Richard EVO

I have been running NT-01s for my last several track days in the Evo, at the big track at Willow Springs, and Streets of Willow. Before that I used RA-1s for years (started out using full tread, then switched to shaved). I like the NT-01s much better.

Now that I am running faster than I used to, I am using up a complete set of NT-01s in about 2 1/2 track days. I run a lot, figure 3+ hours per day. This is much faster wear than I got out of the RA-1s back when I wasn't running as fast.

So I am thinking about switching to Hoosier R6. What's another $50 per tire between friends? I run on stock Enkei 17 x 8 Evo VIII wheels (I have two sets). The size of R-Compounds I use is 255/40/17, but Hoosier doesn't make that size, so I would have to run 245/40/17 R6's. Don't suggest that I should go to 275/40/17 (or 18s) because that would mean buying 8 new wheels and modifying the wheel wells.

I'm looking for input from road racers who have switched from R-Compounds to Hoosiers. Especially if you know the road courses in SoCal. How much time do you think I could pick up by running Hoosiers on, for example, Big Willow, if my best lap time so far on R-Compounds is 1:34.9 ? Same question for Streets of Willow, best lap time on R-comp is 1:26.8. Thanks!

stuntman

R6's dont like to 'bulge' from being too wide on a narrow wheel. What size wheels do you run? I'm not familiar with "Enki 15 x 7" -you're running on a 15" wheel?

I'd run the 245/40s...

Richard EVO

Ooops. I meant Enkei 17" x 8" stock wheels. (I got confused with my Miata race car that has 15 x 7s).

stuntman

LOL, thought so.

255 is pretty wide for an 8" wide wheel. I definitely wouldn't go larger than 245 for the Hoosiers. "Usually" the R6's are about a 1-1.5 seconds faster than RA1/NT01.

But FYI - when I back to backed shaved RA1s to improperly sized (too wide tire for wheel) R6s, the RA1 felt better, put down the power better, and was faster.

GTLocke13

iTrader: (1)

I ran the 245/40 A6s on the stock 17x8s. No fitment worries with that combo. Don't know much about road racing though. I stick to dodging cones.

Bueller

iTrader: (1)

Richard, as you know, everything is a compromise. But imo i think youre losing a great deal of time with that setup. If your car is putting down the amount of power as before, i seriously think you need bigger wheels/tires. Since you already have 2 sets of wheels, i think its great that youre going to stick with your current wheels/setup to try things out. But i honestly think you will greatly benefit from bigger wheels/tires. Once my car is setup properly for TTA, i will be able to tell what i really think.

If youre looking for more concrete info, look at Jasons times. At our May TT event at Big Willow, his fastest time was a 1:32.33 on JICs, and 275 RA1s. And his power mods were basic, ie 100oct flash. And iirc, he had a cat. Either way, those times totally make sense to me. I dont recall what suspension youre running, but if you still have the same power as before, i think you can easily do 1:32s with your current setup, ie 255 NT01s.

Bueller

iTrader: (1)

That seriously made me lol.

dsycks

iTrader: (10)

Not that I fit the profile of folks you wanted to talk to but... I was in the boat you are in that I wanted better performance from my shoes and was running 255 rubber on stock rims.

I do not like the loss of feel from running rubber thats a bit too wide so I'm actually biting the bullet and getting some 17x9.5" wheels. I will run the same 255 rubber and think I should see much better performance from them. In the long run I hope to see better tire life and make some of the money back I am spending on the wheels.

Richard EVO

I don't have near the power I had before. My previous engine had built internals and a Garret 3076 and made 439 awhp, and 383 awtq. That motor lasted 4 hours and then KABOOM!. Now I have a stock IX block (from a car that was wrecked with low miles and no engine mods), a stock IX turbo, and an VIII head that is ported with mild 264/264 cams, and the usual bolt ons, etc. This is just a guess but maybe 325 awhp. I'm limiting the boost to 1.5 bar to avoid any more blow ups. After driving a Miata with maybe 115 rwhp for most of 2007, the Evo feels very fast.

As for suspension, I still have the same JIC coil overs and rear sway bar I got tuned by Mueller long ago. Lately Robi has been aligning the car and adjusting the suspension, and he managed to get some of the push out last week, but I think I have outgrown this suspension. Robi's KW set-up is $3500 and Mueller's Moton set-up is $5200 (both include labor). I'm not doing either one anytime soon.

The reason I don't want to go to 275's on 9.5" wide wheels is cost of wheels, tires and fender mods. I need two sets of wheels the same size. If the Evo was my only track car I wouldn't mind, but I'm spending a bundle right now building the Miata into an SCCA club racer to run in ITA. Full roll cage, fire suppression system, kill switch, new expensive racing seat, Hans device, racing suit, new gearbox, limited lip diff, etc. etc. It adds up.

Bueller

iTrader: (1)

If you want to reference tirerack, here are a few other options:

$239 - 255/40 - R1 (only one that comes in 255/40)
$237 - 245/45 - R6
$195 - 245/45 - V710
$199 - 245/45 - Z214 (Tirerack doesnt carry these)

Although, considering how much you drive at every event, you are going to eat through these tires significantly faster than the NT01/RA1. Just another thought.

Richard EVO

Do 245/45/17 fit in the wheel well without modification? I saw someone buy a set at Buttonwillow and put them on his Evo and they scraped.

Barfly30

iTrader: (1)

Hey Richard,

Personally I wouldn't make the move to Hoosiers. Knowing how much you drive, your tire budget is going to skyrocket. You will be better off as Ed suggested by going a little wider and picking up a set of Motons.

For what it's worth, a little wider of a tire and Motons on your car should get you to a 1:30.x and possibly break below that elusive time on a good day. Turn 9 was always my achille's heel in breaking that mark. I think I just watched Kent's video one too many times.

Richard EVO

Jason -

Nice to hear from you. Where have you been? Since I am running high 1:34's, I'm a long way from 1:30's.

The one place I'm sure I'm leaving speed on the table is Turn 9. Not carrying enough speed through it or getting on the gas fast enough when pointed at the apex. That translates into lower terminal velocity at the end of the front straight. I think I could make up a second just learning to take 9 ***** out. I always feel like I could have taken Turn 1 faster, and I'd like to find a quicker line trough Turn 4. The rest of the track I think I'm pretty close to my car's limits. Robi thinks he could run a 1:31 in my Evo and I don't doubt it.

For those of you who don't know it, here's the track we're talking about. Turns 3-4-5 are a hill, and Turn 6 is a rise. Turns 2, 8 and 9 are banked.

boomn29

iTrader: (47)

I have to agree with others and say you need a wider tire. I would think the added squirm and movement of a 255 on a 8" rim would be slowing you down. You can move to a 17x9 for pretty cheap and run that 255 just perfect.

It doesn't sound like you'd want to move to a 9.5" rim to run 275's; but it's done a lot. NT01/RA1 both work here for about the same price too.

Another more expensive option is running a 265/35-18... I think running Hoosiers is going to be a very expensive upgrade. I've never ran them, but I'm assuming they wear a lot faster.

FWIW; here's some info on tire width:
Nitto NT01 245/45-17 - 9.72
Toyo RA1 255/40-17 - 10.20
Nitto NT01 255/40-17 - 10.35
Toyo R888 255/40-17 - 10.44
Toyo RA1 275/40-17 - 10.90
Nitto NT01 275/40-17 - 10.91

I'm not a big fan of running a 255 on a 9.5" rim either. That's a bit of a stretch; but not too bad. Just my .02

Richard EVO

Can anyone give me a "rule of thumb" for how much faster Hoosiers wear, than a similarly sized NT-01? Thanks.