Test pipe and flames
Feb 2, 2009 | 07:31 PM
#17
/\/\ bad analogy, but you make your point. I think what he originally was saying is that we are driving a 4 cylinder here. Its not like were stupid rednecks blowing black smoke out of their diesels which is actually hurting performance and blowing soot up in the air . Granted the gains are low but I think the emissions argument is also weak.
Feb 2, 2009 | 07:49 PM
#18
Your argument is flawed from the start. Just because someone else does a certain action doesn't mean it's right for you to do it.
The amount of actual fixed up cars with no cats is to low to blame for anything.
There are people who think beating women is acceptable behaviour but you'd be hard-pressed to use that as a rationale for giving your wife a black eye.
Hey they have fought for years for equal rights, right?
Race cars put on a relatively low amount of miles and are not run all year round. Daily drivers on the other hand are daily drivers, you use them constantly.
I read somewhere AMS put 40K miles on their race car. More miles then my daily.
The amount of actual fixed up cars with no cats is to low to blame for anything.
There are people who think beating women is acceptable behaviour but you'd be hard-pressed to use that as a rationale for giving your wife a black eye.
Hey they have fought for years for equal rights, right?
Race cars put on a relatively low amount of miles and are not run all year round. Daily drivers on the other hand are daily drivers, you use them constantly.
I read somewhere AMS put 40K miles on their race car. More miles then my daily.
Feb 2, 2009 | 07:54 PM
#19
Again you are making the flawed argument that an action is morally right because it has low impact or its a common practice. This isn't logical. I might as well start leaving all the lights on in my house and running the tap 24/7 because realistically I don't have enough of an impact to strain the electrical grid or the water system. However if 10000 people had the same attitude as me, we'd be in trouble.
Feb 2, 2009 | 07:58 PM
#20
Feb 2, 2009 | 08:02 PM
#21
Opinions Rampant! Comparing a behavoral problem with anger management with not following EPA mandated LAWS & REGULATIONS is not even a good analogy! It is understood, by many clinical scientist, that spousal abuse is a condition that was observed by children growing up in open hostile family dynamics.
Regardless to make assumptions that rednecks, hillbillies, or just poor country folks who drive trucks are destroying you air again is a fallacy!
According to the EPA (www.fueleconomy.gov) a simple comparison between the diesel and gasoline versions of the Volkswagen Jetta demonstrate that the diesel model would travel 36 percent more miles on a tank of fuel and save $321 annually on fuel costs, while using nearly two fewer barrels of oil and emitting one less ton of GHG emissions each year. A similar comparison between the 2007 Mercedes E320 Bluetec diesel and its E350 gasoline equivalent finds even greater savings. The diesel model travels 43 percent more miles on a tank of fuel and saves $492 annually on fuel costs while using 3.2 fewer barrels of oil and emitting 1.5 fewer tons of GHG emissions each year.
We trade carbon monoxide for carbon dioxide or nitrous oxide, with the use of catalytic converters. ALL contribute to greenhouse gas and the greenhouse effect on Earth.
Regardless to make assumptions that rednecks, hillbillies, or just poor country folks who drive trucks are destroying you air again is a fallacy!
According to the EPA (www.fueleconomy.gov) a simple comparison between the diesel and gasoline versions of the Volkswagen Jetta demonstrate that the diesel model would travel 36 percent more miles on a tank of fuel and save $321 annually on fuel costs, while using nearly two fewer barrels of oil and emitting one less ton of GHG emissions each year. A similar comparison between the 2007 Mercedes E320 Bluetec diesel and its E350 gasoline equivalent finds even greater savings. The diesel model travels 43 percent more miles on a tank of fuel and saves $492 annually on fuel costs while using 3.2 fewer barrels of oil and emitting 1.5 fewer tons of GHG emissions each year.
We trade carbon monoxide for carbon dioxide or nitrous oxide, with the use of catalytic converters. ALL contribute to greenhouse gas and the greenhouse effect on Earth.
Feb 2, 2009 | 08:05 PM
#22
Apparently you missed the point of the analogy. It's not a direct comparison, obviously spousal abuse is different from running a catless exhaust. However, my point was that people are attempting to rationalize their decision by saying that essentially a lot of people do it thus it's OK. If we apply that same logic to something like spousal abuse, we see why it fails.
Feb 2, 2009 | 08:14 PM
#23
Dumb question, but is a $1000 fine worth the 5-15hp over a cat?
And personally, not running a cat simply makes EVERYONE's air worse. How'd you like if I was smoking a cigar in your face the whole time you were driving to work. That's what it's like driving behind someone running catless.
And personally, not running a cat simply makes EVERYONE's air worse. How'd you like if I was smoking a cigar in your face the whole time you were driving to work. That's what it's like driving behind someone running catless.
Last edited by kenpo1441; Feb 2, 2009 at 08:16 PM.
Feb 2, 2009 | 08:17 PM
#24
And my point is, unless we are a total electric or hydro-fuel society, we are dumping GHG into the atmosphere at an alarming rate to Al Gore. So weither it be, carbon dioxide-cat or carbon monoxide-catless, same result.
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Feb 2, 2009 | 08:30 PM
#30
The two gases are not the same though. Carbon dioxide can and is used by plants thus it can be easily removed from the system. Carbon monoxide does not have this advantage.