1-Way vs 1.5-Way Rear Differentials
Apr 2, 2019, 12:58 PM
#166
Evolved Member
Dallas,
Nice description for what is going around the corner! I agree with all the points in there.
Going back to the previous text, I just don't believe that using off the throttle is the best way to achieve all of the rotation that is needed to make it though the turn! The part that I don't like is for even having off throttle section. You get in under heavy braking and as soon as you are done with that part, you are back on throttle - there is no off the throttle section there. For, RWD or FWD perhaps there will be that phase out there especially for longer corners. But, for cars like EVO that have all these gadgets to help with car rotation build in, I don't believe there should be much of the off throttle in there and especially not to tune for it!
Nice description for what is going around the corner! I agree with all the points in there.
Going back to the previous text, I just don't believe that using off the throttle is the best way to achieve all of the rotation that is needed to make it though the turn! The part that I don't like is for even having off throttle section. You get in under heavy braking and as soon as you are done with that part, you are back on throttle - there is no off the throttle section there. For, RWD or FWD perhaps there will be that phase out there especially for longer corners. But, for cars like EVO that have all these gadgets to help with car rotation build in, I don't believe there should be much of the off throttle in there and especially not to tune for it!
Apr 2, 2019, 01:06 PM
#167
Evolved Member
Apr 2, 2019, 03:06 PM
#168
EvoM Guru
thats because you guys arent running and LSD.
With the Cusco LSD in my AYC rear diff it transformed the rotation and stopped submarining on turn in. Circuit racing corners are a slightly different dynamic but I think you guys are missing how important off throttle rotation is.
You brake in a straight line and sometimes trail brake also. u need rotation while trail braking and turning in. if u dont have it youll go straight ahead and get mad understeer. Also if your already on the gas at turn in then something is terribly wrong with driving technique. Also on long sweeping bends (again you probably dont really have this much in autocross) you need off throttle rotation to get the car through the bend at the highest speed possible.
Generally for circuit anyway its brake > off throttle rotate the car in to the apex > hit apex > roll the gas on lining up the exit onto the straight. Should be a similar concept in autocross just probably shorter time frame.
If your using a brake and then accelerate point and shoot method for all corners sounds like your overslowing the car before turn in and theres definately some major gains to be made by upping your corner speed and getting the car to rotate off throttle. again depending on the type of corner of course.
With the Cusco LSD in my AYC rear diff it transformed the rotation and stopped submarining on turn in. Circuit racing corners are a slightly different dynamic but I think you guys are missing how important off throttle rotation is.
You brake in a straight line and sometimes trail brake also. u need rotation while trail braking and turning in. if u dont have it youll go straight ahead and get mad understeer. Also if your already on the gas at turn in then something is terribly wrong with driving technique. Also on long sweeping bends (again you probably dont really have this much in autocross) you need off throttle rotation to get the car through the bend at the highest speed possible.
Generally for circuit anyway its brake > off throttle rotate the car in to the apex > hit apex > roll the gas on lining up the exit onto the straight. Should be a similar concept in autocross just probably shorter time frame.
If your using a brake and then accelerate point and shoot method for all corners sounds like your overslowing the car before turn in and theres definately some major gains to be made by upping your corner speed and getting the car to rotate off throttle. again depending on the type of corner of course.
May 23, 2019, 01:00 PM
#169
interesting post from TRE:
Attention OS Giken owners, if you feel there is something missing...you're correct. Let TRE help make your differential work its best. Contact me directly for details at Jon@teamrip.com
May 23, 2019, 01:09 PM
#170
Evolving Member
Still in love with my Giken, Anyone who wants a TRE can buy mine so I can buy a backup OS. I, unlike many, have ran both. I will never go back.
Zack
Zack
May 23, 2019, 01:18 PM
#173
he tagged/shared that comment in relation to this post:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater
May 23, 2019, 02:50 PM
#176
Its on my list of things to upgrade but not till I get a couple other things checked first. I have a feeling my ACD tune is holding pressure at higher steering angles that may be causing my understeer. Need to figure out how to log the ACD pump pressure with solostorm. Should be able to just tap into the existing pressure sensor. Even though I dont know the scale of it, I'll at least get to see what the magnitude of the signal is and when'where it changes.
May 23, 2019, 07:20 PM
#177
That's not how this business works. Just like how tuners don't post up their custom tunes for others to use. There are lots of guys in the gear business, Jon is smart to play his cards close to his chest. There are lots of competitor companies that are a good bit larger than TRE.
The following users liked this post:
kyoo (May 24, 2019)
May 23, 2019, 07:49 PM
#178
That's not how this business works. Just like how tuners don't post up their custom tunes for others to use. There are lots of guys in the gear business, Jon is smart to play his cards close to his chest. There are lots of competitor companies that are a good bit larger than TRE.
I don't need to know how he's doing it, I just want to know what he's doing. One piques my interest, the other makes me think, "Hm, neat. So anyway..."..
Maybe it's because I used to do sales. Maybe it's because we are inundated with "ask me how" click bait these days.
Its probably just me. I want to know what someone is selling me, not a teaser that requires research on my part just to see if I'm interested.
May 23, 2019, 08:16 PM
#179
Would probably be more productive to at least hint at the issue he thinks there is. The reality to me though, does Jon track these or any cars? I honestly dont know. But the guy who's specing the OSG diffs here is a 3x national champ autocrosser and 2018 SCCA driver of the year. He's not a slouch at all and makes his living setting up cars to handle.
Its also important to understand that there is a ton of crosstalk in how an evo handles and how to get it to do the right thing and when. Diffs, ACD, springs, shocks, bars, bump steer, ride height (CG and RC change at diff rates F/R) are all interlinked and its real easy to blame or contribute the handling differences to one thing when it could be something completely different.
Im a big fan of TRE and know they make some of if not the best builds for us. But this is a case where we need perspective and not blind faith.
Its also important to understand that there is a ton of crosstalk in how an evo handles and how to get it to do the right thing and when. Diffs, ACD, springs, shocks, bars, bump steer, ride height (CG and RC change at diff rates F/R) are all interlinked and its real easy to blame or contribute the handling differences to one thing when it could be something completely different.
Im a big fan of TRE and know they make some of if not the best builds for us. But this is a case where we need perspective and not blind faith.
May 23, 2019, 11:10 PM
#180
Evolved Member
If anything, you're car would work better with the unlocking of the OG compared to OEM style with preload since it seems to roll much less and keep that inside working more through a turn. So while I'm trying to unload that since the back of the car is just along for the ride, you're able to use it.
Its on my list of things to upgrade but not till I get a couple other things checked first. I have a feeling my ACD tune is holding pressure at higher steering angles that may be causing my understeer. Need to figure out how to log the ACD pump pressure with solostorm. Should be able to just tap into the existing pressure sensor. Even though I dont know the scale of it, I'll at least get to see what the magnitude of the signal is and when'where it changes.
Its on my list of things to upgrade but not till I get a couple other things checked first. I have a feeling my ACD tune is holding pressure at higher steering angles that may be causing my understeer. Need to figure out how to log the ACD pump pressure with solostorm. Should be able to just tap into the existing pressure sensor. Even though I dont know the scale of it, I'll at least get to see what the magnitude of the signal is and when'where it changes.