Congratulation AMS...
Oct 27, 2008, 12:49 PM
#61
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I know Martin is working on the diff issue, and I believe something will be available by early next year, but he or Eric will have to chime in here also, as I am not sure. I do know that something will be done about it, and that it will make the car much quicker around a road course.
I've ridden in the car with the Endura Tech suspension on it, and I was very impressed with how compliant the car was. There are some rough sections on the Autobahn South course that my VIII takes issue with, that were completely a non-issue on the X with the Endura Techs.
HUGE congrats on the win, guys.
... wonder how well a souped up Forester XT would do ...
l8r)
Oct 30, 2008, 09:33 AM
#66
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As the guy who drove the car for the road course portion of this event, I would like to offer up my opinion here.
The suspension from Endura Tech that we ran is actually pretty darn good. If you look at the skidpad results, I should not even need to go there, but that alone should be sufficient proof as to the level of grip that these coilovers produce. When you consider what they cost, then it is beyond pretty darn good.
If I were to lay blame on why we finished 2nd in the road course part, it wouldn't be our suspension, or our suspension tuning, but the first place I would look is me. On my final lap coming onto the main straight, I missed to 2-3 shift, and that was more than enough to cost us the win there. I was having consistant difficulty with that shift the whole time. It seems when the car was cornering right, over bumps, it would lock in the center gate when going for third. It happened more than a few times during the practice session that day, and I was making particularly slow deliberate shifts to avoid it during timed runs, but got a tad overaggressive exiting that last turn.
The second place to look would be the lack of a good rear differential. It seems this car will benefit greatly from a cusco rear diff, as we found that with increased power levels, the car would develop a bad corner exit push, similar to the evo8 with a stock rear diff. I have no doubt that we would have been at least one second if not two seconds quicker if we had that diff in the car. Martin could chime in here as well, as he has driven the car also, and knows exactly what I am talking about.
In short, given that the car was only finished up just before leaving, and never tested, and had the stock rear diff, and me screwing up shifts, I think the road course result was actually pretty good. I also think that speaks volumes of just what this car is capable of.
Mark Daddio
The suspension from Endura Tech that we ran is actually pretty darn good. If you look at the skidpad results, I should not even need to go there, but that alone should be sufficient proof as to the level of grip that these coilovers produce. When you consider what they cost, then it is beyond pretty darn good.
If I were to lay blame on why we finished 2nd in the road course part, it wouldn't be our suspension, or our suspension tuning, but the first place I would look is me. On my final lap coming onto the main straight, I missed to 2-3 shift, and that was more than enough to cost us the win there. I was having consistant difficulty with that shift the whole time. It seems when the car was cornering right, over bumps, it would lock in the center gate when going for third. It happened more than a few times during the practice session that day, and I was making particularly slow deliberate shifts to avoid it during timed runs, but got a tad overaggressive exiting that last turn.
The second place to look would be the lack of a good rear differential. It seems this car will benefit greatly from a cusco rear diff, as we found that with increased power levels, the car would develop a bad corner exit push, similar to the evo8 with a stock rear diff. I have no doubt that we would have been at least one second if not two seconds quicker if we had that diff in the car. Martin could chime in here as well, as he has driven the car also, and knows exactly what I am talking about.
In short, given that the car was only finished up just before leaving, and never tested, and had the stock rear diff, and me screwing up shifts, I think the road course result was actually pretty good. I also think that speaks volumes of just what this car is capable of.
Mark Daddio
I think a good rear diff will do wonders for the car. The factory AYC is really good for cars making up to about 350whp and 350 ft-lbs of torque, past that it goes to throttle understeer. As we started adding power both Mark and I noticed that it took more aggresive spring choices and alignment changes to make car come off the corners, and it was still way off. We just put in a Cusco 1.5 way rear diff in our new X and I'll be testing today at Autobahn to see how it works. I should see a difference right away. It does eliminate the AYC, which BTW is pretty complex. Ivan took it all apart and we inspected the guts. It's basically two clutch packs that are independently hydraulically actuated going through an open diff. The interesting thing is that each clutch pack can apply a speed differential to each whee, meaning it can divert torque to the outside wheel for example, helping to turn the car. The fluid that came out of our unit smelled really burnt and I think we're just overcoming the torque capacity with more power, stickier tires, better suspension, ect.
The trick would be to have a heavy duty AYC unit that can handle the power and that you can electronically adjust/control (like an ACD controller). For now though I think we'll be better off with a mechanical diff like the one offered from Cusco.
Oct 31, 2008, 04:17 AM
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Sorry to chime in so late! Mark did an awesome job driving the car. He's never been to streets of Willow and learned the track in no-time. The car had stock shifter bushings and no motor mounts so we're thinking that might have contributed to the shifting issue. The right hand turn leading onto the front straight had some bumps in it and it was at that moment of the 2-3 shift and hitting those bumps that it wouldn't shift. Mark had a winning lap put together (I was timing him) and then watching the car just not going into third was heart-breaking.
I think a good rear diff will do wonders for the car. The factory AYC is really good for cars making up to about 350whp and 350 ft-lbs of torque, past that it goes to throttle understeer. As we started adding power both Mark and I noticed that it took more aggresive spring choices and alignment changes to make car come off the corners, and it was still way off. We just put in a Cusco 1.5 way rear diff in our new X and I'll be testing today at Autobahn to see how it works. I should see a difference right away. It does eliminate the AYC, which BTW is pretty complex. Ivan took it all apart and we inspected the guts. It's basically two clutch packs that are independently hydraulically actuated going through an open diff. The interesting thing is that each clutch pack can apply a speed differential to each whee, meaning it can divert torque to the outside wheel for example, helping to turn the car. The fluid that came out of our unit smelled really burnt and I think we're just overcoming the torque capacity with more power, stickier tires, better suspension, ect.
The trick would be to have a heavy duty AYC unit that can handle the power and that you can electronically adjust/control (like an ACD controller). For now though I think we'll be better off with a mechanical diff like the one offered from Cusco.
I think a good rear diff will do wonders for the car. The factory AYC is really good for cars making up to about 350whp and 350 ft-lbs of torque, past that it goes to throttle understeer. As we started adding power both Mark and I noticed that it took more aggresive spring choices and alignment changes to make car come off the corners, and it was still way off. We just put in a Cusco 1.5 way rear diff in our new X and I'll be testing today at Autobahn to see how it works. I should see a difference right away. It does eliminate the AYC, which BTW is pretty complex. Ivan took it all apart and we inspected the guts. It's basically two clutch packs that are independently hydraulically actuated going through an open diff. The interesting thing is that each clutch pack can apply a speed differential to each whee, meaning it can divert torque to the outside wheel for example, helping to turn the car. The fluid that came out of our unit smelled really burnt and I think we're just overcoming the torque capacity with more power, stickier tires, better suspension, ect.
The trick would be to have a heavy duty AYC unit that can handle the power and that you can electronically adjust/control (like an ACD controller). For now though I think we'll be better off with a mechanical diff like the one offered from Cusco.
Later, Ken
AMS Intake&single exhaust
Iveytune (322 all around)
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Oct 31, 2008, 06:29 PM
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AMS deserved to win that competition, but I am angered every year when it comes out. To many bs tests. ride quality and driveability . Car show and guru panel . emissions and fuel economy. they should eliminate at least 3 of those. A caddy fleetwood could win those 6. they are the most out of touch magazine out. good job ams , glad u didnt get hosed.
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