FP Black/Red vs Stock Turbo.
May 19, 2010 | 06:23 AM
#1
FP Black/Red vs Stock Turbo.
I looked around and I didn't really see much about the comparison here, but I imagine this a newb question.
Anyways, I'm in the midst of an engine rebuild. I'm looking to make 400awhp (not sure which dyno is around here lets just assume Mustang), but have similar to stock spool. I know the FPs are fairly close, but what setup does everyone recomend? I plan to bring the car out road racing, rarely auto-x and to the drag strip occasionally. Current mods to the car are listed below. The car is my daily driver.
Anyways, I'm in the midst of an engine rebuild. I'm looking to make 400awhp (not sure which dyno is around here lets just assume Mustang), but have similar to stock spool. I know the FPs are fairly close, but what setup does everyone recomend? I plan to bring the car out road racing, rarely auto-x and to the drag strip occasionally. Current mods to the car are listed below. The car is my daily driver.
May 19, 2010 | 06:37 AM
#3
There are alot of threads on this...
Power: Black > Red > Stock Same as you would expect with spool Black > Red > Stock... Black capable of 500+hp on 93 pump, Red capable of 400+ on 93 pump... Stock maxes out around 350-400hp on 93 pump... All are streetable
you are definitely going to need alot more supporting mods to handle a red or black though...
Power: Black > Red > Stock Same as you would expect with spool Black > Red > Stock... Black capable of 500+hp on 93 pump, Red capable of 400+ on 93 pump... Stock maxes out around 350-400hp on 93 pump... All are streetable
you are definitely going to need alot more supporting mods to handle a red or black though...
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May 19, 2010 | 11:32 AM
#8
whereabouts are you located floppy?
The black would be overkill for only 400 since the red and green can get you there with great spool. Mods others are talking about are injectors, perhaps cams, porting turbo/tb/intake/exhaust manifold/ 02 housing. intercooler. If you are building your motor, a stroker will improve your spool up more and from that point a black would have great spool also. all these mods aren't necessary, but will get the most out of the turbo.
You have to also remember, some parts can give large gains so which intercooler/ which manifold can effect greatly. The most important thing though is to have a smooth car with all parts. All of it is useless if one part is weak like a chain. If you go over 500 you'll run into fuel problems and need a double pumper, clutch, etc. so for 400 you should be good with 1000ccs and a walbro
OBviously, a tune is the key to success here and DTM is not where you want to be going for a tune. if you wonder why, just go to dcevoclub and ask any of the members about dtm's tunes and why they no longer cater to public. Email tune from mellon, ptuning, dan at ams to name a few are great options.
Just my .02 and good luck with your build!!
The black would be overkill for only 400 since the red and green can get you there with great spool. Mods others are talking about are injectors, perhaps cams, porting turbo/tb/intake/exhaust manifold/ 02 housing. intercooler. If you are building your motor, a stroker will improve your spool up more and from that point a black would have great spool also. all these mods aren't necessary, but will get the most out of the turbo.
You have to also remember, some parts can give large gains so which intercooler/ which manifold can effect greatly. The most important thing though is to have a smooth car with all parts. All of it is useless if one part is weak like a chain. If you go over 500 you'll run into fuel problems and need a double pumper, clutch, etc. so for 400 you should be good with 1000ccs and a walbro
OBviously, a tune is the key to success here and DTM is not where you want to be going for a tune. if you wonder why, just go to dcevoclub and ask any of the members about dtm's tunes and why they no longer cater to public. Email tune from mellon, ptuning, dan at ams to name a few are great options.
Just my .02 and good luck with your build!!
May 19, 2010 | 11:38 AM
#9
To run an upgraded turbo like the red and black you need
FMIC, UIC, LIC, 3" DP & CB, preferably a TP and 02 housing, 1000+cc injectors, wali 255lp fuel pump, head studs, cams would be a good idea but not necessarily needed 272's or bigger (make sure they have greater lift then stock cams), Twin Disc Clutch and a good tune.
Stock bottom end is good up to around 500hp, anything more your going to need to build it, and springs / retainers are good to about 8500rpms... anything more i would upgrade as well
FMIC, UIC, LIC, 3" DP & CB, preferably a TP and 02 housing, 1000+cc injectors, wali 255lp fuel pump, head studs, cams would be a good idea but not necessarily needed 272's or bigger (make sure they have greater lift then stock cams), Twin Disc Clutch and a good tune.
