Evo X vs. Evo VIII and IX
Jul 15, 2008, 03:07 PM
#1231
True, if it has the same power and drivetrain and weight distribution.
The X weighs more then the IX primarilly due to the AYC, but also due to the much improved safety and other regulations. If you take into account that the X is at least as fast (but really faster) then the IX on a road course (seeing as the evo is a rally car...) then really it becomes clear that stock the X is a better car. It uses technology to more then offset the added weight of a better performing, more livable and safe car.
Looks are personal opinion, and I would take the X's looks anyday. But that is not a viable argument in this thread seeing as looks are subjective.
If you want an evo as a drag car then your not gonna leave it stock. Evo's make impressive drag platforms with ALOT of work done to them. only time will tell how well the X can be modded and what times it will put down on the drag strip. However, seeing as the AYC contributes NOTHING but added weight and extra drivetrain loss then I doubt that the X will be better then the IX at the drag strip.
But who cares, stop focusing on the damn drag strip numbers. This car is a car that outhandles almost anything out there. Lets face it, an infinity FX-50 is as fast at the drag strap as your 8/9 or X. there are many other cars that can go fast in a straight line. what makes the evo special is that it can go way faster around corners, and the X does that better then the 8/9. Power is an easy upgrade (as has been pretty much proven by this point with the X) but handling isn't. I would take the X as a road course platform anyday over an 8/9. if all you care about is 0-60 times, and if your gonna cry about the 0.2 sec difference between the IX and X then you bought, or are looking to buy, the wrong car.
(4.6 best stock evo IX time I've seen, 4.8 best stock evo X time I've seen. Most reviews place the IX at 4.7-4.9 and then X at 4.8-5.0. I should have said a 0.1 sec difference)
But F*CK. all evos kick ***. the 8/9s are remarkable in their ability to be modded and the X seems to be also. I have much respect for any evo owner and I wish I could feel the same about other evo owners. But from the amount of X bashing going on on these forums it seems that alot of you feel differently. Is one truly better then the other? who knows, it depends on what your criteria is and who is judging. Can't we just admit the Evo is awesome and we're all proud to own one, and go back to embarassing other much more expensive cars?
The X weighs more then the IX primarilly due to the AYC, but also due to the much improved safety and other regulations. If you take into account that the X is at least as fast (but really faster) then the IX on a road course (seeing as the evo is a rally car...) then really it becomes clear that stock the X is a better car. It uses technology to more then offset the added weight of a better performing, more livable and safe car.
Looks are personal opinion, and I would take the X's looks anyday. But that is not a viable argument in this thread seeing as looks are subjective.
If you want an evo as a drag car then your not gonna leave it stock. Evo's make impressive drag platforms with ALOT of work done to them. only time will tell how well the X can be modded and what times it will put down on the drag strip. However, seeing as the AYC contributes NOTHING but added weight and extra drivetrain loss then I doubt that the X will be better then the IX at the drag strip.
But who cares, stop focusing on the damn drag strip numbers. This car is a car that outhandles almost anything out there. Lets face it, an infinity FX-50 is as fast at the drag strap as your 8/9 or X. there are many other cars that can go fast in a straight line. what makes the evo special is that it can go way faster around corners, and the X does that better then the 8/9. Power is an easy upgrade (as has been pretty much proven by this point with the X) but handling isn't. I would take the X as a road course platform anyday over an 8/9. if all you care about is 0-60 times, and if your gonna cry about the 0.2 sec difference between the IX and X then you bought, or are looking to buy, the wrong car.
(4.6 best stock evo IX time I've seen, 4.8 best stock evo X time I've seen. Most reviews place the IX at 4.7-4.9 and then X at 4.8-5.0. I should have said a 0.1 sec difference)
But F*CK. all evos kick ***. the 8/9s are remarkable in their ability to be modded and the X seems to be also. I have much respect for any evo owner and I wish I could feel the same about other evo owners. But from the amount of X bashing going on on these forums it seems that alot of you feel differently. Is one truly better then the other? who knows, it depends on what your criteria is and who is judging. Can't we just admit the Evo is awesome and we're all proud to own one, and go back to embarassing other much more expensive cars?
