trying to decide on what to buy...sti or evo?
Nov 24, 2011, 09:30 PM
#16
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I already have a '69 camaro SS I am restoring...but that's besides the point. And yes, people do care; especially when you know who owns the lamborghini gallardo you are racing. We race our bikes and cars against each other....so I want a car that everyone will not suspect.
Nov 24, 2011, 10:16 PM
#18
Before I got my evo I was a hardcore STi lover(out of the closet now
)
My brother even got a WRX 2004 that we did a stage 3 Prodrive kit.
Anyway, I drove the STi and then an evo the next day.
I would say stock to stock, the Evo took turns a lot better and didn't have the Subaru push in the corners.
I had a co-worker just look at an STi the other day. It was leaking coolant and oil all over the place. The Subaru dealer told him the Sti's cant handle more than 350 whp before the rods bend.
Anyway, I confirmed this with some people in the subaru community(yes guys, they are people too,LOL)
But, hey, If you get a really good deal on it sure. But if your going to mod without doing internals on an STi, your taking a risk.
Good Luck with whatever you choose.
)My brother even got a WRX 2004 that we did a stage 3 Prodrive kit.
Anyway, I drove the STi and then an evo the next day.
I would say stock to stock, the Evo took turns a lot better and didn't have the Subaru push in the corners.
I had a co-worker just look at an STi the other day. It was leaking coolant and oil all over the place. The Subaru dealer told him the Sti's cant handle more than 350 whp before the rods bend.
Anyway, I confirmed this with some people in the subaru community(yes guys, they are people too,LOL)
But, hey, If you get a really good deal on it sure. But if your going to mod without doing internals on an STi, your taking a risk.
Good Luck with whatever you choose.
Nov 24, 2011, 10:27 PM
#19
The STi is a nice car actually. The drivetrain is SOLID. You will most likely not break anything on there. And you can abuse the crap out of it and it will keep going. The evo drivetrain is strong (as long as you don't get the 6spd) but you can't abuse it. Well most people don't go out with the intention of abusing their cars anyways but what I'm saying is I'd be more comfortable powershifting an STi. Specific drivetrain problems with the evo include transfercase death whine, transmission input shaft problems, clutch lock-out on ACT and other clutches (for some reason the same clutches in a subie don't have issues) and probably a few others. Also, IMO, its easier to work on an STi. The average mechanically inclined joe can drop the trans in about 2 hrs on his driveway. On an evo its even questionable whether you'd want to attempt removing the trans on your driveway in the first place. I chicken out and pay $$ for many jobs that I'd feel comfortable doing on a subie.
The downsides is mostly in the engine. Its much harder to upgrade because of stupid up-pipes and downpipes, and headers, etc. that all rob power in stock form. Theres even a cat in the up-pipe. Its hard to fit turbos in stock location too, any garrett turbo will most likely need a rotated turbo setup ($$). The stock intercooler is only adequate for the stock turbo. And front mount is more $$. And really, at the end of the day, theres almost nothing you can do to make an STi engine handle all the power a 4G63 can. They're just innately incapable of doing it reliably, even when fully built. Most subie guys are shocked when they hear of evo engines running 28psi on 93 octane all day every day. The other issue is also the ecu. Most subie people toss the stock ecu whereas the evo has an awesome ecu that can be made to do incredible things with open source. You practically don't need an aftermarket ecu. And to top it all off the stock turbo and engine on an STi are both pretty weak. Low 300s at best if you want reliability.
The real difference for me though is in the handling. In the corners you're pretty much forcing the STi to obey your will. It takes a lot of mods to make it handle neutrally and competently (making it rotate is sometimes difficult). And I hate that stupid DCCD. It does such random things mid-corner if you leave it in auto, you have to adjust your driving style more to it than it does to you. The evo on the other hand has natural handling talents even from the factory. The ACD system on the 05+ feels like second nature. And you don't need to do much to it to improve its handling even more. And tire fitment is a HUGE plus on evos. Anything larger than 245s on an STi and you have to consider cutting, pulling, rolling fenders.
And I'm not sure if this matters to you but the trunk space and rear passenger area is much more spacious in an evo. Every time I go to the track I'm the one that usually brings all the tools/jacks/cooler/etc. plus my own set of tires for the track. My subie friends just don't have the space to bring stuff in their cars.
EDIT: None of the above applies to 08+ STi or Evo. I've driven neither.
