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Increasing Power vs. Weight Reduction

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Old Jun 11, 2009 | 08:30 PM
  #31  
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The US models have emissions equipment mounted under the back of the car, so the ACD pump couldn't be put in the same location. On the US spec cars it is mounted just behind the front bumper on the driver's side. A really really dumb place to put a component that could cripple a car in a mild accident.

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Old Jun 12, 2009 | 03:13 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by DaveK
The US models have emissions equipment mounted under the back of the car, so the ACD pump couldn't be put in the same location. On the US spec cars it is mounted just behind the front bumper on the driver's side. A really really dumb place to put a component that could cripple a car in a mild accident.

Dave
Stupid smog pump , you/we can take that out cause i've seen it on here before. My concern with the JDM OEM location then is a rear'ending causing damage too (because again it's exposed). I'm also curious if the 9 pumps are different from the 10 pumps. Because it sounds like they put it up front or "outside" on the 9's to get it cooled off. Where in the 10, it's in a spot where 0 air gets to it.

In the end i'd like to get it out of the front as well Dave, and if we can relocate the oil cooler in front of the radiator, we can effectively seal off both "sides" of the front bumper.
Old Jun 12, 2009 | 03:23 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by Balrok
My concern with the JDM OEM location then is a rear'ending causing damage too (because again it's exposed).
That's a very valid concern. I had a ~10mph sideways bump into the side of a mountain, and while the bumper survived with some chipped paint, the metal underneath took a severe beating...enough that the pump/reservoir would've been damaged. FWIW, ACP has the ACD pump on the IX in the same location I'll be using, and in front of the navvie footrest on his X, so I'd guess that airflow isn't much of a concern.

Originally Posted by Balrok
if we can relocate the oil cooler in front of the radiator, we can effectively seal off both "sides" of the front bumper.
I was thinking this as well, but the one thing that concerned me is that you'd be putting another cooler in front of the radiatior, further reducing its effectiveness. I had my car get hot (temp needle moved up from normal operating temp) when I was approaching Devils Playground on PPIHC last year, and I was only running ~300whp on E85. I had a Koyo radiator too. I didn't the plastic air guides for the sides of the radiator, and I don't have one of those plates that seals off the area between the radiator and the bumper. Not sure how much I left on the table as a result of missing those parts.

Dave
Old Jun 12, 2009 | 07:43 PM
  #34  
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As far as the ACD pump goes, does ACP run it for 20 mins? 20 hours? I'm trying to overbuild like you so i'd like to know what sort of abuse they've put it through time wise (besides the obvious rally/bumping/rough ride/constant shifting/pumping) to determine what's the best possible relocation for it's longevity.

For the oil cooler, i've thought about the restriction as well. What i've heard, and unfort. in our world haven't seen, is using Fluidyne's NASCAR spec oil cooler across the upper opening. This cooler, which runs for a pretty penny, should be 100 times better then the one we have/use OEM wise. So it's obviously designed to let the air through once you read the specs. Now onto the water cooling. This is also a concern of mine because at my last event I hit 245deg F. The changes between the last run and this run was the fact that I no longer have AC or an AC belt or AC controller or anything related. And I've taken the heat shields off of the OEM turbo/O2 setup.

My original plan was to free up weight and air so it cools the turbo hotside while i'm driving. But what I really think is going on is the fact that the oem radiator with the oem fan isn't really pushing air through ON TOP OF the fact that the super-heated turbo was causing heat gain on the driver side of the radiator. It could be one or the other, but I can't be certain.

While on track, my oem water gauge was reading just below normal, while my upper radiator gauge was reading 245. Does the water flow up or down through the radiator hoses into the engine?
Old Jun 12, 2009 | 07:57 PM
  #35  
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There are some stages in the US where guys will be running for 20 minutes or so, and I'd bet during rally the pump sees much higher abuse than it will out at a track. The rally diff programmers all increase line pressure to make the center diff lock harder, so all in all I'd say rally abuse is about the 'worst case' scenario. The big question would be, how often does ACP burn out or replace the pumps?

There's a company in the UK that makes an upgrade kit, that enables the pumps to survive the heavy useage. http://www.hh-ms.com/products.htm

Any info on the nascar coolers?

Dave
Old Jun 13, 2009 | 02:30 AM
  #36  
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Nice find on the pump, any idea what they actually "do" to it besides the obvious Earl-like lines/fittings? I've seen Works and some others offer the Ralliart diff controller, pondered getting the Tarmac one myself, you run one?


