slide brake assemblies
Feb 19, 2009, 12:53 PM
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slide brake assemblies
So for you rally types, what's involved?
I found the Ralli-art GroupN part numbers for the kit (lever, master cylinder, and mounting brackets) I have no idea on what's involved. The kit looks to be nothing more than a specialized valve assembly (much like a master cylinder) but with inputs for both rear brake lines. The E-brake system is unaltered from what I can tell.
from my own guestimation, I figure I need to relocate the rear brake lines to the inside of the tranny tunnel, or find a suitable pass through where I can splice into the rear brake lines. then it's a matter of installing the kit itself..
Am I on the right track?
that's all academic, but I can't find anyone who can give me an idea on how much one of these kits are. Or as an alternative, what do you use when building a rally car on a budget?
Are there any generic "kits" that I can purchase, piece together that are cheaper than the "factory" ralli-art kits?
The point of all this, well.... look at the solo rules 16.1.C
any constructive advice is welcome... This is a research project at this point.
I found the Ralli-art GroupN part numbers for the kit (lever, master cylinder, and mounting brackets) I have no idea on what's involved. The kit looks to be nothing more than a specialized valve assembly (much like a master cylinder) but with inputs for both rear brake lines. The E-brake system is unaltered from what I can tell.
from my own guestimation, I figure I need to relocate the rear brake lines to the inside of the tranny tunnel, or find a suitable pass through where I can splice into the rear brake lines. then it's a matter of installing the kit itself..
Am I on the right track?
that's all academic, but I can't find anyone who can give me an idea on how much one of these kits are. Or as an alternative, what do you use when building a rally car on a budget?
Are there any generic "kits" that I can purchase, piece together that are cheaper than the "factory" ralli-art kits?
The point of all this, well.... look at the solo rules 16.1.C
any constructive advice is welcome... This is a research project at this point.
Feb 19, 2009, 02:37 PM
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The problem is you have is you have a 2003 Evo, therefore a viscous coupled center differential. If you install a hydraulic handbrake, what happens when you pull it is you lock the rear wheels, and since V/C center diffs only tolerate a slight difference in speed, you lock the front wheels too.
New Evos with the ACD are at heart an open diff with a hydraulically activated clutch pack and when you pull the handbrake there's a switch to let the ACD ECU know, and the ECU unlocks the center diff and the rear wheels can happily lock while the fronts keep turning.
If that wasn't enough, your 2003 has ABS, and I'm not sure what would happen when you pulled the handbrake and suddenly the rear sensors detected 0 wheel speed and fronts were still (temporarily) spinning. You could pull the ABS fuse, but it seems like Solo people like their ABS.
Oh, the Ralliart unit you're talking about is a little over $1K with the master cylinder. The reason it has a dual master cylinder setup is Group N cars have to maintain the OEM brake line configuration which on the Evo is an "X".
New Evos with the ACD are at heart an open diff with a hydraulically activated clutch pack and when you pull the handbrake there's a switch to let the ACD ECU know, and the ECU unlocks the center diff and the rear wheels can happily lock while the fronts keep turning.
If that wasn't enough, your 2003 has ABS, and I'm not sure what would happen when you pulled the handbrake and suddenly the rear sensors detected 0 wheel speed and fronts were still (temporarily) spinning. You could pull the ABS fuse, but it seems like Solo people like their ABS.
Oh, the Ralliart unit you're talking about is a little over $1K with the master cylinder. The reason it has a dual master cylinder setup is Group N cars have to maintain the OEM brake line configuration which on the Evo is an "X".
Feb 19, 2009, 03:14 PM
#4
If that wasn't enough, your 2003 has ABS, and I'm not sure what would happen when you pulled the handbrake and suddenly the rear sensors detected 0 wheel speed and fronts were still (temporarily) spinning. You could pull the ABS fuse, but it seems like Solo people like their ABS.
Feb 19, 2009, 04:24 PM
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I am still curious what the effect of the slide brake would be on the viscous coupling.
I did a little research into the audi S1 quattro rally car. that car didn't use a viscous coupling, but a torsen diff for the center diff. Torsen diffs work similar to the viscous coupling, so.... hmmmm...
I wonder.
Feb 20, 2009, 06:51 AM
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sweet. at least I have that much going for me
I am still curious what the effect of the slide brake would be on the viscous coupling.
I did a little research into the audi S1 quattro rally car. that car didn't use a viscous coupling, but a torsen diff for the center diff. Torsen diffs work similar to the viscous coupling, so.... hmmmm...
I wonder.
I am still curious what the effect of the slide brake would be on the viscous coupling.
I did a little research into the audi S1 quattro rally car. that car didn't use a viscous coupling, but a torsen diff for the center diff. Torsen diffs work similar to the viscous coupling, so.... hmmmm...
I wonder.
http://www.oldrallysport.on.ca/articles/diffs.html
The salient paragraph:
So how can diffs tighten and loosen? Well, some can and some can’t, and those that can do it in different ways. A viscous coupling of the “shear” type can only sense when the wheels are turning at different speeds and so cannot sense braking or acceleration. As a result, it is not a very predictable differential to use in a rally car, although the Subaru WRX (non-STi), the Mitsubishi Evolution (up to the Evo VI), and the Eagle Talon all have viscous centre differentials from the factory. Essentially, the diff will allow the front and rear wheels to move at slightly different speeds without resistance, but the moment there is a big speed difference the front and rear wheels will lock to each other. This is fine for an average driver in slippery conditions on the way to the ski hill, but not so good for competition. (Incidentally, for the hooligans amongst us, this is why these cars won’t do very good handbrake turns!)
Feb 20, 2009, 07:46 AM
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Check this article out:
http://www.oldrallysport.on.ca/articles/diffs.html
The salient paragraph:
But maybe "won't do very good" isn't that bad, you could always ask on the specialstage.com forums since there's quite a few people who run the WRX which has a V/C center diff. My guess is you can get a quick flick out of the handbrake, anything more will start to lock up the fronts.
http://www.oldrallysport.on.ca/articles/diffs.html
The salient paragraph:
But maybe "won't do very good" isn't that bad, you could always ask on the specialstage.com forums since there's quite a few people who run the WRX which has a V/C center diff. My guess is you can get a quick flick out of the handbrake, anything more will start to lock up the fronts.
I haven't visted special stage yet. I plan too.
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