The downsides is mostly in the engine. Its much harder to upgrade because of stupid up-pipes and downpipes, and headers, etc. that all rob power in stock form. Theres even a cat in the up-pipe. Its hard to fit turbos in stock location too, any garrett turbo will most likely need a rotated turbo setup ($$). The stock intercooler is only adequate for the stock turbo. And front mount is more $$. And really, at the end of the day, theres almost nothing you can do to make an STi engine handle all the power a 4G63 can. They're just innately incapable of doing it reliably, even when fully built. Most subie guys are shocked when they hear of evo engines running 28psi on 93 octane all day every day. The other issue is also the ecu. Most subie people toss the stock ecu whereas the evo has an awesome ecu that can be made to do incredible things with open source. You practically don't need an aftermarket ecu. And to top it all off the stock turbo and engine on an STi are both pretty weak. Low 300s at best if you want reliability.
The real difference for me though is in the handling. In the corners you're pretty much forcing the STi to obey your will. It takes a lot of mods to make it handle neutrally and competently (making it rotate is sometimes difficult). And I hate that stupid DCCD. It does such random things mid-corner if you leave it in auto, you have to adjust your driving style more to it than it does to you. The evo on the other hand has natural handling talents even from the factory. The ACD system on the 05+ feels like second nature. And you don't need to do much to it to improve its handling even more. And tire fitment is a HUGE plus on evos. Anything larger than 245s on an STi and you have to consider cutting, pulling, rolling fenders.
And I'm not sure if this matters to you but the trunk space and rear passenger area is much more spacious in an evo. Every time I go to the track I'm the one that usually brings all the tools/jacks/cooler/etc. plus my own set of tires for the track. My subie friends just don't have the space to bring stuff in their cars.
EDIT: None of the above applies to 08+ STi or Evo. I've driven neither.
Last edited by deeman101; Nov 24, 2011 at 10:34 PM.
Nov 24, 2011, 10:35 PM
#20
you're asking us to basically break down the entire STI vs EVO competition that has been here for over a decade, and then explain every reason why the evo should obviously win. well its really simple. you come to an evo forum, we're all going to say the evo is better. its better for modding, tracking, handling, and going fast. you go to an sti forum, theyll say the same about the stis.
what it comes down to is your personal preference. thats it. because no matter what all these people say, these cars are extremely similar and very close, otherwise they would not be so competitive with each other.
so go test drive each. see which one makes you feel more like a giddy little school girl inside. because its the only way to answer your question. in my opinion, the evo is more practical for what you say, and theres plenty of hard evidence all around this forum.
but what you should do is go test each and decide for yourself. because its not us that will be owning the car or driving it or modding it. its all solely based on you.
what it comes down to is your personal preference. thats it. because no matter what all these people say, these cars are extremely similar and very close, otherwise they would not be so competitive with each other.
so go test drive each. see which one makes you feel more like a giddy little school girl inside. because its the only way to answer your question. in my opinion, the evo is more practical for what you say, and theres plenty of hard evidence all around this forum.
but what you should do is go test each and decide for yourself. because its not us that will be owning the car or driving it or modding it. its all solely based on you.
Nov 24, 2011, 10:39 PM
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Thank you. That's the basis of what I need to know. I have heard by many people that the 2.5 is a very very picky motor and needs to be tuned every single time you mess with it. I want something I can tune, but isnt going to be a headache. Also, my "daily commute" is only 10-15min; sometimes shorter...and not only that, I am only a cpl hours from the NC mountains 
I was going to try and test drive an evo x this weekend along with an '05, '06 and '11 sti. I found a couple evo xiii's in my area, but not so sure on the price....any thoughts on this place?
http://godspeedmotors.com/web/1273/inventory?make_id=48
I was looking at the white gsr, but supposedly it sold. I think they wanted around 21k for it. Too much?
I was going to try and test drive an evo x this weekend along with an '05, '06 and '11 sti. I found a couple evo xiii's in my area, but not so sure on the price....any thoughts on this place?
http://godspeedmotors.com/web/1273/inventory?make_id=48
I was looking at the white gsr, but supposedly it sold. I think they wanted around 21k for it. Too much?
Nov 24, 2011, 11:50 PM
#23
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...011-evo-x.html
this guy obviously saw something better about the evo. maybe ask him some questions
this guy obviously saw something better about the evo. maybe ask him some questions
Nov 25, 2011, 04:59 AM
#24
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The STi is a nice car actually. The drivetrain is SOLID. You will most likely not break anything on there. And you can abuse the crap out of it and it will keep going. The evo drivetrain is strong (as long as you don't get the 6spd) but you can't abuse it. Well most people don't go out with the intention of abusing their cars anyways but what I'm saying is I'd be more comfortable powershifting an STi. Specific drivetrain problems with the evo include transfercase death whine, transmission input shaft problems, clutch lock-out on ACT and other clutches (for some reason the same clutches in a subie don't have issues) and probably a few others. Also, IMO, its easier to work on an STi. The average mechanically inclined joe can drop the trans in about 2 hrs on his driveway. On an evo its even questionable whether you'd want to attempt removing the trans on your driveway in the first place. I chicken out and pay $$ for many jobs that I'd feel comfortable doing on a subie.
