evotec

Is that 100whp gain with stock turbos?

fromWRXtoEVO

iTrader: (18)

Yes.

Carlos

evotec

Some guy that i know is arguing that the BMW engine is made of aluminium,which cant handle more boost.
He dosent belive that the engine can make more then 50 hp without bigger turbos.
Im trying to convince him with that dyno sheet link,lets see what he says.

fromWRXtoEVO

iTrader: (18)

Let him say whatever he wants. 50hp extra horsepower is very easy to make on the BMW. The engine is made of aluminium but , what?.

Just forward him the links I posted. I personally don't like the people that wouldn't admit the reality. Give him the chance to get knowledable so that way he is fairly given an oportunity to learn otherwise if he does not want to admit the reality then you can tell him that he is a liar ..

Carlos

Speed Element

iTrader: (270)

making 100 extra hp is already reality on this bmw aluminum block but longevity is in question.. but only the time will tell. I really want a 335i too

spdracerut

iTrader: (2)

Eh? SR20s are aluminum block and there are plently of those motors putting out 500whp, and that's from 2.0L.

3000ways

Check this sh*t out-

EVO IX tuned by IPS Racing to 381whp/371wtq on pump gas
Mods are:
AEM EMS
Cosworth cams 272
turboback exhaust
Upper intercooler piping
Intake


Here is just one of the negative qoute to this dyno in this thread-
Planet Evo "Another inflated dynojet number. Congrats"

As far as I am concerned these numbers above are perfectly plausible, a EVO IX with bolt ons, 25PSI boost, Cams, and tuned w/ a stand alone AEM EMS. Plenty of other EVO IX owners have shown similiar or greater gains with similiar setups.

The point though isn't the numbers on this EVO IX, the point is the skepticism EVO owners show other EVO owners when it comes to dyno numbers. When a EVO owner puts down any numbers that are very good, it is almost mandatory that those numbers are backed up with further evidence. I just don't understand why EVO owners are so gullible when it comes to other cars and why other cars are not held to same standards that we hold other EVO owners. I mean I am still waiting on all these 07 STIs to start running 11s on the stock turbo, but for some reason they aren't achieving those times . Why is that BMW 335is all across the country are running some impressive times but not close to the numbers they should be running in relation to their so-called dyno jet numbers? 340whp to 350whp/370wtq to 380wtq/3500Lbs to 3600Lbs car= high 12s to low 13s@106-108mph, wow that's truly sad in my opinion.

Don't get me wrong, maybe the BMW 335i has thus far been plagued with some very poor drivers, and maybe more and more of these cars will begin to achieve quicker times and faster traps as time goes on, but I just say before you re-finance your home and sell your EVO because somebody told you that BMW 335i is making 100whp/125wtq over stock you atleast wait for further proof of these gains, and understand that this 100whp/125wtq car in this thread may only have a tune and exhaust, but it is a tune and exhaust that will set you back atleast $3,000.

3000ways

Here is my main point, you want to sell your EVO and get a BMW 335i, fine. The BMW 335i is a great car, and maybe the EVO is just too raw for you, maybe too boy racer to to you, maybe it just hasn't been as reliable to you as you expected, but do not in any shape or form pretend that the BMW 335i (or 07 STI or MS3) has anywhere near the mod ability of a EVO especially when they have PROVEN NOTHING other than they can spin dyno rollers and beat up on nice but performance wised over priced M3s.

EVOfunk

+1

spdracerut

iTrader: (2)

Eh? From my experience, a car that has ~10lbs/1whp (dynojet) will trap ~110mph. My Nissan for example put down about 260whp and weighed ~2600lbs, trapping just over 110mph. So, the BMWs are right where they should be for the power they are making.

fromWRXtoEVO

iTrader: (18)

Thanks for making sense! That is what I have been trying to defend against Evofunk(my best friend) and other people. The car that ran a 12.5sec had 330whp on a dynojet and weighted nearly 4000lbs with the driver. Add the fact that it does not even have a rear LSD and you would quickly realize that a 12.5 with just 330whp(dynojet) and 3900- 4000lbs is absolutely excellent.

Just my opinion.

