The Unofficial "MIVEC / IX Does Not Suck" Thread
Sep 11, 2005, 04:10 PM
#16
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I'm looking forward to it as well. My only concern is which of my current mods will fit. I'm about to buy cams, but am hesitant to since they may not work on the IX. Stinking money burning a hole in my pocket.
Sep 11, 2005, 10:08 PM
#17
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The only thing people really need to concern are those who will modify the IX right after they buy it. It will take sometimes for the Japanese/American to get aftermarket part for it.
Keep in mind that Japan has the IX for a few months now and most companies that develop aftermarket parts for a new car would get a "blueprint" of that car in a few months ahead.
Keep in mind that Japan has the IX for a few months now and most companies that develop aftermarket parts for a new car would get a "blueprint" of that car in a few months ahead.
Sep 11, 2005, 11:30 PM
#18
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I agree that the MIVEC is going to be a good thing for the average Evo owner. It's what Mitsubishi has been needing to add to the 4g63 for a while now. Its not like its new technology so all the talk about reliability is unfounded!
But... not being a naysayer because i like mivec. But high performance drag and auto x hondas dont use v-tec. The rpms are never low enough in auto x and drag to come out of v-tec so there is no benefit to having it. v-tec is more of a fuel economy system. Performance companies make v-tec eliminators that eliminate the vtec solenoid and associated devices. The v-tec cam gears are replaced with regular adjustable cam gears. They replace the multiiple profile cams with cams that only have a single cam profile that is similar to or more aggressive than the high rpm cam profile of a v-tec cam.
IMO i think we will see the same thing with MIVEC. I think high performance drag racers and auto xers will eliminate MIVEC or swap out the head for a non-MIVEC head. They only need the high rpm cam profile so why have it if you're not using it. It would simplify tuning.
But as i stated earlier MIVEC is great for the average Evo owner because the variable valve timing is useful to conserve fuel and help with driveability and idling. All things high performance drag racers and autoxers dont worry about. Just my .02
But... not being a naysayer because i like mivec. But high performance drag and auto x hondas dont use v-tec. The rpms are never low enough in auto x and drag to come out of v-tec so there is no benefit to having it. v-tec is more of a fuel economy system. Performance companies make v-tec eliminators that eliminate the vtec solenoid and associated devices. The v-tec cam gears are replaced with regular adjustable cam gears. They replace the multiiple profile cams with cams that only have a single cam profile that is similar to or more aggressive than the high rpm cam profile of a v-tec cam.
IMO i think we will see the same thing with MIVEC. I think high performance drag racers and auto xers will eliminate MIVEC or swap out the head for a non-MIVEC head. They only need the high rpm cam profile so why have it if you're not using it. It would simplify tuning.
But as i stated earlier MIVEC is great for the average Evo owner because the variable valve timing is useful to conserve fuel and help with driveability and idling. All things high performance drag racers and autoxers dont worry about. Just my .02
Sep 12, 2005, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by AWDrift07
I agree that the MIVEC is going to be a good thing for the average Evo owner. It's what Mitsubishi has been needing to add to the 4g63 for a while now. Its not like its new technology so all the talk about reliability is unfounded!
But... not being a naysayer because i like mivec. But high performance drag and auto x hondas dont use v-tec. The rpms are never low enough in auto x and drag to come out of v-tec so there is no benefit to having it. v-tec is more of a fuel economy system. Performance companies make v-tec eliminators that eliminate the vtec solenoid and associated devices. The v-tec cam gears are replaced with regular adjustable cam gears. They replace the multiiple profile cams with cams that only have a single cam profile that is similar to or more aggressive than the high rpm cam profile of a v-tec cam.
IMO i think we will see the same thing with MIVEC. I think high performance drag racers and auto xers will eliminate MIVEC or swap out the head for a non-MIVEC head. They only need the high rpm cam profile so why have it if you're not using it. It would simplify tuning.
But as i stated earlier MIVEC is great for the average Evo owner because the variable valve timing is useful to conserve fuel and help with driveability and idling. All things high performance drag racers and autoxers dont worry about. Just my .02
But... not being a naysayer because i like mivec. But high performance drag and auto x hondas dont use v-tec. The rpms are never low enough in auto x and drag to come out of v-tec so there is no benefit to having it. v-tec is more of a fuel economy system. Performance companies make v-tec eliminators that eliminate the vtec solenoid and associated devices. The v-tec cam gears are replaced with regular adjustable cam gears. They replace the multiiple profile cams with cams that only have a single cam profile that is similar to or more aggressive than the high rpm cam profile of a v-tec cam.
