Camber and toe write up
Mar 1, 2009, 06:00 PM
#1
Camber and toe write up
Anyone interested in doing a write up for us auto-x'ers who want to get the most out of our stock setups during this year's track season? I'm a total newb when it comes to mechanics, which is why I spend so much time on this forum reading. I find I learn the most when I read good write-ups with pictures and explanations. I'm in Pocatello, ID, and am the only evo owner for miles, so asking another owner for help is out of the question. In fact, even the dealer in town is baffled whenever I bring my car in for service. Any help would be good, even if it's to point me in the right direction. I spent an hour searching videos and write-ups for a good explanation and came up empty.
I appreciate anyone who is willing to help me better understand this matter.
Thanks,
Jim
I appreciate anyone who is willing to help me better understand this matter.
Thanks,
Jim
Mar 2, 2009, 10:20 PM
#4
I anticipate that this thread will be moved to the Motorsports section, but I'll give it a go.
Stock suspension for AutoX? It's good for learning, not not a good long term solution.
Here's what I recommend:
- flip the top bolt on your strut (the paint dot away from the strut body). This will get you near -2* camber.
- get an alignment, with as much camber as they can get up front (-2* to -2.5*) and -1 to -1.5 in the rear. 0 toe all around. Even in back. The tech might not like this.
This alignment might accelerate your tire wear, so be prepared to rotate your tires more frequently (I rotate after every event). Autocrossing will wear the outside shoulders. Camber will wear the inside shoulders. Find a way to a happy medium. On my current tires, I broke down the tires off the wheels and flipped them, thus moving the inside shoulder to the outside so that I could get more life out of the tires (8k miles on them now, have about 2k left on my 2nd set, stockers lasted 5.5k).
So for a stock setup, that's all there is to it.... except maybe when you get to the track, dial a touch of toe out on the front. But if you're asking the question you asked, then I don't think you'll be doing this. Toe out in front will help the car's turn-in because the wheel will already be flared out a bit. However this can get squirrely on the highway or road course, so it's not something you want to dial in all the time.
The general consensus (which is not the general "what I did") is that you should learn to control the car on stock suspension before you go looking for upgrades (coilovers/springs&struts then sway bars), so I'll give that advice too, even though I didn't follow it.
Learn to drive you car well, now, on the soft wallowy stock suspension and you'll be a better driver when you do upgrade (less bad habits ingrained).
Stock suspension for AutoX? It's good for learning, not not a good long term solution.
Here's what I recommend:
- flip the top bolt on your strut (the paint dot away from the strut body). This will get you near -2* camber.
- get an alignment, with as much camber as they can get up front (-2* to -2.5*) and -1 to -1.5 in the rear. 0 toe all around. Even in back. The tech might not like this.
This alignment might accelerate your tire wear, so be prepared to rotate your tires more frequently (I rotate after every event). Autocrossing will wear the outside shoulders. Camber will wear the inside shoulders. Find a way to a happy medium. On my current tires, I broke down the tires off the wheels and flipped them, thus moving the inside shoulder to the outside so that I could get more life out of the tires (8k miles on them now, have about 2k left on my 2nd set, stockers lasted 5.5k).
So for a stock setup, that's all there is to it.... except maybe when you get to the track, dial a touch of toe out on the front. But if you're asking the question you asked, then I don't think you'll be doing this. Toe out in front will help the car's turn-in because the wheel will already be flared out a bit. However this can get squirrely on the highway or road course, so it's not something you want to dial in all the time.
The general consensus (which is not the general "what I did") is that you should learn to control the car on stock suspension before you go looking for upgrades (coilovers/springs&struts then sway bars), so I'll give that advice too, even though I didn't follow it.
Learn to drive you car well, now, on the soft wallowy stock suspension and you'll be a better driver when you do upgrade (less bad habits ingrained).
Last edited by goofygrin; Mar 2, 2009 at 10:22 PM.
Mar 30, 2009, 10:10 PM
#5
I anticipate that this thread will be moved to the Motorsports section, but I'll give it a go.
Stock suspension for AutoX? It's good for learning, not not a good long term solution.
Here's what I recommend:
- flip the top bolt on your strut (the paint dot away from the strut body). This will get you near -2* camber.
- get an alignment, with as much camber as they can get up front (-2* to -2.5*) and -1 to -1.5 in the rear. 0 toe all around. Even in back. The tech might not like this.
This alignment might accelerate your tire wear, so be prepared to rotate your tires more frequently (I rotate after every event). Autocrossing will wear the outside shoulders. Camber will wear the inside shoulders. Find a way to a happy medium. On my current tires, I broke down the tires off the wheels and flipped them, thus moving the inside shoulder to the outside so that I could get more life out of the tires (8k miles on them now, have about 2k left on my 2nd set, stockers lasted 5.5k).
So for a stock setup, that's all there is to it.... except maybe when you get to the track, dial a touch of toe out on the front. But if you're asking the question you asked, then I don't think you'll be doing this. Toe out in front will help the car's turn-in because the wheel will already be flared out a bit. However this can get squirrely on the highway or road course, so it's not something you want to dial in all the time.
The general consensus (which is not the general "what I did") is that you should learn to control the car on stock suspension before you go looking for upgrades (coilovers/springs&struts then sway bars), so I'll give that advice too, even though I didn't follow it.
Learn to drive you car well, now, on the soft wallowy stock suspension and you'll be a better driver when you do upgrade (less bad habits ingrained).
Stock suspension for AutoX? It's good for learning, not not a good long term solution.
Here's what I recommend:
- flip the top bolt on your strut (the paint dot away from the strut body). This will get you near -2* camber.
- get an alignment, with as much camber as they can get up front (-2* to -2.5*) and -1 to -1.5 in the rear. 0 toe all around. Even in back. The tech might not like this.
This alignment might accelerate your tire wear, so be prepared to rotate your tires more frequently (I rotate after every event). Autocrossing will wear the outside shoulders. Camber will wear the inside shoulders. Find a way to a happy medium. On my current tires, I broke down the tires off the wheels and flipped them, thus moving the inside shoulder to the outside so that I could get more life out of the tires (8k miles on them now, have about 2k left on my 2nd set, stockers lasted 5.5k).
So for a stock setup, that's all there is to it.... except maybe when you get to the track, dial a touch of toe out on the front. But if you're asking the question you asked, then I don't think you'll be doing this. Toe out in front will help the car's turn-in because the wheel will already be flared out a bit. However this can get squirrely on the highway or road course, so it's not something you want to dial in all the time.
The general consensus (which is not the general "what I did") is that you should learn to control the car on stock suspension before you go looking for upgrades (coilovers/springs&struts then sway bars), so I'll give that advice too, even though I didn't follow it.
Learn to drive you car well, now, on the soft wallowy stock suspension and you'll be a better driver when you do upgrade (less bad habits ingrained).
Thanks a ton for the explanation. I had it professionally aligned (although they said they couldn't pull more than -1* in the front and -1.5* in the back) and I ended up winning the overall PAX on pretty bald stock tires. I'm going to have it realigned for more negative camber when I get my star specs before the next event. Great explanation, and apparently the results don't lie!
Jim
Mar 31, 2009, 07:13 AM
#6
If they couldn't get more than -1* then they didn't flip the top bolt of the two that hold the strut to the knuckle. It's got a lobe on it that makes it go from -1 to -2 (or vice versa). You might have to do it yourself before you go since they'll whine.
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