Carlos

fromWRXtoEVO

iTrader: (18)

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I agree on your first part. I insist that there is a video in which I watched once which has the BMW engineering department talking about the N54 engine and its development. They reached mid 400hp (estimated)with small/mid size turbos but again let me repeat that BMW engineering department decided to not relate turbolag with any of their production cars.

BMW lead for decades on hp/liter on N/A cars, they can and could had slap a mid size turbos or big turbos on any of their cars but decided not to for what I just said (turbolag). 30 years ago they already had a street version 2002ti turbo car, that is 30 years ago, perhaps about 15 years before the Starion turbos, mirage turbos and what not.

So own your own words lets not pretend that you are subestimating a company that have been capable of making well over 100hp/liter on a NA car back in the mid 80s and had turbo cars since the 70's.

I agree that the 4G63 is a very capable engine since the begining of its production, perhaps an icon when modding. BMW aimed for a different engine configuration, it is capable of making more power stock with a much better gas mileage but again this is all marketing strategy.

A Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4 was making 300hp with a 3.0 liters Twin turbo and the BMW of its age was making also (286hp but dynoed equivalent to about 310hp) without twin turbos and same displacement .

That is a clear example of what each manufacturer want it to do, a 3000 GT VR4 could have been much faster back in the day but Mitsubishi decided to put a pair of 9Bs instead a pair of 16G. Had Mitsubishi decided to put a pair of big 16G on their 3000 GT VR4 and the car would have had 450hp.

A Mistubishi Eclipse Turbo was making 190hp out of a 2.0liter turbo on a 4G63 while the BMW M3 was making 220hp with its 2.3liter 4 cylinder N/A in the late 80s.

This is the same scenario with BMW, they aimed for a smaller turbo set up, consequently they compromised performance with gas mileage and also with turbolag. My message to you is that BMW could have had a track monster if they want, they had AWD cars in the 80s and their engine department is perhaps one of the leading automotive technologies in the world, it was a matter of marketing, they chose a "friendly" street turbo version, that is all.


Do you realize BMW also makes Formula one cars, did you know they also have Motorbikes that have 165hp with 1200cc? They don't lack on technology bro.

Take care!

Carlos

Arithmetic

iTrader: (9)

It's a BMW and the Evo is a Mitsubishi. Your buying a quality sports, luxary vehicle. Don't knock the car or BMW because you can't afford it.

Not the cars fault, the potential is there, the drivers just need to translate it to the track. Also were talking about hookin up RWD compare to AWD on the Evo, in some cases big difference.

Again, don't knock it because you can't afford it. You have to pay to play. It's a BMW, of course its gonna be expensive. I have not heard one 335i owner complain about the price of modding the car because obviously he can afford it. It seems the one who can't afford the car are the ones complaining the most, tisk tisk tisk.

Time will tell, but your seriously getting ahead of yourself, just stop... you sound like a fanboy.

Just stop 3000ways, we all know you have to uphold the Evo name around these parts. You sound real bitter and most of your post with Evo comparsions come out like that, you sounding like an ignorant fanboy.

You should log of the internet for awhile and get a breath of fresh (reality) air.

EVOfunk

Carlos,

Again, the car with the driver and a FULL TANK weighs 3,850lbs, not 4,000. Also, you keep omitting the fact that this 335 was using fat DRs. Everyone knows the huge difference that this type of tire makes on powerful RWD cars at the track. 335s usually run 60 ft. in 2.0-2.2 secs. This guy did it in 1.69, better than most Evos. On top of that, it was achieved at Englishtown, perhaps the fastest track in the nation.

And let's not forget that 12.57 @ 108 mph is the fastest time ever recorded on a modded 335i. About 90% of 335s with the Procede kit are in the low-mid 13's at 106mph.

But oh well, this is just human nature. We all tend to be biased towards our rides, and since you sold your Evos and bought a 335...

EVOfunk

FYI, the Evo costs as much in Europe as the 335. Think 45,000 Euros, which translates into $60,000.

And BTW, 3000ways brought a valid point to this thread, he didn't sound like a ignorant fanboy to me. Perhaps is you the one who needs some fresh air...