IMO i think we will see the same thing with MIVEC. I think high performance drag racers and auto xers will eliminate MIVEC or swap out the head for a non-MIVEC head. They only need the high rpm cam profile so why have it if you're not using it. It would simplify tuning.
But as i stated earlier MIVEC is great for the average Evo owner because the variable valve timing is useful to conserve fuel and help with driveability and idling. All things high performance drag racers and autoxers dont worry about. Just my .02
Sep 12, 2005, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Hotshot940
i understand what your saying but i have to disagree. the whole point of mivec is to give more low end torque becuase of a completely different profile, than that which would be used in a non mivec setup. look at the numbers, it's already clear that the IX is going to produce torque much earlier, and more torque, it will also spool faster as the profile allows air to flow better than the conventional setup. im not very knowledgable in autocrossing or drag racing but from what i have read, seen, and experienced, i can't agree that mivec is an unnecessary device for such functoins. my friend just swapped a vtec head onto his ls turbo integra, and will now see gains from 40-80 hp from that swap alone. now granted, those gains will be seen on the top end becuase of the agressive full throttle capabilities and gains of a vtec head over an ls head. the profile that these cams offer allows air to flow much better and becuase they are oil pressure senstive (at least vtec is) it allows you to enjoy insanely aggressive cam profiles under heavy acceleration, and comfortable driving over daily situations.
You restating in a different way what i already stated: MIVEC is good for the average Evo owner. But a drag racer or auto xer will never reap the benefits of MIVEC because they are never in the low end of the torque curve. The reason your friend saw such an increase in hp (which was probably closer to 40hp than 80) was because he went from a non vtec head to a vtec head which have a more aggressive high rpm cam profile and better flow characteristics. BTW i am familiar with how v-tec works. 
Sep 12, 2005, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by AWDrift07
I agree that the MIVEC is going to be a good thing for the average Evo owner. It's what Mitsubishi has been needing to add to the 4g63 for a while now. Its not like its new technology so all the talk about reliability is unfounded!
But... not being a naysayer because i like mivec. But high performance drag and auto x hondas dont use v-tec. The rpms are never low enough in auto x and drag to come out of v-tec so there is no benefit to having it. v-tec is more of a fuel economy system. Performance companies make v-tec eliminators that eliminate the vtec solenoid and associated devices. The v-tec cam gears are replaced with regular adjustable cam gears. They replace the multiiple profile cams with cams that only have a single cam profile that is similar to or more aggressive than the high rpm cam profile of a v-tec cam.
IMO i think we will see the same thing with MIVEC. I think high performance drag racers and auto xers will eliminate MIVEC or swap out the head for a non-MIVEC head. They only need the high rpm cam profile so why have it if you're not using it. It would simplify tuning.
But as i stated earlier MIVEC is great for the average Evo owner because the variable valve timing is useful to conserve fuel and help with driveability and idling. All things high performance drag racers and autoxers dont worry about. Just my .02
But... not being a naysayer because i like mivec. But high performance drag and auto x hondas dont use v-tec. The rpms are never low enough in auto x and drag to come out of v-tec so there is no benefit to having it. v-tec is more of a fuel economy system. Performance companies make v-tec eliminators that eliminate the vtec solenoid and associated devices. The v-tec cam gears are replaced with regular adjustable cam gears. They replace the multiiple profile cams with cams that only have a single cam profile that is similar to or more aggressive than the high rpm cam profile of a v-tec cam.
IMO i think we will see the same thing with MIVEC. I think high performance drag racers and auto xers will eliminate MIVEC or swap out the head for a non-MIVEC head. They only need the high rpm cam profile so why have it if you're not using it. It would simplify tuning.
But as i stated earlier MIVEC is great for the average Evo owner because the variable valve timing is useful to conserve fuel and help with driveability and idling. All things high performance drag racers and autoxers dont worry about. Just my .02
I've actualy neverr heard of this before. I know for the prelude the quickest is a 4th gen which is turbo's and has a h22(vtec). The fasest na rsx was a type s(i-vtec). Fastest street legal honda has a vtec head. those are for drag though. I can agree with autox kuz falling out of the powerband is easy to do.
