Suggestions for braking and aero
Aug 22, 2011, 04:05 PM
#31
Yeah, getsideways, consider yourself lucky that you didn't know me previously. 
One thing is that I also have always been about simplicity and bang-for-the-buck. Back in the day, I had a little Warrtalon mod package that was very cheap and simple but allowed me to hit 12.1 in the 1/4 back when 12.1 was actually impressive (before IXs existed). Even after that, I always have gone with the minimum required. The most expensive things on my car are the suspension and wheel/tire combo (track only). Everything else is minimal but good quality, so I know what you mean.
I can easily do the Hawk DTC70s and Endless fluid with a complete flush very quickly and be ready to go. Ducts would take longer and be more pieces to worry about. Mine also tore up, but I was competing in AutoX (went to Nats), which may have done it. I will only be doing road course with occasional drag, but I don't have to add them right away. It seems the fluid and DTC70s will be an immediate bump up considering I already have SS lines and slotted rotors. I'm only concerned I may want to do new rotors, since these are 4 years old (not many miles, though).
Btw, this has been a great thread, and I appreciate all of the excellent feedback. I haven't been the recipient of much information over the years, so it is much appreciated.
One thing is that I also have always been about simplicity and bang-for-the-buck. Back in the day, I had a little Warrtalon mod package that was very cheap and simple but allowed me to hit 12.1 in the 1/4 back when 12.1 was actually impressive (before IXs existed). Even after that, I always have gone with the minimum required. The most expensive things on my car are the suspension and wheel/tire combo (track only). Everything else is minimal but good quality, so I know what you mean.
I can easily do the Hawk DTC70s and Endless fluid with a complete flush very quickly and be ready to go. Ducts would take longer and be more pieces to worry about. Mine also tore up, but I was competing in AutoX (went to Nats), which may have done it. I will only be doing road course with occasional drag, but I don't have to add them right away. It seems the fluid and DTC70s will be an immediate bump up considering I already have SS lines and slotted rotors. I'm only concerned I may want to do new rotors, since these are 4 years old (not many miles, though).
Btw, this has been a great thread, and I appreciate all of the excellent feedback. I haven't been the recipient of much information over the years, so it is much appreciated.
Aug 22, 2011, 06:00 PM
#32
i used Endless brake fluid and now i am using motul.
I do think both is very capable , if your rest of the set up is matched well, you will find both fluid sufficient for your needs with no limits basically.
i would use CL brake pads over anything. I used hawk - endless - project mu etc. pads, but so far and i am serious the Carbon Lorriene is the king of all in racing
http://www.essexparts.com/brake-pads...akes/compounds
I do think both is very capable , if your rest of the set up is matched well, you will find both fluid sufficient for your needs with no limits basically.
i would use CL brake pads over anything. I used hawk - endless - project mu etc. pads, but so far and i am serious the Carbon Lorriene is the king of all in racing
http://www.essexparts.com/brake-pads...akes/compounds
Aug 22, 2011, 08:17 PM
#34
Yeah, getsideways, consider yourself lucky that you didn't know me previously.
One thing is that I also have always been about simplicity and bang-for-the-buck. Back in the day, I had a little Warrtalon mod package that was very cheap and simple but allowed me to hit 12.1 in the 1/4 back when 12.1 was actually impressive (before IXs existed). Even after that, I always have gone with the minimum required. The most expensive things on my car are the suspension and wheel/tire combo (track only). Everything else is minimal but good quality, so I know what you mean.
I can easily do the Hawk DTC70s and Endless fluid with a complete flush very quickly and be ready to go. Ducts would take longer and be more pieces to worry about. Mine also tore up, but I was competing in AutoX (went to Nats), which may have done it. I will only be doing road course with occasional drag, but I don't have to add them right away. It seems the fluid and DTC70s will be an immediate bump up considering I already have SS lines and slotted rotors. I'm only concerned I may want to do new rotors, since these are 4 years old (not many miles, though).
Btw, this has been a great thread, and I appreciate all of the excellent feedback. I haven't been the recipient of much information over the years, so it is much appreciated.
One thing is that I also have always been about simplicity and bang-for-the-buck. Back in the day, I had a little Warrtalon mod package that was very cheap and simple but allowed me to hit 12.1 in the 1/4 back when 12.1 was actually impressive (before IXs existed). Even after that, I always have gone with the minimum required. The most expensive things on my car are the suspension and wheel/tire combo (track only). Everything else is minimal but good quality, so I know what you mean.
I can easily do the Hawk DTC70s and Endless fluid with a complete flush very quickly and be ready to go. Ducts would take longer and be more pieces to worry about. Mine also tore up, but I was competing in AutoX (went to Nats), which may have done it. I will only be doing road course with occasional drag, but I don't have to add them right away. It seems the fluid and DTC70s will be an immediate bump up considering I already have SS lines and slotted rotors. I'm only concerned I may want to do new rotors, since these are 4 years old (not many miles, though).
