Towing motorcycle with the X?
Apr 2, 2012, 08:22 PM
#17
Evolving Member
As for this Evo VIII that towed a bike for track days, the drive involved going up and down a few mountain passes. He did tell me that he would try use the gears as much as possible instead of constant breaking.
Anyhow, as for the damaged rotors and suspension, the only thing he thinks cause it was towing the trailer and a sport bike. If it wasn't this, what else caused it? The car was perfect before the hitch was installed and used.
Apr 3, 2012, 04:10 AM
#18
Just use a better brake pad. I'm not going to believe that slowing the Evo down from race speeds on the race track is less hard on pads and rotors than slowing it down from 65 on the freeway with an extra 600 rolling lbs. Keep your pads in good shape and your rotors won't warp. Use a good hitch and don't overload the tongue and the suspension will be fine for light use. I'm no towing expert (though I tow the Evo X everywhere in an enclosed trailer) but there is no way that the abuse the car would sustain BRAKING (caps for emphasis on spelling) on the race track is less than towing a little trailer.
Apr 3, 2012, 06:52 AM
#19
The main problem with towing when you have an Evo X is the S-AWC. Several of the actions of the system, such as trying to increase yaw and/or fight understeer via the AYC and single-wheel braking, will not succeed when you are dragging something that - in effect - keeps trying to straighten the car out. This is why I said that you need to stay off the go pedal if you decide to tow something.
With all that said, I agree that you shouldn't tow much. What most people I've talked to want to do is tow is small tire trailer with a total weight of around 300#. That should be fine. In fact, it's known to be fine.
Apr 3, 2012, 08:17 AM
#20
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How can an Evo tell the difference between 4/5 heavy people plus a trunk load of crap in the car.......and towing a small trailer?
So if I carry a bunch of people or heavy stuff in my car I'll get blown shocks and warped brakes???????
Did you ever think that the guys shocks/brakes were on the way out before he ever even thought of towing?
I've been towing all sorts of crap with my '94 EvoII for a while now.....
No ill effects from towing what so ever.......and I've had up to 1500LBS combined weight of trailer and load in it.When the II retires the X is getting a hitch,and if used sensible you should never have AYC/S-AWC or traction control cutting in with a trailer behind anyway.
So if I carry a bunch of people or heavy stuff in my car I'll get blown shocks and warped brakes???????
Did you ever think that the guys shocks/brakes were on the way out before he ever even thought of towing?
I've been towing all sorts of crap with my '94 EvoII for a while now.....
No ill effects from towing what so ever.......and I've had up to 1500LBS combined weight of trailer and load in it.When the II retires the X is getting a hitch,and if used sensible you should never have AYC/S-AWC or traction control cutting in with a trailer behind anyway.
Last edited by targa ten; Apr 3, 2012 at 08:20 AM.
Apr 3, 2012, 09:08 AM
#21
Two comments on the above. First an Evo II doesn't have anything like the same system as an Evo X. That an Evo II can be used for anything up to and including pulling stumps from a field (which I've done) should not be taken as carte blanche to do the same with an X.
Second, the reason why a trailer is different from three sumo wrestlers in the back seat is rotational moment (or something like that). Adding weight near the center of a car doesn't affect yaw and under-/oversteer anywhere near as much as dragging a trailer. As I said above, dragging a trailer has the effect of adding understeer. If you have a system - as we do on the X - that is designed to detect understeer and fight it, then pulling a trailer will cause this system grief.
Second, the reason why a trailer is different from three sumo wrestlers in the back seat is rotational moment (or something like that). Adding weight near the center of a car doesn't affect yaw and under-/oversteer anywhere near as much as dragging a trailer. As I said above, dragging a trailer has the effect of adding understeer. If you have a system - as we do on the X - that is designed to detect understeer and fight it, then pulling a trailer will cause this system grief.