The downsides is mostly in the engine. Its much harder to upgrade because of stupid up-pipes and downpipes, and headers, etc. that all rob power in stock form. Theres even a cat in the up-pipe. Its hard to fit turbos in stock location too, any garrett turbo will most likely need a rotated turbo setup ($$). The stock intercooler is only adequate for the stock turbo. And front mount is more $$. And really, at the end of the day, theres almost nothing you can do to make an STi engine handle all the power a 4G63 can. They're just innately incapable of doing it reliably, even when fully built. Most subie guys are shocked when they hear of evo engines running 28psi on 93 octane all day every day. The other issue is also the ecu. Most subie people toss the stock ecu whereas the evo has an awesome ecu that can be made to do incredible things with open source. You practically don't need an aftermarket ecu. And to top it all off the stock turbo and engine on an STi are both pretty weak. Low 300s at best if you want reliability.
The real difference for me though is in the handling. In the corners you're pretty much forcing the STi to obey your will. It takes a lot of mods to make it handle neutrally and competently (making it rotate is sometimes difficult). And I hate that stupid DCCD. It does such random things mid-corner if you leave it in auto, you have to adjust your driving style more to it than it does to you. The evo on the other hand has natural handling talents even from the factory. The ACD system on the 05+ feels like second nature. And you don't need to do much to it to improve its handling even more. And tire fitment is a HUGE plus on evos. Anything larger than 245s on an STi and you have to consider cutting, pulling, rolling fenders.
And I'm not sure if this matters to you but the trunk space and rear passenger area is much more spacious in an evo. Every time I go to the track I'm the one that usually brings all the tools/jacks/cooler/etc. plus my own set of tires for the track. My subie friends just don't have the space to bring stuff in their cars.
EDIT: None of the above applies to 08+ STi or Evo. I've driven neither.
The downsides is mostly in the engine. Its much harder to upgrade because of stupid up-pipes and downpipes, and headers, etc. that all rob power in stock form. Theres even a cat in the up-pipe. Its hard to fit turbos in stock location too, any garrett turbo will most likely need a rotated turbo setup ($$). The stock intercooler is only adequate for the stock turbo. And front mount is more $$. And really, at the end of the day, theres almost nothing you can do to make an STi engine handle all the power a 4G63 can. They're just innately incapable of doing it reliably, even when fully built. Most subie guys are shocked when they hear of evo engines running 28psi on 93 octane all day every day. The other issue is also the ecu. Most subie people toss the stock ecu whereas the evo has an awesome ecu that can be made to do incredible things with open source. You practically don't need an aftermarket ecu. And to top it all off the stock turbo and engine on an STi are both pretty weak. Low 300s at best if you want reliability.
The real difference for me though is in the handling. In the corners you're pretty much forcing the STi to obey your will. It takes a lot of mods to make it handle neutrally and competently (making it rotate is sometimes difficult). And I hate that stupid DCCD. It does such random things mid-corner if you leave it in auto, you have to adjust your driving style more to it than it does to you. The evo on the other hand has natural handling talents even from the factory. The ACD system on the 05+ feels like second nature. And you don't need to do much to it to improve its handling even more. And tire fitment is a HUGE plus on evos. Anything larger than 245s on an STi and you have to consider cutting, pulling, rolling fenders.
And I'm not sure if this matters to you but the trunk space and rear passenger area is much more spacious in an evo. Every time I go to the track I'm the one that usually brings all the tools/jacks/cooler/etc. plus my own set of tires for the track. My subie friends just don't have the space to bring stuff in their cars.
EDIT: None of the above applies to 08+ STi or Evo. I've driven neither.
The DCCD on the Sti really throws me off. I understand its concept and how it works, it just seems like it is more prone to failure or messing up if I let someone more unfamiliar drive it down the road. Also, seeing that I am looking for a car that is a couple years old, regardless of it being a subaru or mitsubishi, I cant help but observe all the recalls that the evo's had. I mean, dont get me wrong, I know the main one the sti had was in '06 for the faulty plastic, liquid-filled engine mounts...but that seems like a minor problem compared to the evo's tranny recalls. This seems like something that would turn consumers away; however, I am not 100% sure on what problems were present and which model(s) are better. Obviously the 8 & 9 evo's have more power than the newer ones, but they also have recalls. Dont get me wrong, I love the look of all three (8, 9 and 10) but if all I want to do is map the ecu, pipe, sway bars and coilovers (and possibly other minor upgrades), which evo should I stay away from? Also, like you stated, coming from knowledge of turbo-powered cars, it seems like a lot to run around on 28psi daily; doesnt that break stuff? I can understand if it's a 1jz or 2jz supra motor, but even then, I wouldnt feel comfortable running that much boost every day. Don't you get bad boost creep?