Last edited by ddawg1130; Jul 15, 2008 at 03:14 PM.
Jul 15, 2008, 06:38 PM
#1232
However, seeing as the AYC contributes NOTHING but added weight and extra drivetrain loss then I doubt that the X will be better then the IX at the drag strip.
Jul 15, 2008, 10:17 PM
#1234
People talk about sleeves amd semi closed block design being weak points, yet OPEN deck honda B series engines can make 700 hp on the stock block with upgraded internals, a good head gasket, and some ARP head studs to hold the top end down.
GM's ECOTEC in a test by GM's racing division found that the stock block and sleeves held up to just over 700hp with the same as the above mentioned on the honda motors. Are you two gonna sit here and tell me that the 4b11 isn't as strong as a couple of econo engines from honda and GM?
Last edited by STi2EvoX; Jul 15, 2008 at 10:19 PM.
Jul 16, 2008, 10:15 AM
#1235
Just to get back to the GTR "owning" statements.... The GTR really hasn't honestly set any records.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the...ng-lap-record/
Nissan admitted to using slicks, shock modifications, and they had a flying start on the long straight with start and finish timers in different locations.
You have to remember: The GTR may be a great car, but it's 3,900lbs. and has smaller tires than the Vette.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the...ng-lap-record/
Nissan admitted to using slicks, shock modifications, and they had a flying start on the long straight with start and finish timers in different locations.
You have to remember: The GTR may be a great car, but it's 3,900lbs. and has smaller tires than the Vette.
Jul 16, 2008, 03:30 PM
#1236
http://www.mitsubishicars.com/media/...E03_AYC_A3.pdf
Jul 16, 2008, 04:40 PM
#1237
Well, AGP is holding 30 lbs of boost all the way to redline on a big *** borg warner S200 turbo making 520 AWHP on their dyno. That's easily over 600 at the crank, and it's all being done on stock block and stock internals. Aluminum blocks can hold big power, and you iron block guys need to realize that.
People talk about sleeves amd semi closed block design being weak points, yet OPEN deck honda B series engines can make 700 hp on the stock block with upgraded internals, a good head gasket, and some ARP head studs to hold the top end down.
GM's ECOTEC in a test by GM's racing division found that the stock block and sleeves held up to just over 700hp with the same as the above mentioned on the honda motors. Are you two gonna sit here and tell me that the 4b11 isn't as strong as a couple of econo engines from honda and GM?
People talk about sleeves amd semi closed block design being weak points, yet OPEN deck honda B series engines can make 700 hp on the stock block with upgraded internals, a good head gasket, and some ARP head studs to hold the top end down.
GM's ECOTEC in a test by GM's racing division found that the stock block and sleeves held up to just over 700hp with the same as the above mentioned on the honda motors. Are you two gonna sit here and tell me that the 4b11 isn't as strong as a couple of econo engines from honda and GM?
Guys, the 4G63 is the most powerful 2.0L engine ever conceived and it will probably be that way for a long time.
Last edited by sonicnofadz; Jul 16, 2008 at 04:43 PM.
Jul 16, 2008, 06:14 PM
#1238
What all you aluminum block guys fail to realize is that OF COURSE you can make 500-600-700 hp on the 4b11 for a few runs. I will bet my life that the little 4b11 is not going to live for very long making 500-600 whp. Its pure physics. Aluminum is weaker, is more flexible, and has a lower melting point than iron. Over time all that high heat, pressure, and torque will cause the block to twist and mis-shapen. It is too early to tell what kind of power the stock 4B11 can reliably hold, but I am willing to bet that its not much more than 400whp. ALSO, its reliability at higher horsepower levels (with forged aftermarket internals) will also probably be pretty crappy. For instance, just take a look at the subby engines. While they in general can hold lots of power, they definitely seem to break WAY more frequently than high hp 4G63's. IRON IS STRONGER. ITS PROVEN. Its also heavier though... Guys, the 4G63 is the most powerful 2.0L engine ever conceived and it will probably be that way for a long time.