Apr 3, 2012, 11:30 AM
#22
[quote=Iowa999;10076437
Second, the reason why a trailer is different from three sumo wrestlers in the back seat is rotational moment (or something like that). Adding weight near the center of a car doesn't affect yaw and under-/oversteer anywhere near as much as dragging a trailer. As I said above, dragging a trailer has the effect of adding understeer. If you have a system - as we do on the X - that is designed to detect understeer and fight it, then pulling a trailer will cause this system grief.[/quote]
This is a good point though I wonder whether a trailer is creating understeer or whether a trailer has the opportunity to create understeer. The difference being that, if you are careful not to allow the front end to slide around and to go into turns slowly, you should be ok. If the trailer creates a behavior by the car that is interpreted as understeer by the sensors and causes the system to kick into effect then I agree, it would be problematic. So the key is - if you can avoid creating the effect of understeer by careful driving with your trailer - ok, if not, not ok (for the car).
Second, the reason why a trailer is different from three sumo wrestlers in the back seat is rotational moment (or something like that). Adding weight near the center of a car doesn't affect yaw and under-/oversteer anywhere near as much as dragging a trailer. As I said above, dragging a trailer has the effect of adding understeer. If you have a system - as we do on the X - that is designed to detect understeer and fight it, then pulling a trailer will cause this system grief.[/quote]
This is a good point though I wonder whether a trailer is creating understeer or whether a trailer has the opportunity to create understeer. The difference being that, if you are careful not to allow the front end to slide around and to go into turns slowly, you should be ok. If the trailer creates a behavior by the car that is interpreted as understeer by the sensors and causes the system to kick into effect then I agree, it would be problematic. So the key is - if you can avoid creating the effect of understeer by careful driving with your trailer - ok, if not, not ok (for the car).
Apr 3, 2012, 02:18 PM
#25
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at what speeds does the ayc actually function? is it on at all time? i really find it hard to believe that towing a small trailer at normal speeds will damage the system or even cause the system harm.
Apr 3, 2012, 02:22 PM
#26
I believe AMS did the same thing, just pull the relay
Apr 3, 2012, 02:37 PM
#27
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cool, well the relay sounds like it would take care of that problem. does any company make a bolt on hitch? or is everything just fab'ed and one off? my route to my local track is pretty flat/straight so i don't think i'll run into too much of an issue.
Apr 3, 2012, 06:22 PM
#28
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Honestly, just buying something else to tow a trailer would probably be a better idea. You can pick up an older pickup or jeep off craigslist for less than $1000 with a trailer hitch.
You're probably going to spend a few hundred dollars on a tow hitch for your X, plus the wear and tear you put on it is going to be way more expensive than just picking up a cheap towing vehicle. That's without causing any major damage to your X accidentally by towing something with it.
You're probably going to spend a few hundred dollars on a tow hitch for your X, plus the wear and tear you put on it is going to be way more expensive than just picking up a cheap towing vehicle. That's without causing any major damage to your X accidentally by towing something with it.
Apr 3, 2012, 11:29 PM
#29
Evolving Member
Honestly, just buying something else to tow a trailer would probably be a better idea. You can pick up an older pickup or jeep off craigslist for less than $1000 with a trailer hitch.
You're probably going to spend a few hundred dollars on a tow hitch for your X, plus the wear and tear you put on it is going to be way more expensive than just picking up a cheap towing vehicle. That's without causing any major damage to your X accidentally by towing something with it.
You're probably going to spend a few hundred dollars on a tow hitch for your X, plus the wear and tear you put on it is going to be way more expensive than just picking up a cheap towing vehicle. That's without causing any major damage to your X accidentally by towing something with it.
This is the best solution to towing instead of taking your chances with the evo. Buy a cheap beater truck and put a hitch on that.
Many members seem to want to debate the damage done to my friend’s car, but if you read the owners manual it clearly states no towing. Maybe the damage would have happened without the hitch installed on the Evo VIII. I have no idea. All I know is $800 aftermarket slotted rotors were damaged and the suspension is ruined. The repair bill is much higher than buying a cheap truck with rust on it that gets to the track and back a few times each year.