On the oil coolers, These bad boys, specifically the airbox 650 which i've seen on a LOT of the LeMans cars:

http://www.fluidyne.com/pl_theoc.html
Old Jun 13, 2009 | 01:28 PM
  #37  
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Regarding water temp, when mine got hot at race to the sky, we taped up the sides of the radiator, removed 1 headlight and lifted the back of the bonnet (hood) to let air through. It was perfect. Does anyone know why the acd pumps burn out. Is it heat that causes it or another prob. Motec in Australia build one of the best acd computers. You can fully tune it. Ralliart is still locked in to what they set. The price may not be to different when you factor the currency exchange.
Well, off racing now. Had an alignment done this week. 20mm to out front, 13mm toe out rear. 25mm = 1 inch!!!! Not sure how that happened. Should be easier to drive now.
Old Jun 15, 2009 | 11:23 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by vaughany
Regarding water temp, when mine got hot at race to the sky, we taped up the sides of the radiator, removed 1 headlight and lifted the back of the bonnet (hood) to let air through. It was perfect. Does anyone know why the acd pumps burn out. Is it heat that causes it or another prob. Motec in Australia build one of the best acd computers. You can fully tune it. Ralliart is still locked in to what they set. The price may not be to different when you factor the currency exchange.
Great tip on the hood/radiator.

I've got the MoTec MDC (diff programmer), and highly recommend it! I haven't messed with the settings at all. I found them to make the most difference when using left-foot-braking. The changes are subtle, but allow you to carry more speed thru the corners, such that you might not notice that the car is really any better. But, if you swap back in the OEM diff ECU, you'll notice all of a sudden the car isn't as planted....well, at least that's what I noticed when doing back-to-back comparisons at the ice tracks at the Bridgestone Winter Driving School.

Dave
Old Jun 17, 2009 | 03:12 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by DaveK
Just wanted to keep you guys in the loop with what I'm doing, though I'll probably start another thread shortly to document the changes we've made for 2009.

Just ordered the following:

Fiber Images Super - Lightweight Hood - 6 lbs. current Vis hood is 22. 16 lbs saved
Fiber Images Trunk - 5 lbs. current trunk is 22.5. 18 lbs saved
AMS 2-piece driveshaft - 14.5 lbs saved

I will also try to trim some additional weight out of the rear doors. I'm also going to tackle the ACD reservoir move next week, and I should be able to shed a heavy bracket, and put the weight in a more beneficial place (behind passenger seat). I bought a spot-weld drill bit so I may go after any additional bracketing. Short of the $$ I spent on the above mentioned parts, I'm going to see what I can pull out now in sweat equity. I'm pretty confident I'll be able to get the car near 2950 without going too crazy.

The benefit of these mods is that I can use them for all the racing I'm doing. CF doors wouldn't be rally legal, so they'd be a PPIHC item only. Based on budget contstraints, those will have to wait till next year. I'm currently trying to decide if lexan would be a good idea in our dusty environments.

Dave
Your car setup is very similar to what I am in the process of doing to my car except I run mine on the track. I'm dropping in a 2.3L stroker with all the goodies, but I am probably going with the 76r turbo. I am also trying to trim weight. Can you pm me with approximately what you paid for the Fiber Image trunk and hood? I'm shopping around for them right now and want to make sure I get a fair price. If you have received the items already let me know how you like them (quality/look). Are you pretty sure the weight savings numbers are accurate? Nice setup by the way!
Old Jun 17, 2009 | 03:32 PM
  #40  
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I believe AMS sells the hood and trunk for $599 each, but a quick call to them would get you the most up-to-date pricing.

I do not have a scale, but the hood is definately much lighter than the hood I pulled off the car, which was a Vis Tracer hood. I'm also guessing that the quoted weight doesn't include the hood vent, which probably weighs over a pound itself.

Dave
Old Jul 5, 2009 | 03:28 PM
  #41  
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+1 for weight reduction. +10 for unsprung weight reduction. I haven't seen anything in this thread about unsprung weight reduction. What kind of wheels are you running? You may be able to save 5-6 lbs per wheel depending on what your current setup is. Buddy club and Volks make some super lightweight wheels for a pretty price. Enkei has some decent lightweights as well that are easier on the budget. Judging by recent pics of your car I'm guessing you already know most of this...
Old Jul 7, 2009 | 11:46 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by voloracer
+1 for weight reduction. +10 for unsprung weight reduction. I haven't seen anything in this thread about unsprung weight reduction. What kind of wheels are you running? You may be able to save 5-6 lbs per wheel depending on what your current setup is. Buddy club and Volks make some super lightweight wheels for a pretty price. Enkei has some decent lightweights as well that are easier on the budget. Judging by recent pics of your car I'm guessing you already know most of this...
Enkei NT0-3s, 17x9.5. Should arrive tomorrow. Then to see if they'll fit under the car with 275-40-17s.

My old wheel setup was 15x7 with rally tires, so I'm guessing weight will be a wash on the wheel/tires.

Dave
Old Jul 8, 2009 | 01:35 AM
  #43  
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I am on 18x9 at 10P on the front and they fit fine. Cant turn full lock tough as they rub on the back arch
Old Jul 8, 2009 | 07:38 AM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by vaughany
I am on 18x9 at 10P on the front and they fit fine. Cant turn full lock tough as they rub on the back arch
Big hammer, heat gun, and some massaging techniques fixed that on mine
Old Jul 8, 2009 | 01:34 PM
  #45  
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I don't understand some people think getting widest and biggest tire size will increase traction but doesn't know it will affect unsprung weight.
I had 245 and 275s before and for some reason, I like 245s over 275.


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