Guys, the 4G63 is the most powerful 2.0L engine ever conceived and it will probably be that way for a long time.Well, aluminum blocks can hold big power reliably for as long as any engine would need to last as long as they are using good components and are built right. Your response was typical of an evo 9 owner, so I am not surprised that you would say something like that.
You are free to think what you want, but you need to do some more research. There have been many cases of 4g63s letting go after 20-30thousand miles of making 400-450 whp because at the end of the day, big boost and high temps over prolonged periods of time will fatigue an engine no matter what it's made of.
I guess you're right though, aluminum sucks. Matter of fact, we should call bugatti and tell them to stop using it in the 1000 hp veyron, as well as nissan for using that crap in the new skyline. Hell, while we're at it, let's call chevy and tell them that the ZO6 uses a POS engine, and we may as well call Ferrari and tell them that their cars suck too. What a bunch of idiots they are. I guess that mitsu really dropped the ball on this one.
Last edited by STi2EvoX; Jul 16, 2008 at 07:58 PM. Reason: typo
Jul 16, 2008, 07:21 PM
#1239
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What all you aluminum block guys fail to realize is that OF COURSE you can make 500-600-700 hp on the 4b11 for a few runs. I will bet my life that the little 4b11 is not going to live for very long making 500-600 whp. Its pure physics. Aluminum is weaker, is more flexible, and has a lower melting point than iron. Over time all that high heat, pressure, and torque will cause the block to twist and mis-shapen. It is too early to tell what kind of power the stock 4B11 can reliably hold, but I am willing to bet that its not much more than 400whp. ALSO, its reliability at higher horsepower levels (with forged aftermarket internals) will also probably be pretty crappy. For instance, just take a look at the subby engines. While they in general can hold lots of power, they definitely seem to break WAY more frequently than high hp 4G63's. IRON IS STRONGER. ITS PROVEN. Its also heavier though. Guys, the 4G63 is the most powerful 2.0L engine ever conceived and it will probably be that way for a long time.
Last edited by VincentX; Jul 16, 2008 at 10:34 PM.
Jul 16, 2008, 08:11 PM
#1240
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Well, aluminum blocks can hold big power reliably for as long as any engine would need to last as long as they are using good components and are built right. Your response was typical of an evo 9 owner, so I am not surprised that you would say something like that.
You are free to think what you want, but you need to do some more research. There have been many cases of 4g63s letting go after 20-30thousand miles of making 400-450 whp because at the end of the day, big boost and high temps over prolonged periods of time will fatigue an engine no matter what it's made of.
I guess you're right though, aluminum sucks. Matter of fact, we should call bugatti and tell them to stop using it in the 1000 hp veyron, as well as nissan for using that crap in the new skyline. Hell, while we're at it, let's call chevy and tell them that the ZO6 uses a POS engine, and we may as well call Ferrari and tell them that their cars suck too. What a bunch of idiots they are. I guess that mitsu really dropped the ball on this one.
You are free to think what you want, but you need to do some more research. There have been many cases of 4g63s letting go after 20-30thousand miles of making 400-450 whp because at the end of the day, big boost and high temps over prolonged periods of time will fatigue an engine no matter what it's made of.
I guess you're right though, aluminum sucks. Matter of fact, we should call bugatti and tell them to stop using it in the 1000 hp veyron, as well as nissan for using that crap in the new skyline. Hell, while we're at it, let's call chevy and tell them that the ZO6 uses a POS engine, and we may as well call Ferrari and tell them that their cars suck too. What a bunch of idiots they are. I guess that mitsu really dropped the ball on this one.
Jul 17, 2008, 12:36 AM
#1241
Well, aluminum blocks can hold big power reliably for as long as any engine would need to last as long as they are using good components and are built right. Your response was typical of an evo 9 owner, so I am not surprised that you would say something like that.
