s4awd

I think designs that "have to grow on you" aren't timeless. You just end up thinking they're ugly again once a better looking version comes out. Example: Bug eye WRX and the previous E- Class. The models before them were great looking then and still are now. I still love to see the old 2.5 RS's driving around. I can never get used to seeing a blue one with gold rims. It looks like a 22B from a distance. I never had to get used to the 911 or the Ducati 916 either and I still love them now.

new 2 turbos

the only people i know that were even questioning the new 5 series looks in the mags, loved it in person.
the car looks sick, that's all there is to it.
anyone i know that has driven a new 5 fell in love. i think it's stupid that people who have never driven or seen this car for themselves, hate it.
so much for honest opinions......
btw, chris bangle is already on his way out, after the release of the 1 series. do the research before you go bashing and hating people...........
personally, i can't wait for the new M5!

WestSideBilly

iTrader: (1)

I don't hate the car, just the appearance. My sources all said the new 5 series is a much better handling car than the previous, which leads me to believe the new M5 will be an improvement over the old.

But it's still ugly.

WestSideBilly

iTrader: (1)

No weight has been announced for the upcoming M5. If you compare the 2002 5 series to the 2004, the 2004 models are very similar in weight, in most cases. I have no reason to doubt the new V10 will be of similar weight to the outgoing V8.

As for size, well, all cars are getting bigger and heavier, even the Evo.

turborrago

The design does exactly what it intends to, provoke a feeling or contradictory opinion. I dig it.

SoR

iTrader: (19)

Design looks like a hairy dude wearing a wig and has had his eyelashes done. If they redesigned the front headlights it would actually improve the looks 100%
This way it's just FUGLY!
Interior however would have to redesigned completely.
It reminds me on jachts/boats somehow and it's just way too busy, no strait line, everything is broken up.
Yes I see 5 series in person and they are FUGLY.
I saw the new M5 pics on the street because a guy that I know works in Germany where they make them and was lucky to take pics of one of them on the street. Looks damn ugly.

And no I would never trade my Evo for that car because if I wanted a 4 ton pig I would buy one in the first place for way less money.

WestSideBilly

iTrader: (1)

The M5 weighs 700 lbs (20%) more and has 220 (75%) more HP. Seems like a pretty reasonable upgrade.

sblvro

iTrader: (2)

the new designs are actually nice. the interior however needs to be changed.

new 2 turbos

as for hte first post, again, do research.
the new 5 series is lighter than the old one. 200-300lbs depending on the model. the whole front end is aluminum, everything including te firewall! the steel used int he body is stronger and lighter than before.
no specs on weight for hte M5, but i'm sure it too, will be lighter than the old one. it's amazing what technology can do.........

JNasty4G63

I know this might get me laughed at, but I don't care. I love all the new Bangle designs. I just love how when you see one coming, you know its a BMW instantly. But, its only once you get a closer look that you start to notice the little things that make them go from good to great.

I park right next to a guy in the parking garage at work who got a new 530 a few months ago. I liked it a lot at first. But, it wasn't until after seeing it everyday that the little things start to show up. The way the outside edge of the tail light flows right up the body line on the side of the car and over the roof. Or the way the creases on the hood, the ones that start up on the front bumper can be followed all the way around the car and back up front. They go right up the hood, meet with the lower part of the window, and then meet the crease in the trunk and wrap around the other side. Amazing. Same with the outer edge of the hood. It meets with the top of the headlights, which then meet with the crease just below the window, and the flow all the way back and meet with the tail lights right where the red and clear meet, and then once again flow all the way around to the front. It makes one big circle over and over. SWEEET!!! Now, I do agree, the designs are a bit controversial. I didn't much care for the new 7 when it came out. But that was before I realized how much stuff there was in his designs. I thought it looked like a 7 series that was trying too hard to be new and techy looking. But, once you start seeing things in the design like Bangle does, its quite amazing.

