1)

Do you have a wideband? You can somewhat tell if you have a bad batch of E85 if your AFR's are off.

cfdfireman1

iTrader: (11)

Unless the car won't run.

Did you talk to the people at the station where you bought it? They may be aware of the problem or should me made aware of it.

You can test it yourself like this, the dedicated calibrated tester is optional.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsSQSuCiUjE

or;

Testing E85 for Ethanol content.
go on ebay and buy a 100ml graduated cylinder ~ glass preferred because the numbers are easier to read.

then do the following test:

Place exactly 50ml of fuel into a 100ml graduated cylinder,

Add 48ml of water and place stopper on cylinder,

Shake vigorously 15 seconds (this is important- I even shake upside down thru part of this- NOTE- BE CAREFUL- it will build pressure and could spray out on you)

Let sit undisturbed 15 minutes. Now observe the upper meniscus where air meets liquid- lower edge of curve is the measurement line for total volume. Record this- please note that 50 ml of fuel and 48 ml of water will NOT equal 98 ml -ask me later why.

Now look for the dividing line between the hydrocarbon on top and the water/ethanol phase below- this is the lower meniscus. Find the bottom side (lowest point) of this curve and record.

Calculation; Formula is 2.1 + 1.94(total vol-alcohol/water volume)

Let say your total (upper) volume was 95 ml and your lower (water/alco) was 82 ml. Then:

2.1+1.94(95 ml total-82 ml lower)=
2.1+1.94(13)=
2.1 +25.22=
27.32% HYDROCARBON
OR 100-27.3=72.68% ALCOHOL


taaaa daaaa! ....now you know if your E85 is REALLY 85% Ethanol.

derekste

iTrader: (9)

1- I don't know what diesel smells like per se... but the gas does smell off. Picked up 5gal of E85 from another station on the way to the dealer today and it smells notably different than the tank.

2- I told the station, but they said they hadn't had any other reports. Saw a guy fill up his truck with E85, told him my story as a warning, but he drove away just fine (we went the same direction he did in my wife's car afterwards and he wasn't on the side of the road ) station said if I could get a letter from a mechanic saying it was they gas, they would help out.

3- As far as pulling the pump... the car's tank is FULL! i.e. tank topped off up-the-filler-neck full. if I pulled the pump before draining at least some of the gas out, I'm pretty sure I'd have a back seat full of gas.

4- I do have a wideband, but since the car won't start, it is quite hard to get a reading. The AFR sits around 40, and after I try to start it, it drops down to about 32... so some gas is definitely making it in when I attempt to start.

I'm at the dealer now waiting for them to get my car in. In addition to draining the tank, I'll see if they can check fuel pressure at the rail.

I will definitely be testing the gas after the fact using the above method, additionally I have a GM flexfuel sensor which I can probably rig up on a bench and see what it says the EtOH% is.

Also, I checked all fuses and checked connections on the injectors... all were good.

MACKLIN

iTrader: (6)

Did you check for spark?

bigzz

iTrader: (1)

idk if you have seen this but here it is https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...e85-users.html

mlomker

iTrader: (1)

Well, it's your money. Obviously this isn't going to be covered under warranty...it's E85.

MACKLIN

iTrader: (6)

Some guy always tells me at my shop
I - ignition
Fix - fuel
Cars - compression
And obviously Air you need to start a car

tephra

iTrader: (6)

What does that even mean?