You are free to think what you want, but you need to do some more research. There have been many cases of 4g63s letting go after 20-30thousand miles of making 400-450 whp because at the end of the day, big boost and high temps over prolonged periods of time will fatigue an engine no matter what it's made of.
I guess you're right though, aluminum sucks. Matter of fact, we should call bugatti and tell them to stop using it in the 1000 hp veyron, as well as nissan for using that crap in the new skyline. Hell, while we're at it, let's call chevy and tell them that the ZO6 uses a POS engine, and we may as well call Ferrari and tell them that their cars suck too. What a bunch of idiots they are. I guess that mitsu really dropped the ball on this one.
You are free to think what you want, but you need to do some more research. There have been many cases of 4g63s letting go after 20-30thousand miles of making 400-450 whp because at the end of the day, big boost and high temps over prolonged periods of time will fatigue an engine no matter what it's made of.
I guess you're right though, aluminum sucks. Matter of fact, we should call bugatti and tell them to stop using it in the 1000 hp veyron, as well as nissan for using that crap in the new skyline. Hell, while we're at it, let's call chevy and tell them that the ZO6 uses a POS engine, and we may as well call Ferrari and tell them that their cars suck too. What a bunch of idiots they are. I guess that mitsu really dropped the ball on this one.
Last edited by sonicnofadz; Jul 17, 2008 at 12:56 AM.
Jul 17, 2008, 01:09 AM
#1242
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Well, AGP is holding 30 lbs of boost all the way to redline on a big *** borg warner S200 turbo making 520 AWHP on their dyno. That's easily over 600 at the crank, and it's all being done on stock block and stock internals. Aluminum blocks can hold big power, and you iron block guys need to realize that.
People talk about sleeves amd semi closed block design being weak points, yet OPEN deck honda B series engines can make 700 hp on the stock block with upgraded internals, a good head gasket, and some ARP head studs to hold the top end down.
GM's ECOTEC in a test by GM's racing division found that the stock block and sleeves held up to just over 700hp with the same as the above mentioned on the honda motors. Are you two gonna sit here and tell me that the 4b11 isn't as strong as a couple of econo engines from honda and GM?
People talk about sleeves amd semi closed block design being weak points, yet OPEN deck honda B series engines can make 700 hp on the stock block with upgraded internals, a good head gasket, and some ARP head studs to hold the top end down.
GM's ECOTEC in a test by GM's racing division found that the stock block and sleeves held up to just over 700hp with the same as the above mentioned on the honda motors. Are you two gonna sit here and tell me that the 4b11 isn't as strong as a couple of econo engines from honda and GM?
Jul 17, 2008, 06:19 AM
#1243
True, but I'm talking US market and the "heavier weighing evo X" that people mention is comparing it to the US 8/9. The AYC weighs quite a bit on top of the chassis (which I admittedly didn't specifically mention).
The AYC uses a hydraulic multi-plate clutch to vector the torque to the left or right. You really don't think there is added driveline loss due to this over a simple LSD? I garuntee that the AYC adds driveline loss and I am also correct that it weighs more.
http://www.mitsubishicars.com/media/...E03_AYC_A3.pdf
The AYC uses a hydraulic multi-plate clutch to vector the torque to the left or right. You really don't think there is added driveline loss due to this over a simple LSD? I garuntee that the AYC adds driveline loss and I am also correct that it weighs more.
http://www.mitsubishicars.com/media/...E03_AYC_A3.pdf
It weighs a smidge more, but in no way responsible for any worrisome curb weight increase like you were inferring.
Dyno4mance dynoed and tuned an Evo VII with AYC. Guess what? It made exactly the same power as an equally modded US market 2003 model Evo VIII.
Jul 17, 2008, 10:10 AM
#1245
Well there are b series honda engines doing exactly what you think is impossible. Oh, and the 4b11 is sleeved also, and is semi closed, not open. Do some research buddy.