Aftermarket 6.5's Lack Bass
Mar 10, 2007, 11:44 PM
#1
Evolving Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: arkansas
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Aftermarket 6.5's Lack Bass
I bought 4 Alpine type s 17C2's that have a frequency range as low as 35hz. I figured that these speakers have to have some bass, at least more than the stock speakers. I've only installed 2 on the rear deck so far and I'm not sure what to think. Maybe they need baffles? It's like they try to hit low notes but then they distort so bad it's not even funny. They don't hit ANY BASS I mean any. I don't expect my 6.5's to be subs. but they need to have some clear hits in some of the lower frequencies. What do you all think? the reviews on crutchfield for these speakers have a lot of ppl saying they have nice tight bass. How come I'm not seeing it? thx
Mar 11, 2007, 07:44 AM
#2
Evolved Member
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 516
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
They most likely need an amp. Then again, my Diamond Audio components sounded great running off an aftermarket deck for a while (while I was building the rest of my system). Good luck.
Mar 11, 2007, 08:28 AM
#3
Evolved Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 535
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
exactly.... the deal is that because you don't have enough power going to them they will have distortion whenever you try to turn it up.... you need to work with somebody good with car audio to help you pick out an amp of the right power level and help you install and tune it.
Mar 11, 2007, 10:32 AM
#4
Evolving Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: arkansas
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yea but my kenwood cd player pushes 22 X 4 rms. and the speakers only get up to 50 or something. They should still perform pretty good. And if what you are saying is true then I should be able to turn the sound down really low and turn the bass up and it should be hitting some of those notes. And it doesn't hit jack. So I'm real confused. All these other ppl that got "clear, nice bass" were just running it off a regular aftermarket hu.
Mar 11, 2007, 04:06 PM
#5
Evolved Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 535
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
your expectations are unrealistic and keep saying things that sort of prove you don't know what you're talking about. you never "turn down the volume and turn the bass up" if anything when you have nice clean power you turn the bass down and the volume up if you're working with enough clean power.
Mar 12, 2007, 05:38 PM
#7
Evolving Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: arkansas
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
that's not what im saying man. at low volume the speakers aren't taking up a lot of watts so if you turn the bass all the way up and everything else all the way down the speakers can be "tuned" to focus on bass. there should be some thumping going on. there is absolutely no bass whatsoever so it won't do me any good to stick on an amp, it'll just make the highs and mids louder.
Trending Topics
Mar 17, 2007, 08:00 AM
#10
Evolved Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 535
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
that's not what im saying man. at low volume the speakers aren't taking up a lot of watts so if you turn the bass all the way up and everything else all the way down the speakers can be "tuned" to focus on bass. there should be some thumping going on. there is absolutely no bass whatsoever so it won't do me any good to stick on an amp, it'll just make the highs and mids louder.
when you cut off some range then you decrease distortion so you can turn up the volume. the problem is that you have this thing called a crossover - it send certain frequencys to the tweeter and others to the driver. so just turning the bass up and treble down will make the drivers distort SOONER (and the tweeter will just be quieter while that's happening). they make a feature on some headunits called loudness which takes a range of sound in the bass area and raises in a safe and limited way which you would probably like. If you were to add an amp the extra power makes the speakers MORE CONTROLLED do they don't distort and you can turn them up louder. READ: adding more good clean watts will help you at all volume levels.
if you walk away from this post with one thing it's that you need to get rid of distortion and no do stupid things that will only increase it.
Last edited by theblue; Mar 17, 2007 at 08:02 AM.
Mar 17, 2007, 08:28 AM
#11
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: CT
Posts: 1,514
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Are you sure you don't have the polarity reversed on one of the speakers. That could also be an issue. I've heard those speakers before and they put out some pretty ok sound. You also don't sound too knowledgable in sound. Don't take it the wrong way or anything but its just the way you come off when you explain your methods. Oh and +1 on using an amp. Goodluck.
Mar 17, 2007, 01:58 PM
#12
THere is no such thing as reverse polarity for a car speaker. The phase will be dependent on the frequency being reproduced and will be posetive in some areas and negative in others. Proper phasing will make a huge difference in sound and correct electrical phase is almost never the best option.
Aftermarket speakers are less efficient than the stock speakers. They need more power. Your head unit does not make 22 watts. This is measured with a single channel used and all controls at maximum with no concern for distortion or clipping. 22 watts peak on one channel isn't accurate, add 3 more channels to power from that little power supply and it degrades quickly. You need to properly match equipment to get the most performance otherwise it isn't worth the investment. You need a good crossover and amplifier. For improved bass response you should reinforce the speakers mounting baffle. The flex of the thin sheet metal door panel is reducing the bass response. Baffles will not improve bass, they will reduce it. They will cause a peak in midbass response that can help if your car interior and mounting location cause cancellation in this area but remember that 6.5" car speakers are designed for a free air environment like a car door or rear package shelf and not meant to be in a small enclosure.
Aftermarket speakers are less efficient than the stock speakers. They need more power. Your head unit does not make 22 watts. This is measured with a single channel used and all controls at maximum with no concern for distortion or clipping. 22 watts peak on one channel isn't accurate, add 3 more channels to power from that little power supply and it degrades quickly. You need to properly match equipment to get the most performance otherwise it isn't worth the investment. You need a good crossover and amplifier. For improved bass response you should reinforce the speakers mounting baffle. The flex of the thin sheet metal door panel is reducing the bass response. Baffles will not improve bass, they will reduce it. They will cause a peak in midbass response that can help if your car interior and mounting location cause cancellation in this area but remember that 6.5" car speakers are designed for a free air environment like a car door or rear package shelf and not meant to be in a small enclosure.