I believe mivec will take time to get good. Meaning like what honda and vtec was. Most tuners would rather just tune a ls motor instead of gsr because tuning with vtec was more difficult. But now they are making power and know how to tune it. But since the evo has good tuners and an good aftermarket support i dont thinkk it'll take long.
Last edited by aboh6leenz; Sep 12, 2005 at 02:25 PM.
Sep 12, 2005, 06:12 PM
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I would have to slightly disagree with AWDrift07. VTEC is used in drag a lot, Im not sure about auto X because ive never done it. But in road racing it is also used a lot. Most people who dont run VTEC in drag set ups just dont know how to tune it correctly to where they dont blow their ish up. one of my buddies has a full drag hatch with 800hp and he runs vtec, simply because it equates to more power and he knows how to tune it.
I think with the MIVEC it will be the same, some people wont use it for the fear of just not knowing how to tune it correctly, but those who do will be passing everybody else that doesnt have it up.
I think with the MIVEC it will be the same, some people wont use it for the fear of just not knowing how to tune it correctly, but those who do will be passing everybody else that doesnt have it up.
Sep 13, 2005, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by AWDrift07
You really aren't disagreeing with me. You restating in a different way what i already stated: MIVEC is good for the average Evo owner. But a drag racer or auto xer will never reap the benefits of MIVEC because they are never in the low end of the torque curve. The reason your friend saw such an increase in hp (which was probably closer to 40hp than 80) was because he went from a non vtec head to a vtec head which have a more aggressive high rpm cam profile and better flow characteristics. BTW i am familiar with how v-tec works.
You restating in a different way what i already stated: MIVEC is good for the average Evo owner. But a drag racer or auto xer will never reap the benefits of MIVEC because they are never in the low end of the torque curve. The reason your friend saw such an increase in hp (which was probably closer to 40hp than 80) was because he went from a non vtec head to a vtec head which have a more aggressive high rpm cam profile and better flow characteristics. BTW i am familiar with how v-tec works. This is true...in race applications straight VVT doesn't make much of a difference..now the i-VTEC system is useable EVERYWHERE in the power curve.
Originally Posted by enigma94
I would have to slightly disagree with AWDrift07. VTEC is used in drag a lot, Im not sure about auto X because ive never done it. But in road racing it is also used a lot. Most people who dont run VTEC in drag set ups just dont know how to tune it correctly to where they dont blow their ish up. one of my buddies has a full drag hatch with 800hp and he runs vtec, simply because it equates to more power and he knows how to tune it.
Last edited by SevenFour; Sep 13, 2005 at 03:53 PM.
Sep 13, 2005, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by SevenFour
This is true...in race applications straight VVT doesn't make much of a difference..now the i-VTEC system is useable EVERYWHERE in the power curve.
No he runs it b/c he doesn't want to use VTEC killer cams in a boosted application and the VTEC head due to design flows better. He's never in the 'non VTEC' cam lobe when racing so he's not really using VTEC. You can try to argue this with me, but you're going to lose.
No he runs it b/c he doesn't want to use VTEC killer cams in a boosted application and the VTEC head due to design flows better. He's never in the 'non VTEC' cam lobe when racing so he's not really using VTEC. You can try to argue this with me, but you're going to lose.
Sep 13, 2005, 05:36 PM
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how long do you guys think it will take HKS, JUN,.. etc to make cams for the IX. It's been out in japan for about 5 months now. so there has to be some products in the works or prototyping stages.
Sep 13, 2005, 05:41 PM
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oh and yea, im tired of hearing that MIVEC is going to suck on the evo. well just be happy with the 8 that you have. im about to graduate college this semester and the IX is going to be my next car. MIVEC will only improve the 4g63's performance, why would mitsu engineers want to make it worst. EVOLUTION is the name, so it must improve to follow Darwin's theory.
Sep 13, 2005, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by AWDrift07
Finally some one who agrees and knows what they/I are/am talking about! I got tired of trying...
It's b/c I'm a honda guy stuck in an EVO...You should see the flame war I started in General disscussion about this...