Youre right, I need to take the time and test drive both but with my work schedule, and the lack of these cars at dealerships within "reasonable" distance from my house, I would much rather find out as much as I can before I waste my time and the salesman's time.
Nov 25, 2011, 05:36 AM
#25
I saw a video on youtube on how to replace the fuel rails on a Subi. and it was ridiculous. not only are there two of them, but you basically have to take everything apart just to get to them. Sti seems like a pain to work on.
Nov 25, 2011, 06:24 AM
#27
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Get the Evo. I personally came close to buying an STi. Then I started looking into working on them :-(. Boxer 4< I4 when it comes to fixing them. I did a head gasket on a friends Evo the other day in a couple hours. Maybe i'm wrong but it seems like it'll take a half a day on an STi. His car is making about 420 on a stock turbo, tune, and some injectors....But as others have said, the trans and transfer case are hit or miss. I know some people that have gone through multiple trans/transfer cases and know some that are still using the stock ones. but the ultimate decision is yours to make.
Nov 25, 2011, 06:56 AM
#28
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I found a '10 Evo X. 13k miles for 29k...thoughts?
http://www.keffermitsubishi.com/2010...-NC/vd/8552332
http://www.keffermitsubishi.com/2010...-NC/vd/8552332
Nov 25, 2011, 07:05 AM
#29
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This is what I'm trading/selling...
And possibly this if I can't find what I'm looking for under 25k...
I also have an 07 r6 im debating on selling/trading depending on what I find.
And possibly this if I can't find what I'm looking for under 25k...
I also have an 07 r6 im debating on selling/trading depending on what I find.
Last edited by motodoc; Nov 25, 2011 at 07:08 AM.
Nov 25, 2011, 07:52 AM
#30
The DCCD on the Sti really throws me off. I understand its concept and how it works, it just seems like it is more prone to failure or messing up if I let someone more unfamiliar drive it down the road. Also, seeing that I am looking for a car that is a couple years old, regardless of it being a subaru or mitsubishi, I cant help but observe all the recalls that the evo's had. I mean, dont get me wrong, I know the main one the sti had was in '06 for the faulty plastic, liquid-filled engine mounts...but that seems like a minor problem compared to the evo's tranny recalls. This seems like something that would turn consumers away; however, I am not 100% sure on what problems were present and which model(s) are better. Obviously the 8 & 9 evo's have more power than the newer ones, but they also have recalls. Dont get me wrong, I love the look of all three (8, 9 and 10) but if all I want to do is map the ecu, pipe, sway bars and coilovers (and possibly other minor upgrades), which evo should I stay away from? Also, like you stated, coming from knowledge of turbo-powered cars, it seems like a lot to run around on 28psi daily; doesnt that break stuff? I can understand if it's a 1jz or 2jz supra motor, but even then, I wouldnt feel comfortable running that much boost every day. Don't you get bad boost creep?
Youre right, I need to take the time and test drive both but with my work schedule, and the lack of these cars at dealerships within "reasonable" distance from my house, I would much rather find out as much as I can before I waste my time and the salesman's time.
Youre right, I need to take the time and test drive both but with my work schedule, and the lack of these cars at dealerships within "reasonable" distance from my house, I would much rather find out as much as I can before I waste my time and the salesman's time.
Yea the evo has a few recalls for the trans. I think the biggest one was on the 03 evo. I'm not really familiar with what it was. I don't think you'll have a problem with a IX though. But critically you should really get the 5spd. Its made by getrag (as is the subie 6spd) and they never seem to build a weak transmission. Re: supra 6spd / r34 gtr 6 spd.
Honestly I think the subie drivetrain is the tougher of the 2. I'm a rally fan and you will see there are way more subies than evos in CRC and the US rally organizations because of it. The evos have a hard time taking a pounding but the subies can just keep going and going. But for street use as long as you treat your car with respect and care you shouldn't have a problem with an evo.
The 4G63 engine is probably the strongest and most legendary gasoline 4 cylinder engine ever built. They are the 2jzs of the 4cyl world. The engine is one of the best selling points of any evo. Some members have taken the stock engine to 200k+ with upgraded turbos etc. While daily driving, autocrossing, and generally beating on it the whole way. 28psi was a conservative estimate btw. You should check the dyno thread. I run 24psi but that's mostly cause of my BOV (stock IX uncrushed) and relatively stock engine / cams.