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When I talked to Michael from Forced Performance, the oil pressure should not be over 100psi and should be fed from the Oil filter housing (at the time when I bought my FP black BB Turbo which came with the uprated oil lines to feed the turbo from the Oil filter housing.
As known the BB Turbo from FP dose not need a lot of oil and i comes with the black oil restriction as previously mentioned.
Occasionally do not forget to disassemble the oil restriction and clean the cone micron filter inside or replace if needed.
When I talked to Michael from Forced Performance, the oil pressure should not be over 100psi and should be fed from the Oil filter housing (at the time when I bought my FP black BB Turbo which came with the uprated oil lines to feed the turbo from the Oil filter housing.
As known the BB Turbo from FP dose not need a lot of oil and i comes with the black oil restriction as previously mentioned.
Occasionally do not forget to disassemble the oil restriction and clean the cone micron filter inside or replace if needed.
Thanks Guys! Very good info here. I'm using the Map oil feed line kit for my jb FP black. It comes with an XRP -4an filter with a .125" opening in it from either side just like fp recommends for "full flow." Looks like either setup whether bought from fp or map does very little restricting for jb turbos.
I finally finished my crank case pressure work! It was a pain in the *** that's for sure. Now my oil cap gets sucked down when it's about to touch the valve cover. Good vacuum from the intake mani.
Things smell alot better this way. I wont know if it fixed the oil consumption issue until later.
I choose but a different way and did not want my FP Black to be the source of vacuum and sucking all the mist and gunk-fumes in the IC and intake.
Have a VTA OCC for now but will put the Crankcase hose in to the exhaust over a 10AN PCV.
will see how it will turn out
just need around 3"/Hg
Last edited by Kevin Troy; Apr 1, 2017 at 12:30 PM.
I choose but a different way and did not want my FP Black to be the source of vacuum and sucking all the mist and gunk-fumes in the IC and intake.
Have a VTA OCC for now but will put the Crankcase hose in to the exhaust over a 10AN PCV.
will see how it will turn out
just need around 3"/Hg
Thanks Kevin! Using the exhaust to suck out crank case pressure is the best solution and I think you will have great success in it. I don't think anybody should have crank case pressure issues after that. I'll know after today if my oil problems have been fixed. My next oil change will be VR1 10w40 to hopefully lower oil pressure.
So my car is still consuming oil even after fixing the crank case pressure issues.
I did a compression test today and the numbers were very close to one another. Throttle body closed or open didn't make a difference.
121-124-121-126
4% 4% 1% 4%
I'm not even sure if these numbers are accurate to be honest since I used a cheap compression tester, but they are all within 4% of each other. The engine was warm, but the cams are aggressive so bear in mind the overlap. I also did a leak down test using the OTC cylinder leakage tester.
I investigated further and found the reason (hopefully) I was losing so much oil.
Oil on top of pistons! The exhaust valve guides were replaced by Boostin Performance when the head went in for porting. This leads me to believe that the valve stem seals are toast and I think for a reason I already discussed in this thread. The retainers smashing the top of the valve stem seals over time because I used the wrong spring retainer setup for my GSC R2 cams. IF anybody thinks it can be anything else, please share as I am out of ideas.
Everybody talks about how oil on top of pistons can indicate bad valve stem seals or bad valve guides, but they don't talk about why for those who are still learning (like me).
What happens is this: The valve guide acts as the sleeve for the valve to move up and down in. When the valve guide goes bad and begins to wear out, your valves get side to side play which doesn't help them seat perfectly on the valve port. At the same time it stretches and ovals the valve stem seal hole up the other end that regulates the passage of oil to lube the valve guide in the first place. At high RPM, heat, strain, this causes a lot more oil to pass down into the valve guide than needed and into the combustion chamber.
Looks like i'll be going with GSC's recommendations from now on. I just hope that this is a simple valve stem seal and spring/retainer swap fix
When R2's first came out, chamellieon did some testing with them on supertech duals, but may not have kept them in long enough to see an issue. I didn't burn oil until wayyy after break in and tuning. Somewhere along the 2000 miles mark.
Rany, do you have a check valve somewhere in the lines going to the intake manifold? You don't want the crank case to see boost pressure from the manifold..
And that sucks on the valve springs. At least they can be changed in the car. And I'm sure your guides are fine.
Rany, do you have a check valve somewhere in the lines going to the intake manifold? You don't want the crank case to see boost pressure from the manifold..
And that sucks on the valve springs. At least they can be changed in the car. And I'm sure your guides are fine.
Hey Sean,
Hope all is well buddy,
Yes, I used a large check valve in between the catch can and the intake manifold to allow for vacuum to suck air out of the valve cover, but close under boost. As a result my idle shot up 500 rpm since it's sucking air in from the larger valve cover opening, but I adjusted it back down to 1000 using the BISS screw. I just didn't want to place another check valve into that pathway because it restricts airflow quite a bit even when it's open.
Very true about the valve springs. My GF is on vacation visiting her family this week so I should have time to change them out very soon. lol
As I have been reading once again through your garage and specification and compare it with my very similar setup I'm now a bit more confused about the fallowing detail;
You have those Billet GSC R2 cams which are pretty aggressive and have a high valve lift. Which is 12mm. My Kelford 272 have 11mm valve lift. Yet, I have 145PSI in compression test (all four cyl.) but you have a bit less, like 120 psi on all four.