Btw, this has been a great thread, and I appreciate all of the excellent feedback. I haven't been the recipient of much information over the years, so it is much appreciated.
I've heard good things about DTC 70 , PFC 01, 97,Several raybestos compounds and CL here and there .
If you look at the major players in auto racing as in winning companies ENDLESS and PFC have a sick reputation and im not talking SCCA stuff , think really big.
Glad to hear your theory on modding your car is solid the factory got a lot right with our cars we just have to make them a little better!
Last edited by getsideways; Aug 22, 2011 at 08:41 PM. Reason: cant spell
Aug 23, 2011, 01:55 PM
#35
i did put up the link ... LOL
Being serious, the CL what i have are destroys both in feed back and grip the endless and others, what i have used before. The Endless was specially made for us , with our specs for rally and so. Some even say they like PFC better then CL since they are not that aggressive...
Which is can be translated to not as grippy as the CL... But that can be a wrong tire choice or other factors.
About CL:
The cold bite is great and as they warm up they become very friendly and easy to understand . But at the same time the stopping power when you need it is enormous. Basically you need a tire upgrade if you running something harder. This pads will stop the wheels with no question asked
Also my set up is loud and sqeeks until they get hot. But that is not a problem since my car is not a dd and my pads are not really designed for DD.
I am using the RC8 pads front and RC6 rear.
I have also a little feed back on the essexparts page with others, so if you interested they are here:
http://www.essexparts.com/brake-pads...s/cl-customers
Being serious, the CL what i have are destroys both in feed back and grip the endless and others, what i have used before. The Endless was specially made for us , with our specs for rally and so. Some even say they like PFC better then CL since they are not that aggressive...
Which is can be translated to not as grippy as the CL... But that can be a wrong tire choice or other factors.
About CL:
The cold bite is great and as they warm up they become very friendly and easy to understand . But at the same time the stopping power when you need it is enormous. Basically you need a tire upgrade if you running something harder. This pads will stop the wheels with no question asked
Also my set up is loud and sqeeks until they get hot. But that is not a problem since my car is not a dd and my pads are not really designed for DD.
I am using the RC8 pads front and RC6 rear.
I have also a little feed back on the essexparts page with others, so if you interested they are here:
http://www.essexparts.com/brake-pads...s/cl-customers
Sep 7, 2011, 08:15 AM
#36
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Warrtalon,
Give me a call if you need some assistance with options on the AP Racing system we sell. I have an array of excellent pads at my disposal depending on your needs. Some of the more popular with our system are:
Ferodo DS1.11
CL Brakes RC8, RC6e, RC6
I also have a brand new Ferodo compound they're calling DS-UNO (also known as their Z compound). We've put it on some pro racecars in the past couple of months and everyone is saying it's the business.
Finally, we have a number of outstanding brake fluids on the shelf. We have AP Racing Super 600 (very comparable to Motul RBF600), AP PRF (used by all of the NASCAR teams), Endless RF-650 (used by factory Porsche racers and some F1), and a new Ferodo Super Formula which is proving to also be an outstanding performer.
Give me a call and I'll get you set up with everything you need.
704-824-6030
We have everything in stock and could have it all on a truck heading your way this afternoon.
Thanks to everyone else for your continued support. We really appreciate it.
I'm very pleased that the products we're providing the community are serving you so well!
Give me a call if you need some assistance with options on the AP Racing system we sell. I have an array of excellent pads at my disposal depending on your needs. Some of the more popular with our system are:
Ferodo DS1.11
CL Brakes RC8, RC6e, RC6
I also have a brand new Ferodo compound they're calling DS-UNO (also known as their Z compound). We've put it on some pro racecars in the past couple of months and everyone is saying it's the business.
Finally, we have a number of outstanding brake fluids on the shelf. We have AP Racing Super 600 (very comparable to Motul RBF600), AP PRF (used by all of the NASCAR teams), Endless RF-650 (used by factory Porsche racers and some F1), and a new Ferodo Super Formula which is proving to also be an outstanding performer.
Give me a call and I'll get you set up with everything you need.
704-824-6030
We have everything in stock and could have it all on a truck heading your way this afternoon.
Thanks to everyone else for your continued support. We really appreciate it.
I'm very pleased that the products we're providing the community are serving you so well!
Last edited by JRitt@essex; Sep 7, 2011 at 08:21 AM. Reason: Corrected links!
Sep 7, 2011, 08:46 AM
#37
Warrtalon,
You mentioned the car feeling unstable at 120mph on the brakes.
Do you have rear trailing link bushings installed? If not the Poly bushing... Robi sells an aluminum bushing. The factory bushing's deflection causes the rear wheels to tow out under braking.
I haven't tried too many pads on the track, but I was really happy with the Raybestos ST43's.
(I run Girodisc 2pc rotors, Girodisc Ti shims, Girodisc SS lines, & RBF600 fluid) Martin @ Girodisc is local to me and a great guy to deal with. The Essex guys are also a great resource IMO.