Stock bottom end is good up to around 500hp, anything more your going to need to build it, and springs / retainers are good to about 8500rpms... anything more i would upgrade as well
May 19, 2010 | 02:12 PM
#10
Myself with 407 currently about to be higher. ETS 3.5 font mount, walboro 255lph, I would no less than 1050cc injectors mine are scaled to 975 and I don't think the duty cycle is over 60-70% currently. I'm putting in GSC S2 cams and beehive springs to rev it higher I should be around 420-450hp once it's all done and over with.
May 19, 2010 | 04:57 PM
#11
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Most of our Green customers are in the upper 300's with a few just over 400. Most of our Red customers are at 430 area and the Black has a bit of a spread to it currently but we'll find the average as we do more of them 430-470
these would be closest to dynojet numbers but a little lower and I'm referring to 93 octane.
I've always bought a little more turbo to make sure I get my goals. Just because some people can get 400 out of green that doesn't mean everyone will. Some cars can have all of the mods in the world and not get there.
these would be closest to dynojet numbers but a little lower and I'm referring to 93 octane.
I've always bought a little more turbo to make sure I get my goals. Just because some people can get 400 out of green that doesn't mean everyone will. Some cars can have all of the mods in the world and not get there.
May 19, 2010 | 05:11 PM
#12
Most of our Green customers are in the upper 300's with a few just over 400. Most of our Red customers are at 430 area and the Black has a bit of a spread to it currently but we'll find the average as we do more of them 430-470
these would be closest to dynojet numbers but a little lower and I'm referring to 93 octane.
I've always bought a little more turbo to make sure I get my goals. Just because some people can get 400 out of green that doesn't mean everyone will. Some cars can have all of the mods in the world and not get there.
these would be closest to dynojet numbers but a little lower and I'm referring to 93 octane.
I've always bought a little more turbo to make sure I get my goals. Just because some people can get 400 out of green that doesn't mean everyone will. Some cars can have all of the mods in the world and not get there.
. J/k
I keeps it real
May 20, 2010 | 07:58 PM
#15
whereabouts are you located floppy?
The black would be overkill for only 400 since the red and green can get you there with great spool. Mods others are talking about are injectors, perhaps cams, porting turbo/tb/intake/exhaust manifold/ 02 housing. intercooler. If you are building your motor, a stroker will improve your spool up more and from that point a black would have great spool also. all these mods aren't necessary, but will get the most out of the turbo.
You have to also remember, some parts can give large gains so which intercooler/ which manifold can effect greatly. The most important thing though is to have a smooth car with all parts. All of it is useless if one part is weak like a chain. If you go over 500 you'll run into fuel problems and need a double pumper, clutch, etc. so for 400 you should be good with 1000ccs and a walbro
OBviously, a tune is the key to success here and DTM is not where you want to be going for a tune. if you wonder why, just go to dcevoclub and ask any of the members about dtm's tunes and why they no longer cater to public. Email tune from mellon, ptuning, dan at ams to name a few are great options.
Just my .02 and good luck with your build!!
The black would be overkill for only 400 since the red and green can get you there with great spool. Mods others are talking about are injectors, perhaps cams, porting turbo/tb/intake/exhaust manifold/ 02 housing. intercooler. If you are building your motor, a stroker will improve your spool up more and from that point a black would have great spool also. all these mods aren't necessary, but will get the most out of the turbo.
You have to also remember, some parts can give large gains so which intercooler/ which manifold can effect greatly. The most important thing though is to have a smooth car with all parts. All of it is useless if one part is weak like a chain. If you go over 500 you'll run into fuel problems and need a double pumper, clutch, etc. so for 400 you should be good with 1000ccs and a walbro
OBviously, a tune is the key to success here and DTM is not where you want to be going for a tune. if you wonder why, just go to dcevoclub and ask any of the members about dtm's tunes and why they no longer cater to public. Email tune from mellon, ptuning, dan at ams to name a few are great options.
Just my .02 and good luck with your build!!
E-mail tunes seem just a little weird to me. I'd rather get a dyno tune done. I don't have a problem with Nick at DTM. Though, I am curious to why they aren't all for it. Maybe I'll check it out before I make the long trip all the way up there.
Everyone, thanks for the advice. I thinking HTA Green would do just the trick with 1000cc injectors and I'm not sure what kind of cams to go with. 272 will make my goal, I believe?