I have 2.3 stroker forget JE pistons with CR 8,5. What are your stroker Wiseco's CR ratings?
In my setup are also +1mm Ferrea Valves and Kiggly beehive springs and titanium retainers.
Confidence should give you that the compression test is almost equal in all 4 cyl.
Do I need to say that I'm fallowing your project?
Last edited by Kevin Troy; Apr 6, 2017 at 09:13 AM.
Yes, I used a large check valve in between the catch can and the intake manifold to allow for vacuum to suck air out of the valve cover, but close under boost. As a result my idle shot up 500 rpm since it's sucking air in from the larger valve cover opening, but I adjusted it back down to 1000 using the BISS screw. I just didn't want to place another check valve into that pathway because it restricts airflow quite a bit even when it's open.
Very true about the valve springs. My GF is on vacation visiting her family this week so I should have time to change them out very soon. lol
Yeah, everything great. Glad you got the crank case vent stuff dialed in. You'll probably notice the engine feeling freer to rev the next time you drive it.
As far as your compression results at 120. What CR is your engine? Keep in mind the Mivec engines do read a bit lower, but 120psi is kind of low unless MAP built you an 8:1 motor.
As I have been reading once again through your garage and specification and compare it with my very similar setup I'm now a bit more confused about the fallowing detail;
You have those Billet GSC R2 cams which are pretty aggressive and have a high valve lift. Which is 12mm. My Kelford 272 have 11mm valve lift. Yet, I have 145PSI in compression test (all four cyl.) but you have a bit less, like 120 psi on all four.
I have 2.3 stroker forget JE pistons with CR 8,5. What are your stroker Wiseco's CR ratings?
In my setup are also +1mm Ferrea Valves and Kiggly beehive springs and titanium retainers.
Confidence should give you that the compression test is almost equal in all 4 cyl.
Do I need to say that I'm fallowing your project?
Hmm, that's a good point and i'm glad you mentioned this. The pistons used are the Wiseco 9.2:1 shelf stock that they have. Part # WIS 6627M855AP. It could be that my compression tester is bad and isn't giving me the proper numbers. The car pulls hard even on 91 haha. Thank you for following my build, I like to brainstorm with members.
Originally Posted by letsgetthisdone
Yeah, everything great. Glad you got the crank case vent stuff dialed in. You'll probably notice the engine feeling freer to rev the next time you drive it.
As far as your compression results at 120. What CR is your engine? Keep in mind the Mivec engines do read a bit lower, but 120psi is kind of low unless MAP built you an 8:1 motor.
Yeah, I can already feel a difference! It feels a bit more responsive and sounds better than before. I wrote an email to Aaron today about all the issues with my car and why it's delaying my data logs haha. Nature of the beast I suppose.
Also if I find out that MAP built me a 8:1 motor instead of the 9.2:1 I was promised, I'll take my shoe off and throw it from Cali to there door in Minnesota. I'm leaning towards it being my crappy compression tester. I need to dig up the block blueprint and post it here
I agree, viewing the build from different angles and perspective is important.
Either the compression tester is faulty
or
you have an 8.0:1 built engine instead of 9,2:1
or
the engine is not (properly) bedded in yet.
As mentioned, you should get bigger compression because of the aggressive cams you have because more air get in when the valves open (WOT important while testing).
But first I'd check the compression tester and test with a better one if you are suspicions about it.
Last edited by Kevin Troy; Apr 7, 2017 at 02:12 AM.
Guys, I finally finished swapping out the Supertech dual valve springs, seats, retainers, and valve stem seals that come with the BP stage 3 head, for GSC 5041 Beehive springs, seats, retainers, and valve stem seals. The process was lengthy and painful, but i'm glad it's over with. I did it over the course of two days, taking a break only to go drive nitro rc cars with a friend.
Things to keep in mind:
1. The rope method works great as long as you cram enough nylon roap into each cylinder. Do 2 cylinders at a time with each end of the rope to save time.
2. Cover all oil return holes in the head when working on that particular section so you don't drop a keeper inside. I dropped a keeper inside my front bumper and had to remove my entire bumper to get it out. Not fun to do for a stupid little piece of metal.
3. The Euroexport valve spring compressor tool is one of the best tools I have ever used in my life. It comes with a magnetic flat head screw driver with a strong magnet on one end and sticky grease to hold the keepers with when you place them between the retainer and valve. The only downside is that the adapter it comes with has a very tight tolerance for evo valves. As such, it fit the retainer of the supertech duals perfectly, but the circumference of the GSC retainers was a couple thousands too large and had a tendency to carve at the aluminum adapter in the tool. It still worked fine, you just had to be extra careful.
4. Check your valve guides for excessive play by wiggling the valve stem side to side. This will tell you how screwed you actually are.
5. Press the valve stem seals in using a socket and hand power first, then tap with a hammer to confirm their seating. I used assembly lube on the holes so they don't go in dry. Nobody likes a dry hole.
I measured the difference in overall thickness of each sets retainers, but that won't really tell us too much about valve stem seal clearance. I just did it for fun.
Now that that's over, time will tell if my oil consumption issue is actually gone. Wish me luck guys.
Apr 1, 2017, 12:17 AM
lol