(Jared) Jid2 can get you a really cool stainless steel brake duct inlet/bracket type dealio that makes brake ducting a breeze.
You mentioned the car feeling unstable at 120mph on the brakes.
Do you have rear trailing link bushings installed? If not the Poly bushing... Robi sells an aluminum bushing. The factory bushing's deflection causes the rear wheels to tow out under braking.
I haven't tried too many pads on the track, but I was really happy with the Raybestos ST43's.
(I run Girodisc 2pc rotors, Girodisc Ti shims, Girodisc SS lines, & RBF600 fluid) Martin @ Girodisc is local to me and a great guy to deal with. The Essex guys are also a great resource IMO.
(Jared) Jid2 can get you a really cool stainless steel brake duct inlet/bracket type dealio that makes brake ducting a breeze.
Sep 7, 2011, 08:57 AM
#38
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You've got most stuff covered by others but I'll add a few things.
BBK's won't necessarily gain you braking torque, rather they will be more efficient heat sinks. I don't think you need one in your case. Good pads, fluid and ducting should be all you need.
I like the ST43's I use. I wouldn't use Performance Friction or CL. CL is known to crumble apart the pad material and I have personally had probably 6 or 7 PF pads break off from the backing plate.
Fluid: Castrol SRF, best fluid you can buy period.
For aero, it all depends on your budget. DHP if $$$$, Home Depot and APR if $. You can make a splitter out of alumalite or birchwood.
BBK's won't necessarily gain you braking torque, rather they will be more efficient heat sinks. I don't think you need one in your case. Good pads, fluid and ducting should be all you need.
I like the ST43's I use. I wouldn't use Performance Friction or CL. CL is known to crumble apart the pad material and I have personally had probably 6 or 7 PF pads break off from the backing plate.
Fluid: Castrol SRF, best fluid you can buy period.
For aero, it all depends on your budget. DHP if $$$$, Home Depot and APR if $. You can make a splitter out of alumalite or birchwood.
Last edited by Boltz.; Sep 7, 2011 at 04:09 PM.
Jul 6, 2014, 09:44 AM
#40
Resurrecting this. Awesome thread (awesome for me anyway). I actually didn't get to incorporate these items yet due to head issues (later determined to be a lot of different items with damage) and then moving cross-country again. However, the ole MR has a rebuilt head and is ready to roll. It has been 3 years since getting all of these suggestions, but the overall theme was: get better pads and great fluid. I'm starting with those two. As I get back in the saddle and get the feel of things again, I'll worry about better rotors, adding shims, and possibly adding ducting.
Is Essex still a great place to go? I'm going to call Jeff to see if he's still there.
It looks like I have Hawk HT-10s. Is there a reason to not use those in lieu of the suggested DTC-70s?
Is Essex still a great place to go? I'm going to call Jeff to see if he's still there.
It looks like I have Hawk HT-10s. Is there a reason to not use those in lieu of the suggested DTC-70s?
Jul 6, 2014, 10:16 AM
#41
i'm with those that say to upgrade your pads. i have a full-weight '06 MR that i do HPDE with. i run Hawk DTC 60, 70, and CL pads; all of them work great. i have yet to find a need for a BBK. just my opinion and experience, though. any of the lesser hawk pads are not going to hold up.
**edit of course while using a VERY good brake fluid, which i change each season. ti shims would be pretty nice, though, along with a two piece rotor. those two items should help with the heat.
and how in heck did you run an 11.5 with 335whp???
**edit of course while using a VERY good brake fluid, which i change each season. ti shims would be pretty nice, though, along with a two piece rotor. those two items should help with the heat.
and how in heck did you run an 11.5 with 335whp???
Last edited by kaj; Jul 6, 2014 at 10:19 AM.
Jul 6, 2014, 01:43 PM
#43
i'm with those that say to upgrade your pads. i have a full-weight '06 MR that i do HPDE with. i run Hawk DTC 60, 70, and CL pads; all of them work great. i have yet to find a need for a BBK. just my opinion and experience, though. any of the lesser hawk pads are not going to hold up.
**edit of course while using a VERY good brake fluid, which i change each season. ti shims would be pretty nice, though, along with a two piece rotor. those two items should help with the heat.
and how in heck did you run an 11.5 with 335whp???
**edit of course while using a VERY good brake fluid, which i change each season. ti shims would be pretty nice, though, along with a two piece rotor. those two items should help with the heat.
and how in heck did you run an 11.5 with 335whp???
DynoDynamics reads low, and that was uncorrected (I just use/show the raw numbers, not the corrections). Fastest MPH was 120-121 and most were 119. This particular MPH was lower than average, but it had the best 60' and 330' (and the rest of the distances, of course).
Jul 6, 2014, 03:16 PM
#45
Weight is around 3075 empty, and it's probably not terribly far from 400whp on a DynoJet. I would expect closer to 124-125mph with 450whp, but weight plays a big part.
You'd do a lot lower than 11.7 AND higher than 119mph with a launch. 11.7 without a launch is a pretty fast car.