I don't agree at all with the "if the design has to grow on you, its not good design" theory. There are many things that I thought were ugly at first, but now, after seeing them more and more, they're just fine. The bug-eye WRX, the Audi TT, the PT Cruiser, the C5 Vette, the RX8, and the H2. I hated all of those the first time I saw them, but now, I've grown to like each one. Sure, there are those designs that just instantly hit you as amazing. The first time seeing the Countach, or the first time you saw the new VW Beetle. Hell, the same thing happened when Porsche changed the look of the 911 with the 996. People cursed the new "non-round" headlight look. Even then, it was totally a Porsche 911, but without the round lights, you wondered how long it would last. But now, you have no doubts, and might even question they're decision to go back to the round lights with the new 911 like they are. Not all designs have to just grab you by the neck and force you to love them.

Thats all for my rant. I just love automotive design. It is a subject that always amazed me, and still keeps amazing me. I applaud BMW for having the faith and respect in Bangle to let him change their cars the way he has. Sure, the looks are a bit different to what your used to, but no one ever got ahead by just sticking to what your used to. You have to progress in order to stay competitive, and I feel BMW is moving in a great direction. Keep up the good work Chris. I love it, no matter what others say.

Hilg

new 2 turbos

well put.

SoR

iTrader: (19)

All the cars you mentioned I hated when I first saw them and I hate them even more now, except for the bug-eyed wrex which left me in between.
Out of all PT Cruiser is the ugliest car ever and H2 just makes no sense except you can write it off of your taxes here in NJ because of loophole in law

I guess Bangle has the same taste as you...
Glad someone like the new BMWs because someone has to buy those things.
But then again, a lot of people buy them for the badge...

I looked at a brand new one today at work and tried to have mercy and not be so critical and most of the exterior styling is OK, all except for headlights which spoil everything. But more than a bug-eyed wrex.
Interior is nowhere near as nice as the one in a previous gen. Dash is just to broken up.

JNasty4G63

Now, don't mistake me saying "the designs grew on me" as me saying I like the cars. I'm talking strictly about the designs. The PT is a decent car for the $$$, the utility is nice, and the shape in different. But, I can think of many other cars for the $$$ to get. The H2 is the same thing. I would never own one. Its H1 all the way or not at all. I don't like how they based the H2 on the Tahoe chassis. That chassis works fine for a Tahoe/Yukon, but I'd rather have a specific Hummer chassis in my Hummer. Sure, that saves $$$, and makes the car a bit cheaper, but its just not the same as the original. Again, I wouldn't own an H1 either, but at least it held nothing back.

My point with those cars wasn't that they're good designs, or bad, or what. Its just how we instantly type-cast them as 'ugly' or 'hideous' before we get to really absorb the look. I love the RX8 now. Its a sweet car. I think originally I didn't like it because it just wasn't an evolutionary step from the RX7, it was a whole different animal. I loved the old FD, and when your expecting the RX8 to be the next great RX7, it let me down. But, now that I see its a whole different car, and actually took a much closer look, its a great car.

So, maybe Bangle and I do have similar tastes with cars. Good for me I guess. I honestly would buy a 545i SMG if I had the $$$, hands down, love it. But, I can tell you, I'm not the only one of my friends that thinks like this. Many of my friends, not just BMW guys, like the new look for BMW. Not that that makes us better or whatever, just that its obviously working for some people. And, I agree, some people will buy them just for the badge. That will happen with every car. Hell, the GM Suburban is a great car. My GF has a Denali XL. Great car, I love it, but she just likes it and got it because its cool and makes her feel tough when driving. I laugh, but thats what happens. Not everyone buys a car for the actual car itself and its intended purpose. Oh well. Thats what makes this whole thing great. People will love and hate every car, thats a given. You just have to know that going in, and accept what happens. If your market research and design study works, it will be fine. Ok, later.

Hilg

WestSideBilly

iTrader: (1)

I did my research.

Based on BMW's numbers:
- The '04 530 is ~40 lbs lighter than the '03
- The '04 525 is ~30 lbs lighter than the '03
- The '04 545 is ~10 lbs lighter than the '03 540

Considering the '04 cars are bigger, the weight reduction is good.

So, my initial post was correct - the weights of the '03 and larger '04 cars are similar. My theory is unchanged - the next M5 will weigh roughly 3900 lbs, or ~50 lbs less than the '03 M5 did.

If you have corner weights from similarly equipped '03 and '04 models, all with full fuel and fluids, no driver, on calibrated scales - feel free to prove me wrong.

snoop

iTrader: (4)

The new M5 will have over 500HP according to Industry estimates.

That is sick