Mar 17, 2007, 02:14 PM
#13
Evolved Member
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: CT
Posts: 1,514
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Alright, you didnt need to get that technical for someone who isnt heavilly involved in car audio. I suggested something that may be an issue that could have been easily overlooked by the OP. I understand what you are saying but can we please keep it simple.
THere is no such thing as reverse polarity for a car speaker. The phase will be dependent on the frequency being reproduced and will be posetive in some areas and negative in others. Proper phasing will make a huge difference in sound and correct electrical phase is almost never the best option.
Aftermarket speakers are less efficient than the stock speakers. They need more power. Your head unit does not make 22 watts. This is measured with a single channel used and all controls at maximum with no concern for distortion or clipping. 22 watts peak on one channel isn't accurate, add 3 more channels to power from that little power supply and it degrades quickly. You need to properly match equipment to get the most performance otherwise it isn't worth the investment. You need a good crossover and amplifier. For improved bass response you should reinforce the speakers mounting baffle. The flex of the thin sheet metal door panel is reducing the bass response. Baffles will not improve bass, they will reduce it. They will cause a peak in midbass response that can help if your car interior and mounting location cause cancellation in this area but remember that 6.5" car speakers are designed for a free air environment like a car door or rear package shelf and not meant to be in a small enclosure.
Aftermarket speakers are less efficient than the stock speakers. They need more power. Your head unit does not make 22 watts. This is measured with a single channel used and all controls at maximum with no concern for distortion or clipping. 22 watts peak on one channel isn't accurate, add 3 more channels to power from that little power supply and it degrades quickly. You need to properly match equipment to get the most performance otherwise it isn't worth the investment. You need a good crossover and amplifier. For improved bass response you should reinforce the speakers mounting baffle. The flex of the thin sheet metal door panel is reducing the bass response. Baffles will not improve bass, they will reduce it. They will cause a peak in midbass response that can help if your car interior and mounting location cause cancellation in this area but remember that 6.5" car speakers are designed for a free air environment like a car door or rear package shelf and not meant to be in a small enclosure.
Mar 17, 2007, 02:42 PM
#14
Evolving Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Omaha, NE
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Alright 1st off Type R's FTW!!! 
Now that I got my personal opinion out of the way let's get down to buisness.
The Type S 6 1/2" are alright, but not great at bass notes. It really excells at the midrange though. No doubt about it. The power rating for those are 50Wx4 @ 4 ohms. Your standard deck will put out about 22-25 watts RMS at THE MOST! And for that reason you will need an amp because you're only putting down half the power the speaker craves. Hence once again Amp +1.
50W x 4 @ 4 ohms
Some I might recommend might be the rockford fosgate T8004 which is the best solution because it gives the perfect amount of power and RF's are usually underrated for their potential so if you decide to upgrade it will be fine. Also comes with a remote bass equalizer. Downside- expensive like $450.
40W x 4 @ 4 ohms
If you wanna stick to a budget or keep alpine stuff go with the Alpine MRP-F250. It is a great amp for the money but you're slightly underpowering your speakers which could lead to clipping//burning of the voice coils at high volume. Benefits- Cheap $200-250, alpine performance. Downside- no remote bass EQ and underpowering.
50W x 4 @ 4 ohms
My personal solution would be to go with a cheap 4 channel like the audiobahn A4004V which gives a good reputation name behind it, but you don't have to dish out the bling. Runs around 100-150$ and has good performance. I would do this if I was going to get subs, if no subs then don't get this. Benefits-cheap and does the job. Downside- overheats and very low resale.
There are just some choices do a search online for other amps to choose from, but those are some of the better ones from my personal experience. Also I would highly recommend to Dynamat your doors if you're doing speakers only, to push those low notes but make it sound clean. If you have any more questions gimme a message. I can probably answer any question since I've been doing car audio for I think 5 years now.
Now that I got my personal opinion out of the way let's get down to buisness.The Type S 6 1/2" are alright, but not great at bass notes. It really excells at the midrange though. No doubt about it. The power rating for those are 50Wx4 @ 4 ohms. Your standard deck will put out about 22-25 watts RMS at THE MOST! And for that reason you will need an amp because you're only putting down half the power the speaker craves. Hence once again Amp +1.
50W x 4 @ 4 ohms
Some I might recommend might be the rockford fosgate T8004 which is the best solution because it gives the perfect amount of power and RF's are usually underrated for their potential so if you decide to upgrade it will be fine. Also comes with a remote bass equalizer. Downside- expensive like $450.
40W x 4 @ 4 ohms
If you wanna stick to a budget or keep alpine stuff go with the Alpine MRP-F250. It is a great amp for the money but you're slightly underpowering your speakers which could lead to clipping//burning of the voice coils at high volume. Benefits- Cheap $200-250, alpine performance. Downside- no remote bass EQ and underpowering.
50W x 4 @ 4 ohms
My personal solution would be to go with a cheap 4 channel like the audiobahn A4004V which gives a good reputation name behind it, but you don't have to dish out the bling. Runs around 100-150$ and has good performance. I would do this if I was going to get subs, if no subs then don't get this. Benefits-cheap and does the job. Downside- overheats and very low resale.
There are just some choices do a search online for other amps to choose from, but those are some of the better ones from my personal experience. Also I would highly recommend to Dynamat your doors if you're doing speakers only, to push those low notes but make it sound clean. If you have any more questions gimme a message. I can probably answer any question since I've been doing car audio for I think 5 years now.
